The Horde and Pandaria

90 Draenei Shaman
5800
PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF GOD DO NOT TURN THIS INTO A FACTION DEBATE. I AM BASICALLY ASKING ABOUT THE HORDE QUESTS IN PANDARIA. THAT'S IT.

Since I am too impatient to wait and get to 90 on my troll druid and find out for myself, does anyone know if the Horde (and by "Horde" I mean Garrosh and his supporters) actually keeps to it's promise of "painting the continent red"? The only instance I can think of him actually doing this are the Orc you first fight as an Alliance character, the invasion of the Temple of Chi-Ji, and the theft of the Divine Bell. Does anything else happen that could be considered objectionable on the Horde side?
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10 Night Elf Hunter
60
Horde quests when the diverge from the shared storyline are simply aiding the Pandaren with fighting off yaungol and dealing with the Sha threat. They are analogous, and Nazgrim hasn't done anything that would "paint Pandaria red" as Garrosh wanted. They pretty much to the exact same thing, but from different sides of the "wall".
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90 Draenei Shaman
5800
Horde quests when the diverge from the shared storyline are simply aiding the Pandaren with fighting off yaungol and dealing with the Sha threat. They are analogous, and Nazgrim hasn't done anything that would "paint Pandaria red" as Garrosh wanted. They pretty much to the exact same thing, but from different sides of the "wall".


Good to know! I wasn't sure what exactly would cause some of my Horde characters to defect to the rebellion, but you've basically narrowed some ideas down for me. Thanks! :D
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100 Night Elf Hunter
18880
Every single Horde/Alliance quest in Pandaria is an exact mirror. Jade forest is the most divergent, and that's just barely.

Alliance is painting the continent exactly as red as the Horde is. Especially on that quest when you paint the turnips with blood for Li Li.
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Essentially, you are sent by Garrosh under the leadership of Nazgrim to secure the hidden continent in the name of the horde, and to strip everything of it for use in his war machine as they continue their genocidal rampage across Azeroth.

Some stuff happens, some things go down, and you are now killing in the name of Garrosh Hellscream, but then somehow pull a 180 after the fact becuase on no, he tried to assassinate the troll that has been committing high treason since 4.1.
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10 Night Elf Hunter
60
Essentially, you are sent by Garrosh under the leadership of Nazgrim to secure the hidden continent in the name of the horde, and to strip everything of it for use in his war machine as they continue their genocidal rampage across Azeroth.
in fair defense of the plot, until that pinhead Hellscream shows up in 5.1, Horde players do not partake in anything of that sort. While Horde npcs (that you fight as Alliance) do, they are part of a force that arrived before Nazgrim.
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After Nazgrim lost almost all of his forces just getting onto Pandaria, and especially after the disaster at Serpent's Heart, he's had to focus mainly on helping the Pandaren deal with local threats.

The Dominance Offensive was probably supposed to be the real start of "painting the continent red", but the Alliance has got them pretty well bogged down in the Krasarang Wilds. Garrosh is looking for weapons on Pandaria that could turn the tide in his favor (ie the Divine Bell), but for now "Operation: Shieldwall" is being very true to it's name.

The other Horde contingents on Pandaria, the Dawnchaser Tauren and the Blood Elves, aren't very interested in pursuring Garrosh's orders. The Dawnchashers came in search of the Vale of Eternal Blossums, and while the Blood Elves obstinately serve Garrosh they are preparing to rise against him all the same. Part of the reason why Lor'themar specifically wants to take on the Thunder King is because he wants to use Lei Shen's power as leverage against Garrosh.
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03/21/2013 02:03 PMPosted by Suraia
Horde players


The players as a whole as generally inconsequential when it comes to the story line. They were sent there, with a mission. The fact they couldn't follow through until Garrosh showed up is irrelevant. Garrosh declared a mission, and 'players' accepted, knowing full well what it entailed.

It can't be both ways.
Edited by Seebach on 3/21/2013 2:47 PM PDT
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100 Night Elf Hunter
18880
The players as a whole as generally inconsequential when it comes to the story line. They were sent there, with a mission. The fact they couldn't follow through until Garrosh showed up is irrelevant. Garrosh declared a mission, and 'players' accepted, knowing full well what it entailed.

It can't be both ways.


I think he was just doing some chest beating, not declaring the Horde mission statement for the next year.
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10 Night Elf Hunter
60
03/21/2013 02:46 PMPosted by Seebach
Horde players


The players as a whole as generally inconsequential when it comes to the story line. They were sent there, with a mission. The fact they couldn't follow through until Garrosh showed up is irrelevant. Garrosh declared a mission, and 'players' accepted, knowing full well what it entailed.

It can't be both ways.
It's not both ways. It's a matter of timeline, thats all. The Horde and Alliance experience is pretty much the same thing, until 5.1 where the paths drastically diverge.
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03/21/2013 03:14 PMPosted by Suraia
It's not both ways.


If it isn't, then why are the horde players saying one thing, when they know they are doing the opposite for the story.

Compliance in Convenience. This is the part of the story that makes no sense.
Edited by Seebach on 3/21/2013 3:22 PM PDT
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90 Draenei Shaman
5800
Guys.
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10 Night Elf Hunter
60
03/21/2013 03:21 PMPosted by Seebach
It's not both ways.


If it isn't, then why are the horde players saying one thing, when they know they are doing the opposite for the story.
Compliance in Convenience. This is the part of the story that makes no sense.
Because Horde players are setting themselves up for the "we were just following orders" excuse to plead their innocence in the story, and the way the story is written (considering it's written by Horde players, effectively) they will be pardoned. Horde players are the entire reason the Alliance has been suffering since Cata, not just Hellscream. Hellscream gave the orders, and the players followed them and carried out his will for shinies. Horde players want to try and separate it out, but the reality is if they quested through those places where the Horde was rampaging and committing atrocities they took part in them.

As for Pandaria, like I said, it's a matter of timeline. In 5.0 Horde and Alliance were doing the same things, aiding the locals, trying to gain favour of them etc. They aren't, for that brief period of time, following the Warchief's command. In 5.1 Garrosh shows up, the true colours of the Horde are shown to the locals, and the conflict started in Cata resumes, with the Alliance actually fighting back.
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100 Night Elf Hunter
18880
Guys.


You posted in the wrong forum, and no one is going to listen to your plea for no Faction wank.

It's like you came to a nudist beach and requested that no fat old dudes flash you.
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90 Draenei Shaman
5800
03/21/2013 03:31 PMPosted by Threeslotbag
Guys.


You posted in the wrong forum, and no one is going to listen to your plea for no Faction wank.

It's like you came to a nudist beach and requested that no fat old dudes flash you.


Look, I know the Story Forums is known for getting into stupid faction arguments and I can understand if the topic was, "Were the Sunreavers right?" or "Are the Forsaken evil?", but my question is "Do the Horde quests match Garrosh's order?" It's not completely objective, but it's not so subjective or controversial that it needs another stupid and pointless argument. It doesn't need to be derailed to the point of everyone listing argument fallacies, picking out sentences, and the eventual devolution of name calling and stereotyping of fan bases.

That being said, I have enough information. You all can bicker elsewhere.
Edited by Veruu on 3/21/2013 3:39 PM PDT
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100 Night Elf Hunter
18880

Look, I know the Story Forums is known for getting into stupid faction arguments and I can understand if the topic was, "Were the Sunreavers right?" or "Are the Forsaken evil?", but my question is "Do the Horde quests match Garrosh's order?" It's not completely objective, but it's not so subjective or controversial that it needs another stupid and pointless argument. It doesn't need to be derailed to the point of everyone listing argument fallacies, picking out sentences, and the eventual devolution of name calling and stereotyping of fan bases.

That being said, I have enough information. You all can bicker elsewhere.


To answer your question: No. Dominance Offensive are the only quests at all like that, and for half of them you are working against Garrosh.
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10 Night Elf Hunter
60

Look, I know the Story Forums is known for getting into stupid faction arguments and I can understand if the topic was, "Were the Sunreavers right?" or "Are the Forsaken evil?", but my question is "Do the Horde quests match Garrosh's order?" It's not completely objective, but it's not so subjective or controversial that it needs another stupid and pointless argument. It doesn't need to be derailed to the point of everyone listing argument fallacies, picking out sentences, and the eventual devolution of name calling and stereotyping of fan bases.

That being said, I have enough information. You all can bicker elsewhere.


To answer your question: No. Dominance Offensive are the only quests at all like that, and for half of them you are working against Garrosh.
Not really, most of the line is working for garrosh. The entire quest surrounding the Divine Bell is to secure it for him and kill the Alliance whom are keeping it away from Horde hands. What makes no sense is Vol'jin thinking the Divine Bell should be in Horde hands (where Garrosh can easily use it whenever). Players don't sneak into Darnassus, to steal a weapon of mass destruction Garrosh already said he'd use against the Alliance, if they aren't working for him. 5.2 is the first time, since 5.1 released, than Horde players aren't working for Garrosh in any capacity. Lorthemar is has his own agenda and is utilizing the Horde to further it. I'm just waiting for Rommath to inform Garrosh of Lorthemar's "leverage" from the Thunder King.
Edited by Suraia on 3/21/2013 3:48 PM PDT
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First off.

B-O-O-H-O-O

Deal with it.

Secondly

03/21/2013 03:38 PMPosted by Veruu
"Do the Horde quests match Garrosh's order?"


At first, when Nazgrim is attempting to get the horde setup, and even in Krasarang when Garrosh lands and sets up Domination Point.

However, as soon as Vol'jin gets hurt and Lor'themar Theron seeks to oust Garrosh using the powers of the thunderking, it deviates from Garrosh's horde to the rebels horde.

This is what angries my blood, is that the horde will at the end get to say, "We were followiing orders" as if that is supposed to somehow make it all better.

It doesn't. The horde should pay for listening to their Thrall approved overlord.

It shouldn't. However, since we'll be going to Argus to fight the Burning Legion head-on, we have to forgive and forget because "we can't go it alone."

It is insulting.

You all can bicker elsewhere.


You have my permission to leave anytime you want.

If not, sit back, relax (this is optional btw), and get ready for the arguments.
Edited by Seebach on 3/21/2013 3:56 PM PDT
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100 Tauren Shaman
14180
Short answer is that different people within the horde have different veiws.

Garrosh, for example, wants full domination and subjegation. Pandaria is resources and until the alliance is no more and the orcs are dominant, everything is expendable in his book.

Dezco, on the other hand is there with nothing to do with Garrosh. He is following a vision and the orders of Baine in searching for the Vale. They feel the Vale holds the key to ending the war.

Nazgrim is an interesting case. Hes very anti allaince and hes a loyal Garrosh supporter but hes not extreme as Garrosh. It will be interesting to see which side of the battlelines he ends up on. My guess is that Garrosh is going to demand something that forces Nazgrim to chose between loyalty and honor.

Garrosh has very clear ideas of what he wants from Pandaria but as far as the plot and the quests go, the Horde Players are helping the Pandarian, building good relations with the locals and helping secure horde holdings against alliance forces.

Its also worth noting that technically the Player Character is a sleeper agent for the newly forming rebellion as of 5.1 scenario, Dagger in the Dark. The reason the PC is staying close to Garrosh is so that they are in a good place to move against him when the time comes. Technically though they are already traitors to their Warchief.
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90 Draenei Shaman
5800
First off.

B-O-O-H-O-O

Deal with it.

Secondly

You all can bicker elsewhere.


You have my permission to leave anytime you want.

If not, sit back, relax (this is optional btw), and get ready for the arguments.


Yes, how dare I ask people to give objective information instead of going on pointless triads.
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