How Mogu Make More

2 Pandaren Priest
0
So this game's lore generally has holes big enough to drive a cement mixer through, but this one's pretty funny. And glaring, seeing as how it directly pertains to 5.2's lore.

Ok, so we know mogu are mortal; they were titan constructs and were afflicted by the Curse of Flesh (1). We also know they reproduce and have offspring/families (2). Mogu also have a finite lifespan, unlike draenei; Lei Shen is explicitly stated to have died of old age (3). So mogu are born, live, reproduce, and die, just like most other humanoids. No big deal, right? Except for one thing.

There are no women. Unlike kobolds, gnolls, ogres, etc, where we can just assume the females exist (either off-screen, or are physically identical to males unless you lift the loincloth), it's stated that there aren't any mogu women - "The Twin Consorts are said to be greatest of the Thunder King's treasures. Rumored to be the only known female mogu in existence, Lei Shen keeps his trophies close and their combined arsenal against interlopers closer." (4) Savvy readers will note the weasel words "rumored" and "known," but this is cliche fantasy land, where All Rumors Are True. So Lei Shen was a jealous pimp and killed all the other women and kept two for himself? A little weird, but I guess that works. Also, each time we kill this boss, we're condemning the mogu race to extinction for a few epics (isn't being a hero great?!)

Except that's not the case, because - "Players may have noticed the complete absence of any female mogu in their exploration of the continent of Pandaria. Players who look closely at the models of these celestial twins will note that they seem quite literally carved out of stone. Indeed, these were specifically created by Lei Shen and empowered to serve and guard him, and they are a direct reflection of his will rather than any broader sense of mogu culture as a whole." (5) So, the two female mogu aren't even real mogu, they're just constructs. Fun trivia for the raiders - the penultimate fight of Throne of Thunder is versus the Thunder King's sex toys.

So it's been at least 10,000 years since Lei Shen died (his palace was sunk by the Sundering (6)), and the mogu have been doing Elune-knows-what since then. But, presumably, their lifespan is less than that. And since there are no women, how have the mogu been breeding; hell, how did they do it before the Sundering? The only thing I can think of is that they're some sort of high-functioning planarian worm. Either they bud and create new mogu, or each mogu has, erm, both parts and one is chosen to carry the offspring. The second theory actually kinda fits their warlike and combative culture. Since each mogu has the potential to make more, there would be a lot of competition to have the honor of bearing children to carry on the legacy of a particular mogu.

So there ya go, folks, mogu are hermaphroditic. You may now sleep easy, knowing that this incredibly important question has been answered.

Sources!
1. http://www.wowhead.com/object=218437
2. http://www.wowhead.com/object=218431
3. http://www.gamebreaker.tv/mmorpg/gamebreaker-interviews-blizzards-dave-kosak-on-patch-5-2-the-thunder-king/
4. Dungeon Journal - Twin Consorts
5. http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/8778639/Patch_52_Raid_Preview_Throne_of_Thunder-2_25_2013
6. http://www.wowhead.com/object=218432
Reply Quote
100 Night Elf Hunter
18025
I think you may be wrong. Mogu were stone robots that got the curse of the flesh. I think they just make more robots or use "flesh shaping" to make more Mogu. The thunder king did craft 2 ladies for himself cause he saw other races doing it.
Reply Quote
99 Troll Hunter
13620
The Mogu are able to reproduce with their magic. They enfuse their souls with bodies crafted by a Terracotta Stone Warrior machine.

They also were affected by the Curse of Flesh, but they reverse engineered it and turned themselves back into stone.

They just make more Mogu the same way the Titans made more Mogu. After all, the Titans left all their wonderful toys behind for the Mogu to play with.
Reply Quote
2 Pandaren Priest
0
The mogu didn't take up spiritbinding until after the failure of the saurok (1), which was generations after Lei Shen's reign. And while they did practice flesh-shaping in earnest while he was King (as evidenced by the raid bosses), nowhere does it mention they used the magic to make more mogu. It is, however, said that flesh and blood was used to 'extend the lives of those loyal to the emperor (2).' So it seems that flesh-crafting was used to make slaves or as a reward to noteworthy subjects (this could explain Iron Qon's presence), rather than a primary means of reproduction.

1. http://www.wowhead.com/object=213333
2. http://www.wowhead.com/object=213331
Reply Quote
90 Human Rogue
7765
Because the people that wrote those tomes of knowledge really had full understanding of everything that happened in the past as it exactly was and didn't exaggerate or make up anything to fill any potential holes that might arise from a lack of proper historical documentation.

You do know that the Pandaren had to fight a brutal war against the Mogu for independence and its likely everything was passed down through word of mouth as much of history could be lost to battles if ever written in parchment or stone.
Reply Quote
99 Troll Hunter
13620
The mogu didn't take up spiritbinding until after the failure of the saurok (1), which was generations after Lei Shen's reign. And while they did practice flesh-shaping in earnest while he was King (as evidenced by the raid bosses), nowhere does it mention they used the magic to make more mogu. It is, however, said that flesh and blood was used to 'extend the lives of those loyal to the emperor (2).' So it seems that flesh-crafting was used to make slaves or as a reward to noteworthy subjects (this could explain Iron Qon's presence), rather than a primary means of reproduction.

And yet we had a machine in Mogu'shan Vaults which had the sole purpose of pumping out Mogu, being guarded by the Mogu and operated by the Mogu.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Hunter
5605
03/19/2013 01:59 PMPosted by Pyronaptor
The mogu didn't take up spiritbinding until after the failure of the saurok (1), which was generations after Lei Shen's reign. And while they did practice flesh-shaping in earnest while he was King (as evidenced by the raid bosses), nowhere does it mention they used the magic to make more mogu. It is, however, said that flesh and blood was used to 'extend the lives of those loyal to the emperor (2).' So it seems that flesh-crafting was used to make slaves or as a reward to noteworthy subjects (this could explain Iron Qon's presence), rather than a primary means of reproduction.

And yet we had a machine in Mogu'shan Vaults which had the sole purpose of pumping out Mogu, being guarded by the Mogu and operated by the Mogu.


That Lei Shen locked away and the pandaren secured before the mogu could use it.
Reply Quote
2 Pandaren Priest
0
They also were affected by the Curse of Flesh, but they reverse engineered it and turned themselves back into stone.


They did? I can't find any evidence of this in lore or quest text. Could you provide a source, please?

As for the Engine of Nalak'sha, the lore text for Will of the Emperor states - 'The core chamber of the vaults is protected by stone soldiers who have been motionless for centuries. They are row upon row of warriors, statues armed for a battle that never began.' The Titan device creates more robot mogu, not the living flesh-and-blood type to which Lei Shen belongs.

In addition, Ra-Den's lore states - 'Lei Shen's life changed forever when he stumbled into a dark chamber below what are now the Mogu'shan Vaults. Legend has it he found an ancient titan keeper guarding a miraculous device known as the Engine of Nalak'sha. No one knows what transpired between the two beings, but Lei Shen later emerged from the site bristling with the power to forge an empire. The keeper's fate -- and his current whereabouts -- remain a mystery.' Lei Shen found the Engine of Nalak'sha in the first place. His lore (see above sources) states he had a father and brothers during the "Age of a Hundred Kings."

At no point are female mogu mentioned. And given snippet regarding Twin Consorts by Ion Hazzikostas, their absence seems to be intentional. So somehow between the Curse of Flesh and Lei Shen's reign, the mogu were breeding. Maybe once Lei Shen took over, he saw other races with separate sexes and thought, "Yeah, I gotta get me some of that," and had his toys made.
Reply Quote
100 Blood Elf Paladin
9590
I'm pretty sure female Mogu exist.

They're probably hanging out wherever the entire rest of their race hid for ten-thousand + years.
Reply Quote
90 Orc Warrior
10700
I'm pretty sure female Mogu exist.

They're probably hanging out wherever the entire rest of their race hid for ten-thousand + years.
Well I'm certain we have pretty made sure no female Mogu exists now as we've killed the only two rumored to exist. Judging by their description they were the only two.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/zone/throne-of-thunder/twin-consorts
Reply Quote
100 Blood Elf Paladin
9590
I'm pretty sure female Mogu exist.

They're probably hanging out wherever the entire rest of their race hid for ten-thousand + years.
Well I'm certain we have pretty made sure no female Mogu exists now as we've killed the only two rumored to exist. Judging by their description they were the only two.

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/zone/throne-of-thunder/twin-consorts


Rumored to be the only known


I'm guessing the specific inclusion of these words isn't an accident.
Reply Quote
2 Pandaren Priest
0
I'm pretty sure female Mogu exist.

They're probably hanging out wherever the entire rest of their race hid for ten-thousand + years.


The mogu are just one huge plot hole, aren't they? That's what I always assumed, too, until 5.2 hit and Blizz went "Hur dur there aren't any."

As for the weasel words in Twin Consorts lore, they're definitely there to give Blizz an out if this topic ever came up. It's far more fun to ignore that and debate, though. If there were female mogu 'back in the day' then why would the specific legend about "these are the only two female mogu" come to be? Lei Shen could've had the rest killed, but you'd think the legends (if scanty and unreliable) would remember that, especially given how angsty the pandas get over mogu. Also, Ion stated that the female mogu were constructs, so it seems more likely that Lei Shen used the Engine of Nalak'sha to make some special consorts for himself.
Reply Quote
99 Troll Hunter
13620
Can someone find the damn twitter post? I just went all up and down Kosak's twitter with the line about the Mogu and the Curse of Flesh.
Reply Quote
95 Undead Death Knight
9320
03/19/2013 02:22 PMPosted by Rinaki
At no point are female mogu mentioned.
Sparkmancer Vu's epitaph mentions that his relationship with Lei Shen was the source of in-universe fanfiction in their time, including a famous saga about their feud over a woman.

It's likely that fleshy female mogu existed back in the day, but once they figured out soul binding the need for a womb was outmoded and all the female souls were transferred into male-like stone bodies as they died until no physical females remained.
Reply Quote
100 Blood Elf Paladin
9590
At no point are female mogu mentioned.
Sparkmancer Vu's epitaph mentions that his relationship with Lei Shen was the source of in-universe fanfiction in their time, including a famous saga about their feud over a woman.

It's likely that fleshy female mogu existed back in the day, but once they figured out soul binding the need for a womb was outmoded and all the female souls were transferred into male-like stone bodies as they died until no physical females remained.


The problem is, the Mogu have been AFK for over ten-thousand years. Where did they get all the stone bodies from? Not to mention, flesh-and-bone Mogu exist now, so they must have come from SOMEWHERE.
Edited by Veloran on 3/19/2013 3:48 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Hunter
5605
Going to quote myself:

03/12/2013 03:27 PMPosted by Pumlaxer

Source for that?

My interpretation is that Lei Shen saw other, fleshy races with females and was all "I should get me some of those" so he had them made: but female mogu do not exist naturally.


http://www.wowpedia.org/Trial_of_the_King#Shared

http://www.wowpedia.org/Sparkmancer_Vu

http://www.wowhead.com/quest=32715/requiem-for-a-queen (maybe removed, I do not know)


But we know mogu don't breed. They're made in Mogu'shan vaults.


I interpreted the mogu made there as an army of automatons that were locked away and never released.

http://www.wowpedia.org/Victory_in_Kun-Lai

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/zone/mogushan-vaults/

We do have some mogu being the sons of other mogu.

http://www.wowpedia.org/The_Lost_Dynasty

http://www.wowpedia.org/Lei_Shen_%28object%29
Reply Quote
100 Blood Elf Rogue
9970
Easiest explaination for the lack of Mogu women in the modern world while history strongly implies that Mogu women had to exist in the past in order for their to be a species:

The Mogu are an extreme patriarchal society. Therefore, women are viewed as property and not full citizens. Once the Mogu mastered Spirit Binding they either A: did not bind the souls of Mogu women since they were unworthy or B: only made statues of the male Mogu form since it was "the most worthy" and simply bound each and every spirit into one of those.
Reply Quote
90 Undead Warlock
11105
Because mogu reproduction has to be through sexual intercourse, it's not like they've created a whole race called the saurok from weapons and were originally made from stone.

And once again we know that the Baby Jesus and the Virgin Mary /cough I mean the Holy Light and Elune would frown upon anything having to deal with sex, families, or children that didn't involve having women around.

I'm not sure how ignorant this debate actually is, but yeah... there's a shocking amount of narrowmindedness in this thread, which I replied with a shocking amount of sarcasm.
Reply Quote
100 Blood Elf Paladin
9590
And once again we know that the Baby Jesus and the Virgin Mary /cough I mean the Holy Light and Elune would frown upon anything having to deal with sex, families, or children that didn't involve having women around.


Somebody doesn't know how Cenarius came to be.

......... Or what the Light is. Or Elune, really.
Reply Quote
90 Undead Warlock
11105
03/19/2013 08:42 PMPosted by Veloran
And once again we know that the Baby Jesus and the Virgin Mary /cough I mean the Holy Light and Elune would frown upon anything having to deal with sex, families, or children that didn't involve having women around.


Somebody doesn't know how Cenarius came to be.

......... Or what the Light is. Or Elune, really.


I replied with a shocking amount of sarcasm.


I like when I can quote myself word for word and it make sense. =D
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]