ToT for 2-Night guilds

These guys went 11/12 their first week
http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/us/balnazzar/Skunkworks
The problem isn't how often you raid, it's how effectively you raid.


Or if you wiped on all the bosses on the ptr rather than on week 1.
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90 Troll Hunter
11450
These guys went 11/12 their first week
http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/us/balnazzar/Skunkworks

The problem isn't how often you raid, it's how effectively you raid.


Or if you wiped on all the bosses on the ptr rather than on week 1.

I'd be pretty surprised if a 2-day guild did much PTR, but that is possible.
Edited by Meleti on 3/12/2013 12:18 PM PDT
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90 Pandaren Monk
10970


Or if you wiped on all the bosses on the ptr rather than on week 1.

I'd be pretty surprised if a 2-day guild did much PTR, but that is possible.


Their guild is made up of raiders who used to be in top 20-50 world guilds who can no longer raid at the same schedule as those guilds. I actually wouldn't doubt if they had some PTR experience, and even without it, the type of skill level in that guild is the same as one would expect from Paragon, BL, Stars, Exodus, Method, etc.
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90 Undead Priest
6995
Trash can be fun, but too much trash is never good.
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90 Night Elf Druid
15480
03/12/2013 10:39 AMPosted by Envien
What would you suggest be a suitable amount of time to be spent on trash in between each boss?


10 minutes.
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90 Troll Hunter
11450

I'd be pretty surprised if a 2-day guild did much PTR, but that is possible.


Their guild is made up of raiders who used to be in top 20-50 world guilds who can no longer raid at the same schedule as those guilds. I actually wouldn't doubt if they had some PTR experience, and even without it, the type of skill level in that guild is the same as one would expect from Paragon, BL, Stars, Exodus, Method, etc.

Yeah, that was my point originally. 2 day guilds can do well in ToT, they just need to be prepared to play very well if they want to progress on such a limited schedule.
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90 Human Paladin
13840
One of my raid teams is just a 2 night team. We raid for 3 hours each of those nights as well. So time is surely limited. We have to make the most of it.

I will admit I really hate trash of any kind. It is just boring and slows everything down and when you get geared up that it is pure cake as a healer it is the absolute worst in boredom. I usually stop healing during trash and just sit and chat and then something goes wrong and people die and they blame me pfft lol jk :)

Anyways I think the trash in ToT is a bit excessive. It isn't so much the quantity but the pulls between the first & second boss are just a hassle and take too much time.

I think it does make it harder for guilds who do have less time to raid and are trying to learn fights. You want to make the most of your time on the actual bosses learning the fights not on trash getting to the bosses.

I just think that there should be a nice balance.
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90 Troll Priest
14890
These guys went 11/12 their first week
http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/us/balnazzar/Skunkworks

The problem isn't how often you raid, it's how effectively you raid.


4 different days of boss kills on wowprogress leads me to believe "2 days" sometimes isn't 2 days. Silly Chupa
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90 Dwarf Hunter
16835
Time doesn't matter as much as effective use of raid time.

If you only raid 2 nights a week, make the amount of break times, trash wipes, etc a bare minimum and get pulls in fast. Don't take 10 minutes between a pull or let some guy take a smoke break every attempt.
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90 Worgen Druid
4810
These guys went 11/12 their first week
http://www.wowprogress.com/guild/us/balnazzar/Skunkworks

The problem isn't how often you raid, it's how effectively you raid.


4 different days of boss kills on wowprogress leads me to believe "2 days" sometimes isn't 2 days. Silly Chupa


Never trust a raiding schedule on wowprogress.

"even after patch releases and during progression races. That's right, just 8 hours a week, never any more"

Not knocking them, it's a lot of bosses for a guild with a limited schedule, just pointing out that wowprogress is about as reliable as asking a car salesman if the car will be reliable.
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90 Undead Warrior
15325
Never trust a raiding schedule on wowprogress.


Hey! In our four year history, we've never added a fourth night or extra hour for raiding!!!1
Edited by Freese on 3/12/2013 2:27 PM PDT
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90 Troll Hunter
11020
makes this a very difficult raid tier to manage for those of us who run less than 10 hours per week.


I've been in guilds who raided and currently raid 8 hours a week, on 25m, that will have no problem with it. The trash could use some numbers cut...it's cool to have 1-2 that shows X bosses mechanic(s) but when there's ~4+ of it, it's entirely useless and just there for bloat.
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90 Worgen Druid
4810
03/12/2013 02:26 PMPosted by Freese
Never trust a raiding schedule on wowprogress.


Hey! In our four year history, we've never added a fourth night or extra hour for raiding!!!1


I'm skeptical =p

Most 3 night guilds add a day or maybe 2 throughout a tier. Last tier it seemed reasonable to add a day or two, I'm not sure I see any reason to add any this tier with the exception of *maybe* H-Lei Shen.
Edited by Duboomchikin on 3/12/2013 3:17 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Warlock
20140
We went 12/12 in approximately 11 hours, maybe about 11.5.

It really is about efficiency, tactics and what knowledge you bring in.
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90 Draenei Shaman
15910
We went 12/12 in approximately 11 hours, maybe about 11.5.

It really is about efficiency, tactics and what knowledge you bring in.

Yes, it's all about efficiency, tactics and knowledge and it has nothing whatsoever to do with your 510 item level.

Some raids are simply more efficient than others. Mine has one mandatory raid night per week of 3.5 hours. Sometimes we add a second night when everyone feels like doing so and can make it. That tends to happen more at the beginning of a new tier, as people are excited about the content and don't make as many other plans. We averaged under 1.5 nights per week for T14, took two weeks off for the holidays and cleared all of the normal content and and three heroics. We probably would have done even more except for some turnover and attendance issues.

I don't recruit people for their skill at the game and have never kicked anyone for performance reasons unless it was obvious they just weren't willing to try. If we can do normals on this schedule with that kind of casual commitment, you can do them in two nights a week, too. It just takes perseverance and a good focus on efficiency. It will help to have a stable core raid group, which just takes time and dedication to build.

I would personally have liked to see optional side bosses with gates the way it was in Ulduar. Our healers struggled for a while with Iron Council, but it was not as frustrating to be stuck there because we could move past them and get some upgrades from other bosses. And when no one needed loot from Razorscale or Ignis, anymore, you could simply skip them without looking back. If your raid composition made certain keeper fights harder, you could choose to skip them and work on another first. This made sure that the difficulty from Auriaya through Yogg was pretty much linear and that felt like a well designed raid.
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90 Orc Warrior
11860
We did 12/12 in 11-12 hours. We had almost zero ptr experience.
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90 Troll Rogue
20300
Yeah we did 12/12 is 11-12 hours as well. No PTR experience either.
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90 Troll Shaman
7330
you can skip most of the trash in the place - just don't be stupid and keep pulling !@#$ you don't need.
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90 Pandaren Warrior
15860
If you raid less hours you have to play better and not waste time.
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90 Tauren Druid
15830
I saw a thread on here yesterday about this. A player suggested that you rotate lockout extensions every other week.


Was about to suggest this. It's what my guild will likely do when we reach the point where we just don't have enough time to work on the later bosses.
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