Oondasta Health Nerf

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90 Worgen Mage
20350
I think the main problem devs saw with tap to raid was that people were tag sharing anyway, like with Gal. That tap sharing system must be hardcoded into the game or something, like the 16 slot backpack.
90 Human Hunter
10580
I really wish he would of just had the doomwalker type debuff.
90 Undead Rogue
12450
while our server hardware is much, much more powerful than what we had in place during the days of events like the Opening of Ahn'Qiraj years ago


It is? could have fooled me. Wintergrasp, Tol Barad, every place where players gather has NEVER functioned until you put population hard caps on the zone. Now if a raid of alliance visits Orgr, the whole place lags and it takes 10 sec to mount up.

How did you not know with absolute certainty that this is exactly what would happen with Oondasta? Your "massive pvp" game, after 8 years, is still utterly unable to cope with more that 100 players doing something, and this has nothing to do with our computers, it's your hardware and software.


There have been some pretty epic experiences on the Isle of Giants in the last couple of weeks. There's something to be said for the sight of a hundred spells and missiles flying through the air at a huge dinosaur.

On Mal'Ganis this epic experience consists of zone lag so bad it takes 15 sec for chat to update, forget actually using "spells and missiles". It's a slideshow of autoattacks vs the bugged out dino that doesn't use any abilities. Epic indeed.
Edited by Chances on 3/22/2013 3:23 PM PDT
90 Blood Elf Mage
11000
I really wish he would of just had the doomwalker type debuff.


Sounds great until you realize someone is going to walk over to your tanks to get them killed by Spitfire Beam.
90 Troll Hunter
11255
Sounds great until you realize someone is going to walk over to your tanks to get them killed by Spitfire Beam.


That goes for anyone, the potential to grief with a Doomwalker type debuff is far too great. I see people who just rush in to chain the Beam already.
90 Troll Shaman
14090
But it was supposed to be for fairly skilled guilds to take down with skill and tactics, not a free-for-all for multiple guilds to zerg down.

And I perfectly agree with that. The problem is that Oondasta drops current-tier raid gear, which means that every person that can get in on it will do so. Especially with tap-to-faction instead of players doing tag-sharing.

Perhaps a boss like this simply doesn't work as a world boss. It needs to be inside an instance.

Yeah, but then Blizzard would have to admit that they were wrong to attempt world bosses again instead of sticking to VoA-style loot bosses. (Not that I didn't like VoA, I loved it.)
Edited by Alayea on 3/22/2013 3:49 PM PDT
90 Tauren Druid
11460
Now that he's been nerf'd, could you provide a detailed description of how you envisioned raid groups downing him as originally designed?
03/22/2013 02:31 PMPosted by Murdina
The design intent behind this boss was for the primary audience to be guilds rather than pickup groups.

Then it should have been designed to tap to the first raid group to engage him, and only to that raid group, instead of tap to faction. That would fix these problems quite effectively.

Also if it was aimed at elite guilds it probably should have dropped something a bit better than 522 ilevel loot.


I'd purposely go there just to grief the guilds on my realm that I do not like.

One extra body = Even harder to deal with.

You cannot design a NON PHASED outdoor raid boss anymore. It was fine in vanilla, when there weren't a lot of players at max level. It's not anymore. Especially with the graphics upgrades the game has had.
90 Dwarf Death Knight
16130
So I think we agree a boss with complicated, fairly precise mechanics like Oondaasta simply doesn't work as a non-phased, non-instanced world boss. Bosses with simple mechanics, like Sha or Galleon, works okay.

Now that he's been nerf'd, could you provide a detailed description of how you envisioned raid groups downing him as originally designed?

Just looking at the dungeon journal, I see it requires a high degree of coordination to do it "properly", without zerging. But any new players entering the fray (not even other faction players) will mess up the strategy and probably cause a wipe.
Edited by Murdina on 3/22/2013 4:22 PM PDT
90 Goblin Hunter
13400
03/22/2013 03:49 PMPosted by Alayea
But it was supposed to be for fairly skilled guilds to take down with skill and tactics, not a free-for-all for multiple guilds to zerg down.

And I perfectly agree with that. The problem is that Oondasta drops current-tier raid gear, which means that every person that can get in on it will do so. Especially with tap-to-faction instead of players doing tag-sharing.

Perhaps a boss like this simply doesn't work as a world boss. It needs to be inside an instance.

Yeah, but then Blizzard would have to admit that they were wrong to attempt world bosses again instead of sticking to VoA-style loot bosses. (Not that I didn't like VoA, I loved it.)


I don't think Blizz would have to admit all world bosses are a failure. Just that hard world bosses are a near impossibility now. Sha of Anger, current Galleon and Nalak are fine. Nothing wrong with them at all.
90 Goblin Shaman
10185
I was very excited about Oondasta, w/ max health. Heres the thing tho, Im on a low horde pop. server, we are outnumbered 3-1, when it come to world bosses you might as well forget it, when it comes to anything (Warbringers,Warscouts another good example) you might as well just lay down your gear. The opposite faction is always farming them and on top of it if you do get the tag and start to get a kill, the opposing faction flags and one AoE and your screwed. I downed Oondasta pre nerf w/ friends on Cho'gall, but of course no loot. Then when my server can do it they spend 3 hours and all ya get is a giant pile of refuse? A giant bag of CRAP!? Literally Blizz has gotten so bold as to hand out bags of feces? Which by the way dont even have enough gold to cover your repair bill. Its insulting, I dont expect gear from everything, loot happens or it doesnt on most bosses. It would be entirely different if you could guarantee (say like when you finally get that boss youve been working on in 10 or 25 man) that you will get there and do it again, but w/ a world boss on a low pop server thats very unlikely. Atleast w/ Sha you had the quest piece of gear, I walked away like ya that was a pain on this server BUT I atleast got something. I feel as though Blizz just doesnt care anymore about balance, Ive opened 4 tickets concerning in game bugs and no reply after a week I just pulled the tickets, (thats 4 weeks of no answer Blizz) and they still havent fixed the problems my accounts started having in Wrath, which is every xpac (and sometimes patches) my rep resets for several factions. It sucks having to continually refarm rep (especially in the daily grind orientated MoP), when this should just be fixed. I dont expect free loot every kill, but could you atleast allow loot xserver? That way if your on a low pop server for world bosses its worth it. You can do it in instances and raids that are xrealm why not on world bosses. Please Blizz, I know that players leaving en masse after MoPs release is not entirely your fault, but due to that can we start balancing servers again and fix all these bugs. I know that if I went to my job with a half finished product and tried to get them to sell it I would get fired. Why should we pay money each month for you to break one off in us by saying "Hey you chose your server." I did indeed do that but when I came here it was a lively vibrant server, not this disgusting ghost town. No one wants to get a "free character migration" to even lower population realm either, thats insulting as well, it is not a solution.
Edited by Protagonist on 3/22/2013 5:03 PM PDT
90 Pandaren Shaman
8865
03/22/2013 03:48 PMPosted by Naumu
Sounds great until you realize someone is going to walk over to your tanks to get them killed by Spitfire Beam.


That goes for anyone, the potential to grief with a Doomwalker type debuff is far too great. I see people who just rush in to chain the Beam already.


Problem: players chaining beam either to intentionally wipe a group and/or unintentionally simply not paying attentions.

Possible solutions:

  • Players who are not elligible for loot are also not elligible targets for beam.
  • Solves: Players of the opposing faction can no longer grief attempts by chaining the beam to players engaged in combat.

    Issues: None that I can see.

  • Only the top X players on Oondasta's threat list are eligible for beam
  • Solves: "One hit wonders" who are only there to tap Oondasta for loot can no longer make attempts more difficult by unintentionally chaining beam to other players.

    Issues: This may encourage more people to tap and then just stand around for free loot without fear of death, exacerbating lag problems in the zone.

  • Players killed by Oondasta are uneligible to ressurect, except by battle rezzes, until Oondasta is killed or resets.
  • Solves: Players may now no longer zerg Oondasta, this also solves the issue of the opposite faction greifing as once a greifer is killed, he is inelligible to rez and grief again.

    Issues: Innocent passers-by may accidentally be killed by a rampaging Oondasta and stuck dead until the group succeeds or fails.


I think the best solution would be combining 1 and 3. That way, innocent players are not unintentionally killed and unable to rez, but the opposing faction can no longer grief legitimate attempts. It also neatly solves the zerg problem. Same faction would be unlikely to grief by chaining the beam to your tanks or healers as they can simply tap Oondasta themselves and still be elligible for loot.

Thoughts?
Edited by Garofalo on 3/22/2013 5:06 PM PDT
90 Troll Hunter
11255
Players who are not elligible for loot are also not elligible targets for beam.


What? pretty sure that'd be pretty hard to do, and I was talking about people sitting next to others purposely chaining off them.
90 Draenei Shaman
10150
I'm very glad I got to enjoy that fight once pre-nerf, but I gotta say, my guild bank will appreciate the lower repairs for guildies on that fight. Oon drained over 30k from the guild bank coffers, and I was contemplating reducing guild repairs.
90 Human Paladin
13215
We didn't down Oondasta in our 4 raid cross realm pull, but it ended up turning into a giant WOrld PvP event when another 4 raids of Horde showed up.

Most fun I've had on WoW in years.

The fact that we only got the boss to 40% seemed rather irrelevant.

To see that he's being turned into a loot piñata to be put on farm by guilds is very disappointing. Why should world bosses be reserved only for guilds?

Bring back Kazzak & the elite dragons @ emerald dream portals pls, and the one from Blasted Lands.

World bosses should be open for anyone in the "world" to kill, not nerfed because guilds complain they can't put it on farm like they did Sha, or because 8 year old servers are failing under load.

Count me as being "anti nerf" in this case. I had more fun that night than I will ever have even if we farm him five hundred times over.
90 Pandaren Shaman
8865
03/22/2013 05:21 PMPosted by Naumu
Players who are not elligible for loot are also not elligible targets for beam.


What? pretty sure that'd be pretty hard to do, and I was talking about people sitting next to others purposely chaining off them.

Yeah, it might be hard to do, but they already have attacks that have checks like proximity, threat, and even class. Loot elligibility shouldn't be *too* hard.

And this would prevent players from camping next to you to intentionally chain off, as long as they're opposite faction. If they're same faction, why are they trying to wipe you? They can just tap, /dance, and get free loot.

If they implemented a check that made only say, the top 30 players on threat eligible for beam, that would also prevent that.
90 Dwarf Death Knight
16130
Same faction would be unlikely to grief by chaining the beam to your tanks or healers as they can simply tap Oondasta themselves and still be elligible for loot.

Your naivete is touching. But same faction would be almost as likely to chain the beams as opposite faction. Either on purpose (plenty of sociopathic players enjoy this sort of thing). Or accidentally out of eagerness to tap the boss, or just trying to help out. And if they are not in your raid group its hard to communicate to tell them to stay out of the way.

Then when my server can do it they spend 3 hours and all ya get is a giant pile of refuse?

Your post is hard to read without paragraph breaks. But I thought making the loot bag a pile of refuse was an amusing touch.
Edited by Murdina on 3/22/2013 6:48 PM PDT
90 Troll Druid
11880
World bosses are exciting and bring the server together. It's great to see over 100+ people in one area attempting to take out such a destructive force. And while I'm sure a lot of super hardcore raiders are upset to see casuals handed another loot pinata, the excitement and comradery make the experience a lot more enjoyable for the whole.

tl;dr I personally wish to see world bosses remain a casual friendly encounter for all to enjoy
90 Human Mage
15430
World bosses are exciting and bring the server together. It's great to see over 100+ people in one area attempting to take out such a destructive force. And while I'm sure a lot of super hardcore raiders are upset to see casuals handed another loot pinata, the excitement and comradery make the experience a lot more enjoyable for the whole.

tl;dr I personally wish to see world bosses remain a casual friendly encounter for all to enjoy


This. I haven't had as much fun playing the game than when I downed him with 4 other raid groups. We wiped, but it was fun and EPIC feeling. Sure, we zerged him, but there's something really crazy awesome about having 200 people beat down a dinosaur while he's tearing through you. And the skeletons, dear God, the skeletons!
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