Oondasta Health Nerf

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90 Worgen Mage
20350
I kind of enjoyed the GY zergs since Sargeras was still capable of it, but I feel for other servers. And maybe all those skellies would have caused a problem eventually, idk, lol. Never seen that many.

He'll die really quickly now. The nerf should be good news to low pops, since they have a shot at killing it now.

Oondasta unfortunately was not able to deliver on the design intent.
Edited by Digerati on 3/21/2013 10:40 PM PDT
50 Gnome Warlock
765
Would you say heroic raids would be fine if servers could bring 300 players to a heroic boss and down it, well you probably would but they they're locked to a certain amount of people. They could've easily put the GY across the water in kun-lai, make it so he can't be brought down the mountain, make him heal for every person killed, make him do more damage for every person killed, and the list goes on.


Designing something that can only be killed by people on the top 50 progression servers, without cross-realm farming, isn't exactly good business.

Fun for sure, but not good business.
90 Orc Shaman
HC
16485
03/21/2013 10:38 PMPosted by Bomdanil
Would you say heroic raids would be fine if servers could bring 300 players to a heroic boss and down it, well you probably would but they they're locked to a certain amount of people. They could've easily put the GY across the water in kun-lai, make it so he can't be brought down the mountain, make him heal for every person killed, make him do more damage for every person killed, and the list goes on.


Designing something that can only be killed by people on the top 50 progression servers, without cross-realm farming, isn't exactly good business.

Fun for sure, but not good business.


No one is arguing it is, but if you check what Blizzard stated about the boss you'd know why I posted what I did. The boss from their design point is a failure.
90 Pandaren Warrior
15690
03/21/2013 10:37 PMPosted by Azane
seems like a good anti-zerg measure


Then we'll just get mad at the 6k DPS heroes buffing his healthtable.


Speak for yourself. We get mad at the 6k dps heroes anyway for being 6k dps heroes.

Also I'm actually surprised.

I knew heroic world boss would fail and it would just be"throw bodies at him until he dies", I didn't think blizzard would up and give up this quickly.
90 Blood Elf Hunter
10235
03/21/2013 11:01 PMPosted by Ðemolition


Then we'll just get mad at the 6k DPS heroes buffing his healthtable.


Speak for yourself. We get mad at the 6k dps heroes anyway for being 6k dps heroes.

Also I'm actually surprised.

I knew heroic world boss would fail and it would just be"throw bodies at him until he dies", I didn't think blizzard would up and give up this quickly.


Stormrage and Illidan were crashing several times every day since he started spawning, nearly every time he spawned. I am sure they will try some other silly thing in 5.x to give us a heroic world boss, but for now something had to be done.
90 Orc Shaman
HC
16485


Speak for yourself. We get mad at the 6k dps heroes anyway for being 6k dps heroes.

Also I'm actually surprised.

I knew heroic world boss would fail and it would just be"throw bodies at him until he dies", I didn't think blizzard would up and give up this quickly.


Stormrage and Illidan were crashing several times every day since he started spawning, nearly every time he spawned. I am sure they will try some other silly thing in 5.x to give us a heroic world boss, but for now something had to be done.


This changes nothing on those servers, sorry to break it to you.
90 Blood Elf Hunter
10235


Stormrage and Illidan were crashing several times every day since he started spawning, nearly every time he spawned. I am sure they will try some other silly thing in 5.x to give us a heroic world boss, but for now something had to be done.


This changes nothing on those servers, sorry to break it to you.


That's funny, cause the servers sure don't crash every time Sha or Galleon spawns. Give it another week, maybe less, and killing Oondasta will just be a random thing thrown together and if you miss it, no big deal, it will respawn in two hours, as oppose to 100,000 people trying to tag the same boss at the same time.
90 Human Paladin
15800
Woohoo.. i get to go afk for 50% less time now.

Btw.. Azane how's you feeling.. I know you race changed to worgen but it doesn't mean you should eat the garbage..
90 Gnome Warlock
8955
The only thing heroic about this boss was the amusement I got from all the nerd rage that was going on in general chat while I sat at the GY dead with a 2 minute res timer. There was nothing fun about the slideshow framerate and spending more time dead than alive. Epic fail of a world boss in my opinion
Edited by Outcast on 3/22/2013 2:39 AM PDT
90 Night Elf Warrior
16175
About the only anti-zerging measure I can think of that isn't quite as easily exploitable is if the boss could have a sense of what raid tagged him and then automatically kill anyone outside that raid and of the same faction that gets near him. Kinda like the old auras from classic/TBC world bosses except on anyone outside the tagging group instead of anyone they recently killed. Also get rid of faction tapping for him and break the ability to tag share.

Not a perfect solution, but it will mostly ensure that only one raid group from the tagging faction is able to engage him at a time. The tricky part is how to handle the opposite faction, they need to be able to engage the other raid without dying, but you don't want to open up the possibility of taking turns and having 300 horde help an alliance raid group and then swapping the next time. Not sure how to effectively prevent that.
90 Human Priest
13720
Actually? yes?


i'm not sure about heroic... but it was super fun! i don't care if the mechanics were ignored... fighting and graveyard zerging alongside 3+ raidgroups full of people is super entertaining. would do it every time! :D
Community Manager
Lead Encounter Designer Ion "Watcher" Hazzikostas noticed this thread last night and has these thoughts to share:

Yes, Oondasta's maximum health has been reduced by 50%. The design intent behind this boss was for the primary audience to be guilds rather than pickup groups. That is why we placed Oondasta on a relatively remote island, surrounded by powerful elite dinosaurs that make solo travel in the area a dicey proposition. It's why he has mechanics that will outright kill you without the coordinated use of cooldowns, and careful positioning. It's a very different philosophy than our approach to designing bosses like Sha of Anger or Nalak. Of course, things didn't exactly play out as we envisioned -- as we all know, it was possible to overwhelm Oondasta with sheer numbers. While not intended, that was not entirely negative. There have been some pretty epic experiences on the Isle of Giants in the last couple of weeks. There's something to be said for the sight of a hundred spells and missiles flying through the air at a huge dinosaur.

We could have made a number of changes that would have made this approach entirely impossible: Consider a version of Oondasta with a Spiritfire Beam that could hop to 99 targets instead of 20, and a Doomwalker-style debuff that prevented players who had died during the encounter from re-engaging. Definitely not zergable. But that doesn't mean that people would stop trying, and the result would likely be a boss that no one could kill, and a frustrating experience for most participants. So we didn't do that.

Ultimately, while our server hardware is much, much more powerful than what we had in place during the days of events like the Opening of Ahn'Qiraj years ago, it still has limits. And what we have increasingly been observing was players massing around Oondasta in such great numbers that it brought servers to their knees. As word spreads that Oondasta has spawned, more and more people flock to the Isle of Giants for a piece of the action. Many people have been in Oondasta fights where spells took multiple seconds to cast, and the dinosaur perhaps stopped using its abilities entirely. Players with anything but the very best computers saw nothing but a slideshow. And in extreme cases, the entire continent of Pandaria crashed. That simply isn't an acceptable experience for our players, and so we reduced Oondasta's health, so that smaller groups are more likely to be successful, and he'll likely die before so many players arrive that it degrades the experience for everyone present. If server capacity were limitless, we wouldn't have made any of these changes, but alas that is not the case.

Oondasta clearly did not deliver on our original expectations. We'll apply the lessons learned from this experience to any future world bosses we add.
90 Dwarf Death Knight
17655
The problem now, You can feel when oondasta is pulled, It literally just misses crashing the world server, and the world MS for Pandaria goes into the 1000's serverwide.

In Blizz's defense, with all the complaints about Oondasta pre launch, I don't remember reading any say "oh, you'll just be able to Zerg him with hundreds of players." While admittedly that's Blizz's job to find things like that, it's not like the feedback was screaming this was going to happen.


no, there was 1 Consolidated Oondasta thread on these boards, Hint; Everyone said it was just gonna be zerged. It's not some "Oh we didnt expect a lot of people to do it" thing, even Galleon was getting 100's of people for kills and it wasnt needed and required fancy tag shares.

World Bosses so far seem like a failure, I'd almost prefer Archavon style to Sha style, Blizzard being afraid to tune a 100 man world boss above a 25 normal raid (870m health is in line with normals) while calling it epic is proof we can't have nice things, especially now that Oondasta is barely tuned above 10 man (Below some 10 man heroics).

Just instance loot pinatas and tune them right, stop the lagfests, griefests, I like the rarespawn idea, but the other issues have ruined it, the world boss rush isn't anywhere near as fun as say EQ because the bosses are tuned to be zerged down by mindless players.
Edited by Azane on 3/22/2013 11:11 AM PDT
90 Human Priest
11580
Lead Encounter Designer Ion "Watcher" Hazzikostas noticed this thread last night and has these thoughts to share:

Yes, Oondasta's maximum health has been reduced by 50%. The design intent behind this boss was for the primary audience to be guilds rather than pickup groups. That is why we placed Oondasta on a relatively remote island, surrounded by powerful elite dinosaurs that make solo travel in the area a dicey proposition. It's why he has mechanics that will outright kill you without the coordinated use of cooldowns, and careful positioning. It's a very different philosophy than our approach to designing bosses like Sha of Anger or Nalak. Of course, things didn't exactly play out as we envisioned -- as we all know, it was possible to overwhelm Oondasta with sheer numbers. While not intended, that was not entirely negative. There have been some pretty epic experiences on the Isle of Giants in the last couple of weeks. There's something to be said for the sight of a hundred spells and missiles flying through the air at a huge dinosaur.

We could have made a number of changes that would have made this approach entirely impossible: Consider a version of Oondasta with a Spiritfire Beam that could hop to 99 targets instead of 20, and a Doomwalker-style debuff that prevented players who had died during the encounter from re-engaging. Definitely not zergable. But that doesn't mean that people would stop trying, and the result would likely be a boss that no one could kill, and a frustrating experience for most participants. So we didn't do that.

Ultimately, while our server hardware is much, much more powerful than what we had in place during the days of events like the Opening of Ahn'Qiraj years ago, it still has limits. And what we have increasingly been observing was players massing around Oondasta in such great numbers that it brought servers to their knees. As word spreads that Oondasta has spawned, more and more people flock to the Isle of Giants for a piece of the action. Many people have been in Oondasta fights where spells took multiple seconds to cast, and the dinosaur perhaps stopped using its abilities entirely. Players with anything but the very best computers saw nothing but a slideshow. And in extreme cases, the entire continent of Pandaria crashed. That simply isn't an acceptable experience for our players, and so we reduced Oondasta's health, so that smaller groups are more likely to be successful, and he'll likely die before so many players arrive that it degrades the experience for everyone present. If server capacity were limitless, we wouldn't have made any of these changes, but alas that is not the case.

Oondasta clearly did not deliver on our original expectations. We'll apply the lessons learned from this experience to any future world bosses we add.


oh wow, could this be the first boss that was nerfed for server loads?
90 Night Elf Warrior
13570
That doesn't change the strategy used to kill him with minimal deaths (which will no doubt happen regardless).
90 Pandaren Hunter
16950
lol I knew something like this would happen.

Well like someone else in this thread said, I can go AFK 50% less now, but at the cost of 50% less nerd rage time in general chat.
90 Goblin Hunter
13400
The problem now, You can feel when oondasta is pulled, It literally just misses crashing the world server, and the world MS for Pandaria goes into the 1000's serverwide.

In Blizz's defense, with all the complaints about Oondasta pre launch, I don't remember reading any say "oh, you'll just be able to Zerg him with hundreds of players." While admittedly that's Blizz's job to find things like that, it's not like the feedback was screaming this was going to happen.


no, there was 1 Consolidated Oondasta thread on these boards, Hint; Everyone said it was just gonna be zerged. It's not some "Oh we didnt expect a lot of people to do it" thing, even Galleon was getting 100's of people for kills and it wasnt needed and required fancy tag shares.

World Bosses so far seem like a failure, I'd almost prefer Archavon style to Sha style, Blizzard being afraid to tune a 100 man world boss above a 25 normal raid (870m health is in line with normals) while calling it epic is proof we can't have nice things, especially now that Oondasta is barely tuned above 10 man (Below some 10 man heroics).

Just instance loot pinatas and tune them right, stop the lagfests, griefests, I like the rarespawn idea, but the other issues have ruined it, the world boss rush isn't anywhere near as fun as say EQ because the bosses are tuned to be zerged down by mindless players.


Hmm, my bad, must've missed those.
90 Blood Elf Mage
15820
Well, I experienced Oondaste prenerf, and it cost me 400g in repairs and I had a blast anyway. So I'm going to enjoy it even more now <3
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