Sub Rogues Off hand weapon discussion

90 Human Rogue
7440
First off there maybe not much to discuss however I was just curious, why a dagger? Why not a sword or an axe? I realize there is of course the speed difference, and the fact that only combat has increased offhand damage. Those things being said though would a larger 1 hand be better, or does the fact that they don't have the damage amp from combat and are far slower than daggers make that big of a difference?

Edit: I used to always think offhand dagger was good for shivs but obviously that doesn't matter now.
Edited by Karnifica on 3/19/2013 3:57 PM PDT
Reply Quote
1 Blood Elf Rogue
0
There isn't a huge difference. A fast OH will yield more DPS due to more poison applications.

Increased off-hand damage actually has nothing to do with it since weapon speed doesn't affect DPS.

EDIT: weapon speed doesn't affect weapon DPS
Edited by Cloaked on 3/19/2013 4:04 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Human Rogue
7440
Well that was more informative than it should have been for me. I should have realized dps is white swings and of course damage is for abilities, therefore it would not be effect by the increase talent in combat.

I also didn't know that poisons were application was just chance on hit. I had thought that it depended on what weapon hit... however I see that is a bit foolish now since you actually don't apply poisons to weapons directly anymore.

Thanks. Any other feedback is appreciated.
Edited by Karnifica on 3/19/2013 4:21 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Undead Rogue
7385
iirc, Poison procs were normalized in MoP no matter what your weapon speed was, so a slow weapon shouldn't effect it.

I think the general consensus is that if you play sub, get two daggers so you can play Assassin as your offspec.
Reply Quote
90 Human Rogue
7440
iirc, Poison procs were normalized in MoP no matter what your weapon speed was, so a slow weapon shouldn't effect it.

I think the general consensus is that if you play sub, get two daggers so you can play Assassin as your offspec.


This is a good point. Assassination seems to be much easier to play with low end gear. My overall damage seems to be quite a bit higher.
Reply Quote
100 Orc Rogue
17395
A slow offhand can work - but is inferior to a dagger. I played PvE Sub during T14 content with a slow offhand (made it easy to swap between combat and sub), but even being an Orc (more expertise from fists/axes), a dagger would have given me approximately ~1.5% more DPS according to shadowcraft. I'd assume around ~2% difference between a dagger and slow hand for anyone else.

My figures could be very wrong, so take it with a grain of salt. But I think 2% is a generally good enough ballpark between the two types of weapons. Thus, for any casual - it may not matter, especially if you swap between combat and sub.

EDIT: As mentioned, its better to go dual daggers (of course) if you swing between mut and sub... which I started to do at the start of 5.2.
Edited by Whiteytighty on 3/19/2013 5:02 PM PDT
Reply Quote
91 Undead Rogue
8620
03/19/2013 04:25 PMPosted by Relikar
iirc, Poison procs were normalized in MoP no matter what your weapon speed was, so a slow weapon shouldn't effect it.
Since when? The changes to poisons were the opposite of what you're saying.
Rather than changing the cph poisons to a ppm, they changed the ppm to a cph.
Therefore in MoP every poison will proc more frequently from a fast weapon.

That's why for Combat slow weapons aren't always the way to go for sure, if poisons were normalized then the added damage from Spree would be the only difference. This is not the case.
Edited by Kiljagen on 3/19/2013 7:09 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
10620
A slow OH would have to be a major upgrade to consider it over a dagger. The 2% figure mentioned by Whitey is probably a good benchmark, at a minimum.
Reply Quote
90 Undead Priest
4720
As sub a slow OH means less chances to crit with it which means less combo points from Honor Among Theives. Just sayin..
Reply Quote
90 Human Rogue
7440
As sub a slow OH means less chances to crit with it which means less combo points from Honor Among Theives. Just sayin..


Well made point again. Thank you all, in the end I decided daggers like every other rogue, I was just curious on the matter. Thank you all again for entertaining my questions instead of just being like dAGgerzs Noob.
Reply Quote
1 Blood Elf Rogue
0
HaT only procs from abilities
Reply Quote
90 Undead Rogue
7385
HaT only procs from abilities


While this is true, a poison crit still procs them iirc.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Rogue
10620
In groups of 10+, Honor Among Thieves procs will occur like clockwork without regard to your own abilities. Your own abilities and their crits is only an issue for HaT procs in 5-mans or smaller groups, or solo.
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]