Blizzard, your daily model hurts healers.

100 Human Paladin
13775
03/18/2013 09:29 PMPosted by Jujubiju
Why not use the junk greens or even JP gear or /gasp crafted blue gear for dailies? It's not like you don't have alternatives.


Actually, believe it or not, you'll still manage to do almost as much dps as holy (in decent gear) than ret in junk greens with some pieces of 5 man gear tossed in. Ret is highly dependent on gear scaling.

I have a set of crappy ret gear on my holy pally alt, and when doing dailies as ret I realized my 25k dps was not cutting it, as holy I do 20-30k and one eternal flame keeps me alive. AOE is the issue as holy, but ret in crap gear has it's own issues with aoe in that it takes so much damage. As ret in crap gear, expect to spend quite a lot of holy power on WoG due to how squishy they are. With better gear though, ret starts to scale up quite nicely and those issue wash away, so at that point of course ret will be the best choice by a mile.

Now, on this toon here, my ret gear is more than adequate for doing dailies. I can normally do around 60k dps single target on quest mobs, and he has no problem with aoe pulls. It just doesn't seem to work out as well on my other paladin and trying to use junk ret gear just to get through dailies.
Edited by Bravehearth on 3/18/2013 11:49 PM PDT
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90 Human Priest
17730
I'm disc/holy...I do not do dailies.

I pet battle for lesser charms since 5.2
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100 Dwarf Warrior
14760
Dual specs are nice, unless you're like me and enjoy both PvE and PvP and tend to have one PvE heal spec and one PvP heal spec.

When my resto shaman hit 90 shortly after release, I tried doing the Golden Lotus dailies as resto and holy god it took forever to kill a mob. I gave up after about two days and rarely ever leave the Shrine on my healers.
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90 Worgen Priest
9630
I think what some of you are losing sight of is that the game is supposed to be fun. If you don't enjoy playing a DPS spec then it sucks to be s.o.l. What can you do?

Dungeons did sort of take the "experience" out of the game by gaining rep with tabards and grinding, but I found them far more enjoyable than what the daily grind is now. And no, I didn't play Burning Crusade or Vanilla, so I have no nostalgia concerning them.

My advice to you would be find a group of people (guild, friends, randoms in general, w/e) to run your dailies with. I do them with my husband. I let him pull poop tons of crap that he wouldn't usually be able to without heals and we get them done quickly and efficiently. I don't have a shadow spec nor do I need one. /stubborn :p
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90 Human Monk
13320
reroll monk
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90 Night Elf Druid
15480
03/18/2013 09:09 PMPosted by Friendabull
Druid or Shaman


Because there is no such thing as resto/feral or resto/enhance amiright? >.<

Ret is fun. Much better than it used to be. Oh the days of white hitting things waiting for judgement to come off cd.
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55 Draenei Death Knight
9300
03/18/2013 07:19 PMPosted by Mitimem
Having such a large emphasis on doing daily quests as your main progression model is severely hurting healers. Please stop.

Leveling up and dailys are obviously not designed for healers. We have dual spec for a reason. Every single class has a dps spec. Balancing solo content for the greatest common denominator really is the only choice. If quests were made easier for healers sake, then dps would blast through like it was nothing, in which case it would still be faster to do dailys as a dps, which is exactly as it is now.


Cool let's see how easy it is to maintain a WW and a Mistweaver set both viable for dungeons off of the quest gear. You pick one or the other then fill out your otherspec off of grabbing lewts from dungeons on your mainspec.

Essentially if you are a Mistweaver or a Holy Paladin then you're !@#$ed when it comes to 90 dailies. Trees, Shaman, and Priests use the same gear for at least one of their dps specs.
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90 Pandaren Priest
14930
I wish Holy Pally had AoE of some kind before 90. It's making my own Pally's leveling very, very slow going.

And yea, I not only kill crap on Thunder Isle far more safety and effectively than my Druid's Boomkin spec, but the majority of players I see, DPS included, and my gear isn't even very good. Makes it hard to go to my alts, that's for sure.


Boomkin is just... :S

You're honestly better off going Bear and swiping your way to victory. >.>
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90 Pandaren Priest
14930
Cool let's see how easy it is to maintain a WW and a Mistweaver set both viable for dungeons off of the quest gear. You pick one or the other then fill out your otherspec off of grabbing lewts from dungeons on your mainspec.

Essentially if you are a Mistweaver or a Holy Paladin then you're !@#$ed when it comes to 90 dailies. Trees, Shaman, and Priests use the same gear for at least one of their dps specs.


Um...what? I do all the Isle of Thunder dailies as Mistweaver on my monk. It's hilariously fun! Things just fall over!
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1 Tauren Shaman
0
I think what some of you are losing sight of is that the game is supposed to be fun. If you don't enjoy playing a DPS spec then it sucks to be s.o.l. What can you do?
People do lose sight of the fact that, well...

this is a game
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55 Draenei Death Knight
9300
Um...what? I do all the Isle of Thunder dailies as Mistweaver on my monk. It's hilariously fun! Things just fall over!


I have a 13 inch !@#$ and I'm president of the universe, anecdotes are hilarious. But I'm glad you figured out a way to cast 10 jabs without burning your entire bar from the nerfs.
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81 Gnome Death Knight
10100
Cool let's see how easy it is to maintain a WW and a Mistweaver set both viable for dungeons off of the quest gear. You pick one or the other then fill out your otherspec off of grabbing lewts from dungeons on your mainspec.

Essentially if you are a Mistweaver or a Holy Paladin then you're !@#$ed when it comes to 90 dailies. Trees, Shaman, and Priests use the same gear for at least one of their dps specs.


Just doing dailies you don't need that much gear. My own pally's 370ish ret set is complete overkill for them. It's a combo of random junk from scenarios, a few VP items and random normal raid drops no one else wanted.

For doing quests as Holy I'd love to see a glyph that lets Light of Dawn do damage but either does less healing or is converted back into a cone. It would be like a super charged Holy Nova with build up time.

I do enjoy playing around as ret though since I mostly heal otherwise. It's something different.
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90 Pandaren Monk
15070
03/19/2013 10:47 AMPosted by Nekronancy
Um...what? I do all the Isle of Thunder dailies as Mistweaver on my monk. It's hilariously fun! Things just fall over!


I have a 13 inch !@#$ and I'm president of the universe, anecdotes are hilarious. But I'm glad you figured out a way to cast 10 jabs without burning your entire bar from the nerfs.


I don't cast just jab. I use Spinning Crane Kick, Chi Wave (which is actually really nice for burning down a single mob), and I do a lot of jab-tiger palm, and only use blackout kick when I get 2 chi from either Power Strikes or using Jab + Renewing Mist on myself. I actually "tanked" most of the Isle of Thunder for an undergeared Ele Sham friend of mine. HE thought I was Brewmaster. >.>

And on this toon, btw. She's not that geared, really.
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90 Human Priest
13720
I bet you wouldn't want to try to denounce and holy shock enemies to death with literally zero AOE dmg abilities.


as others have said, there are glyphs for your holy dps abilities that should make it pretty easy. also, as a healing priest our aoe is pretty laughable. it's all about single target.

I'm disc/holy...I do not do dailies.


the dailies are pretty laughably easy as disc with 0 downtime because of atonement.
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90 Pandaren Priest
14930
03/19/2013 11:01 AMPosted by Tsilyi
I'm disc/holy...I do not do dailies.


the dailies are pretty laughably easy as disc with 0 downtime because of atonement.


yeah...

I just pull things, root them, and lolAtonement.
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90 Human Priest
13720
root them


gross. pw:s!

:P

my favorite thing to do is pull a whole group of saurok at once and just laugh while mindlessly spamming my buttons and never going below 95% health.
Edited by Tsilyi on 3/19/2013 11:54 AM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
16150
I have never done dailies in Ret. I run them in Holy every day without issue. I quested from 1 to 90 as a holy. The only spot I had a problem was Townlong and the stupid elite bug trios.

It's not necessary to have a second spec. It's not necessary to have a second set of gear. It's nice to have options, but it's far from required.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
12880
You know, I'm pretty sure this is what the Talent/Glyph switching in the field via Tomes was supposed to address, in addition to allowing people to tailor their character to a given fight.

I imagine your guildmates are running these dailies too - why aren't you with them...or is the real question why don't they run them with you?

Instead of being an !@#, maybe you should make friends with some of these *LFRetards,* and do the dailies with them, since you aren't running them with your guildmates. Just a thought.

Riôt
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90 Tauren Paladin
10855
03/19/2013 09:22 AMPosted by Sadiemay
Druid or Shaman


Because there is no such thing as resto/feral or resto/enhance amiright? >.<

Ret is fun. Much better than it used to be. Oh the days of white hitting things waiting for judgement to come off cd.


And IF they choose to go down that path its their choice to do so.. My comment on Druids and Shamans was to point out the fact that they AT LEAST have the choice to duel spec into a DPS role where their healing gear can still be equally useful.

I tired Ret a long time ago.. I didn't like it then, I still don't like it now.. and I hate the fact that if I want to progress this character as a healer I have to spec ret if I want to get dailies done in a reasonable amount of time. And, as someone else mentioned Ret is a spec that is highly dependent on the quality of gear in order to pull decent damage

Hell, give Holy Paladin's Consecration or something and then things would be awesome. (Obviously they can make sure it's not OP or something)
While we're on the subject though..

Every healing class sans Paladins has a standard AoE ability (not sure about monks as I have yet to level one)

Druids: Hurricane
Priests: Mind Sear
Shamans: Chain Lighting / Magma Totem

I mean yes, Paladins get Holy Prism or Lights hammer, but we have to spec into them, all the other healers get a damaging AoE as stock standard to their class
Back when All paladins had Consecration it wasn't a problem... but now...

I guess i'm just fighting an uphill battle here..
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100 Night Elf Druid
6355
Leveling up and dailys are obviously not designed for healers. We have dual spec for a reason.


Except that in addition to priests and mistweavers, I've done quests and dailies as a resto druid just fine (we have Killer Instinct for a reason too), and quests as a resto shaman (haven't gotten it to 90 yet but I don't anticipate any problems). If there is a problem at all, it's specific to holy paladins. And judging (no pun intended) by the other holy paladins that have posted that they do fine with glyphs... yeah.

And if you don't like ret, maybe you could try prot? Still requires separate gear, but it definitely has AOE.

The one thing you have to understand is that your tactics have to change. Sometimes even your buffs (I use Flametongue to solo on resto shaman, for example, Flame Shock > Unleash Flame > Lava Burst is great, but Unleash Earthliving would do me no good). You have way more healing than you will practically need, so you have to focus your tactics on doing more damage. Look for spells or talents with multiple applications.

P.S. Since this seems to come up a lot for Holy paladins specifically, maybe Blizzard should look into letting Seals of Truth and Righteousness scale with spellpower for Holy, rather than weapon damage? It would have no practical effect on group healing because you'd either have Insight on, not be meleeing in the first place, or both, but might improve them for leveling/questing for people who have no desire to maintain a strength spec/gear.

Of course, an Int > AP conversion would be another option (assuming the % weapon damage on those seals includes damage from AP).

Even simpler would just be to give them access to Hammer of the Righteous and/or Divine Storm and/or Holy Wrath.
Edited by Calonderiel on 3/19/2013 5:51 PM PDT
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