My concern for "No more 5 mans planned"

90 Orc Shaman
8675
I'm sure everyone has there own opinions on why its good or why its bad but this is what im mostly concerned about.

Playing my Alts.

Raids can be done once a week but 5 mans can be done over and over through the dungeon finder making it easier and faster to gear an alt so I can raid the current level content.

With no more 5 mans planned I'm stuck with LFR, which wouldnt be bad if it wasnt for the fact that if I run say MSV on a fresh alt and get no loot, my ilvl wont increase so I can run HOF/Toes and so on.

And with JP gear being so god awful and useless my only other option is VP gear limiting me to 1 extra peice a week (Maybe 2 if VP costs get cut again)

In short my concern is that without a farmable way to achieve the required minimum ilvl I could end up with bad luck in LFR and end up not getting to do anything else on that new character for weeks.

Drops could be increased but they did that this patch and (it could just be me) I didnt notice anything different.
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90 Human Monk
10075
So what you are saying is you want free epics? It took you time to gear up your main didnt it? its going to take time to gear your alts sorry to say.
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90 Orc Shaman
8675
I could care less about epics. I just want to experience the content on different characters without having to wait 4-6 weeks due to bad luck in old content.
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41 Draenei Hunter
10360
It's really sad that they aren't releasing any new 5mans for MoP. LFR is not a suitable replacement, nor are Scenarios.
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1 Blood Elf Paladin
0
i like dungeons, even if I outgear them. the ICC/DS 5 mans were really well done. if anything, it gives people variety. if you want to cap with dungeons, it's nice to have several different ones. im not crazy about grinding dailies nonstop. that, and you cant really cap with raiding (well, good luck convincing people to do t14 for valor purposes)
Edited by Aeliel on 3/16/2013 6:29 PM PDT
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90 Draenei Shaman
14840
I feel the same about alts, to a degree. I'm also simply upset because I think 5 mans are fun. Scenarios do now have enough people to be as fun as 5 mans, and LFR has far too many. I can find 4 guildies, and we can roll through a dungeons chatting on vent and having a good time, even when it becomes overly easy. LFR, you're often stuck with a lot of subpar (be it in talent or motivation) players who make the experience a miserable one. And scenarios, thus far, I find rather uninteresting and easy. Dungeons also provide a way to try out new specs or rotations with a small, friendly group - something I'm not keen to do in LFR, and which wouldn't be very practical in scenarios, given there is no need for certain roles.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
17350
I actually liked the ZA/ZG addition, gave players something to do to close the gap between item lvls for BWD and BOT etc..

Wiping in LFR and stuff....not my cup of tea.
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90 Orc Warlock
13430
Currently working as intended. Alts are subject to the same rules as new players in the content for the first time. Stance is that just because you did it on a main doesn't mean your alts get instant catch up.

If you're still wiping that much in T14 LFR at this point though, I don't know what to say. Take a break and find more time on Tuesday/Wednesday when the better groups are running?
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90 Undead Warrior
17835
Currently working as intended. Alts are subject to the same rules as new players in the content for the first time. Stance is that just because you did it on a main doesn't mean your alts get instant catch up.


This.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
14040
I actually liked the ZA/ZG addition, gave players something to do to close the gap between item lvls for BWD and BOT etc..

Wiping in LFR and stuff....not my cup of tea.


The grief and common dislike for LFR would be chopped in half if they just made LFR into a 10-man endeavor. There's proven to be too much of a chance for some random schmoe to ruin way more people's time investment without being found and voted out in the hot mess of 25 man entropy. In 10, as the devs are said to be aware, there's plenty more accountability, and they should in theory be even easier to tune for a casual proportion. It'd also be much easier to perceive LFR as the next soft progression step from 5-mans, simply by way of scale. That would make the aesthetic appeal of assembled 25-man raids even more grandiose, since they love those so much.

But nooo, they crunch people's framerate and patience with 25 stooges in an LFR. And nevermind that having a 2-tank/3-healer/5-dps model would make queue times more merciful. >:(
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1 Blood Elf Paladin
0
part of the problem is you can only do LFR once, really. then you are done for the week. at least with dungeons, you can run them daily for chances at stuff, and more dungeons = more variety = not running temple of the jade serpent 900 times. :)
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11000
The gearing thing is just BS. LFR rains 483s from the sky. Why aren't there new five-mans with 476s? There was a lot of love and craft put into the ZA/ZG 5-mans and people just complained about not being able to farm Swift Zulian Tiger anymore, and how hard it was. The development work just isn't going to be put in for so little return, not because they might drop too many purples or whatever
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
10110
03/16/2013 10:06 PMPosted by Mahourai
The gearing thing is just BS. LFR rains 483s from the sky.

16 bosses. 2 Sha kills. 2 Galleon kills. 12 charms. By my count, that's 32 chances at loot, all with the supposedly-improved 5.2 droprate.

2 drops.

Thankfully, I was actually able to use them both. But they're hardly 'raining from the sky' - I'm looking at a 6% droprate on random items - and if they'd been in the wrong slots, I'd have gotten nothing useful all week.

I don't really have a problem with that droprate (my luck in LFD has actually been even worse - I've won one roll on one item that I could equip, and it's not even appropriate for my class) but it is f'ing annoying not to be able to run again.
Edited by Kaeloc on 3/16/2013 10:33 PM PDT
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90 Dwarf Death Knight
17655
new 5 mans with 476 mean all the old 5 mans are useless.
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90 Worgen Mage
20350
I like being showered in Elder Charms as a catchup mechanic. Being able to coin every T14 boss on a fresh 90 is awesome. 5 mans just don't do it for me. IMO, scenarios really get the story across better too and it's always instant queues.
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90 Troll Rogue
21045
The development work just isn't going to be put in for so little return, not because they might drop too many purples or whatever

GC made an interesting point in one of the recent interviews I believe. He said that adding dungeons with a higher tier of gear mid expansion can actually create problems because unless they can add a ton of them (5+) players will very quickly burn out because that small number of dungeons to run.
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90 Blood Elf Warlock
10110
GC made an interesting point in one of the recent interviews I believe. He said that adding dungeons with a higher tier of gear mid expansion can actually create problems because unless they can add a ton of them (5+) players will very quickly burn out because that small number of dungeons to run.

While that is true (and was the main problem with ZA/ZG), what they could do is, along with any new dungeons, release upgraded versions of the expansion's original dungeons with upgraded loot. Since those dungeons were originally designed and itemized for the current expansion, tuning them up should be a relatively simple matter.

It's also possible to do a relatively small number of new dungeons 'right'. They really hit the ball out of the park with the ICC 5-mans, even though there were only 3 of them.

Part of that was just that they were great dungeons (I would kill for upgraded versions of them). It's obviously hard for the creative team to know beforehand whether their new dungeons will be well-received by the community (or else every raid would be as good as Ulduar and every dungeon would be as good as Pit of Saron). So I'm not going to say "just make better content."

Part of it, though, was that, unlike the Cata dungeons, they were in a shared random queue with all the Wrath dungeons, and they all gave the same reward to the emblem farmers; the only reason to try to spam the ICC dungeons specifically was for the gear drops themselves, and since you had to queue specifically to guarantee you'd get them, you were limited to once a day for the heroic versions. That's something they could easily replicate.

The Cata experiment of separate queues failed, so go back to the original (possibly with tuned-up 5.0 dungeons). Don't throw the baby out with the bathwater by eliminating new dungeons entirely.
Edited by Kaeloc on 3/17/2013 2:11 AM PDT
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90 Dwarf Death Knight
15935
The problem is those of us who enjoy running dungeons for the points want some new ones for variety from old ones. But there is the expectation that any new dungeons will have to drop gear which is close to previous raid tiers. This places Blizzard in an awkward position. There must be some way around this though. I think having mid-expansion dungeons is a great idea, and there must be some way to make it work.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
17280
My only problem with this is no new interesting Challenge Modes. I'm excited to see what they do to old instances though...
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