Some love to Stombolt..?

100 Orc Warrior
5695
Hey i was thinking here about something simple to make stormbolt a little more useful in Pvp and pve when not facing a boss, right not it deals 125% wep damage to pvp players and mobs anf stuns them for 3 sec on a 30 sec cd. That is an incredibly weak hit and for a 30 sec cd it should do better then that. Against bosses its better because of the +375% added bonus damage (even though people still take BB since its still better).

My suggestion would be to shift some of that bonus damage to its baseline so we see something along these lines:

Stormbolt: Hurl your weapon at an enemy, causing 250% weapon Damage and stunning them for 3 sec. Deals an additional 250% weapon damage to targets permanently immune to stuns.

That way in pvp you are able to get a decent size hit and sames goes to mobs in pve and it still stuns, and you still will do the same amount of damage to bosses.

Tl:Dr Stormbolt should have some of the bonus damage shifted into its baseline damage to make it worth picking when facing Pvp players and non boss npcs.
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
15120
03/25/2013 08:58 AMPosted by Rageforce
Would be a better talent if it didnt DR with our other stuns.


wasn't this what got throwdown and warbringer nerfed? messing with DRs is always bad. random stuns? controlled stuns? charge stuns? there have been times when warriors had all three of those all separately DRing. this also coincided with the most ridiculous warrior seasons. do you want to get gutted again?

warrior hard cc is really good, maybe only ferals have better, whats more none of it is fragile and all of it is physical.

stormbolt is very good in pvp, being able to lock down some one at range with out having to charge them is pretty awesome. its just situational, its not very useful in pve, but you have 2 talents on that tier that are good in pve (bb, avatar) and 2 that are good in pvp (avatar, stormbolt)

not every talent needs to be viable in both, as long as its good in one of them its a successful talent.
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100 Orc Warrior
5695
wasn't this what got throwdown and warbringer nerfed? messing with DRs is always bad. random stuns? controlled stuns? charge stuns? there have been times when warriors had all three of those all separately DRing. this also coincided with the most ridiculous warrior seasons. do you want to get gutted again?


Um charge stun is on the random stun table.. there are 2 stun categories random and controlled. So i would check where you got that info

warrior hard cc is really good, maybe only ferals have better, whats more none of it is fragile and all of it is physical.


Lol? ferals have clone, roots and a stun all baseline, warriors have 1.5 min fear and charge stun? Seriously you gotta be trolling

stormbolt is very good in pvp, being able to lock down some one at range with out having to charge them is pretty awesome. its just situational, its not very useful in pve, but you have 2 talents on that tier that are good in pve (bb, avatar) and 2 that are good in pvp (avatar, stormbolt)

not every talent needs to be viable in both, as long as its good in one of them its a successful talent.


Stormbolt is terrible in pvp why? because you give up burst for a ranged cc, sure it does a little bit of damage but not enough to warrant losing actual burst for it, and in pve its not as good because of BB.

Having some of the bonus damage shifted to the baseline damage would be better overall and might make it a little more appealing against mobs in pve
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
15120
Um charge stun is on the random stun table.. there are 2 stun categories random and controlled. So i would check where you got that info


no, charge stun is on the charge stun table it only drs with itself for latency reasons. the random stun table includes stupidity like mace spec. the controlled stun table is things like shockwave and stormbolt

Lol? ferals have clone, roots and a stun all baseline, warriors have 1.5 min fear and charge stun? Seriously you gotta be trolling


i'm not sure what you are getting at, i said feral hard cc was probably better, and roots is not hard cc.

Stormbolt is terrible in pvp why? because you give up burst for a ranged cc, sure it does a little bit of damage but not enough to warrant losing actual burst for it, and in pve its not as good because of BB.


ranged cc is pretty important for a class with minimal ranged capacity. stormbolt doesn't suck, its just harder to use, and more situational then avatar is. god forbid you don't gibb something with stampede/avatar/reck/banner/rapidfire/bestial wrath in the first 10 seconds of a match.

it got a massive damage buff for pve, but its less about it's raw damage, and more about BB's synergy with dragonroar and bleed spreading for aoe in pve.
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100 Orc Warrior
14875
it got a massive damage buff for pve, but its less about it's raw damage, and more about BB's synergy with dragonroar and bleed spreading for aoe in pve.


Dragon Roar is terrible in AoE situations. It splits damage WAY too much. It's only really good against a single target, otherwise the BB bleeds are tiny. I'd wager that blood and thunder puts out a bigger bleed in AoE situations.
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
15120
Dragon Roar is terrible in AoE situations. It splits damage WAY too much. It's only really good against a single target, otherwise the BB bleeds are tiny. I'd wager that blood and thunder puts out a bigger bleed in AoE situations.


fury does not have blood and thunder.
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100 Orc Warrior
14875
fury does not have blood and thunder.


And? I said Dragon Roar+BB in an AoE situation is probably less effective than blood and thunder, not that fury has it. Unless it's trash, I'm not going to use my DR and BB on more than 1 target if I can help it, I'll WW and RB cleave instead.

Besides, don't you have someone in The Maldives to hate on for no reason?
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90 Gnome Warrior
8110
I agree, making storm bolt equivalent to a blade storm tick doesn't make it appealing. Not at all. Dmg could help but why don't they just make it decent utility?

I'm not bashing your idea I think either could work, but something has to be done with it.
Edited by Madicus on 3/25/2013 5:22 PM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Warrior
15120
Besides, don't you have someone in The Maldives to hate on for no reason?


they probably have better internet then i do in the maldives. reason enough to hate on them

. I'd wager that blood and thunder puts out a bigger bleed in AoE situations.


And? I said Dragon Roar+BB in an AoE situation is probably less effective than blood and thunder


fury does not have blood and thunder therefor it can't be more effective then using dragonroar to spread it

dragonroar is the only option in tier 60 for pve outside of maybe a gimmick add control fight.
outside of another heroic spine situation, you are also going to be taking BB on tier 90.

i'm at a loss for how you are not seeing the synergy between those two.

i always forget about dragonroar so i tend to use whirlwind and meatcleaver to spread my bleeds, but i dislike fury :D
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100 Orc Warrior
14875
03/25/2013 05:50 PMPosted by Idoma
Besides, don't you have someone in The Maldives to hate on for no reason?


they probably have better internet then i do in the maldives. reason enough to hate on them

. I'd wager that blood and thunder puts out a bigger bleed in AoE situations.


And? I said Dragon Roar+BB in an AoE situation is probably less effective than blood and thunder


fury does not have blood and thunder therefor it can't be more effective then using dragonroar to spread it

dragonroar is the only option in tier 60 for pve outside of maybe a gimmick add control fight.
outside of another heroic spine situation, you are also going to be taking BB on tier 90.

i'm at a loss for how you are not seeing the synergy between those two.

i always forget about dragonroar so i tend to use whirlwind and meatcleaver to spread my bleeds, but i dislike fury :D


Let me spell it out for you: Using DR on more than 1 target to 'spread bleeds' is a poor use of both DR and BB. When DR hits more than 1 target it starts splitting damage, and since BB is based on the damage dealt, it's ticks get reduced as well. Instead of putting a 50k bleed on the boss, you're putting 3k bleeds on a bunch of adds. DR may be on the 'AoE' tier, but it's hardly a real AoE ability, and trying to use it as one gives poor results.
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90 Human Warrior
14640
Stormbolt is actually a dps increase over bloodbath for a non engineer arms warrior from memory looking at sims, but then again it also requires a little more skill in it's usage for it to be indeed a dps increase. So Stormbolt does have a place in PvE :).

Dragon Roar is terrible in AoE situations


Get out now.
Edited by Greìl on 3/25/2013 8:01 PM PDT
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1 Tauren Shaman
0
03/25/2013 04:09 PMPosted by Garrum
Dragon Roar is terrible in AoE situations.
Lolwat
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100 Orc Warrior
14875
Stormbolt is actually a dps increase over bloodbath for a non engineer arms warrior from memory looking at sims, but then again it also requires a little more skill in it's usage for it to be indeed a dps increase. So Stormbolt does have a place in PvE :).

Dragon Roar is terrible in AoE situations


Get out now.


Let's see, I can DR+BB a group for piddly damage or I can bladestorm+BB a group for retarded damage, what will I pick?
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90 Night Elf Warrior
12470
Stormbolt is more likely higher DPS in raid encounters when Execute phases are really short.

Otherwise, Bloodbath is too good to ignore at the end - doing Executes with Bloodbath up is ridiculous. 30% of 200k-500k Executes? Yes please!
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90 Orc Warrior
9910
Tl:Dr Stormbolt should have some of the bonus damage shifted into its baseline damage to make it worth picking when facing Pvp players and non boss npcs.


It's already worth picking up. Having a Stun ability that does dmg is great. They already gave it love with a 25% dmg buff.

Doubling this up with shock wave, you can really control a team. Use it to set up cc with your teammates. Stop heals, dmg, and cc.
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100 Orc Warrior
17040
03/25/2013 08:01 PMPosted by Kangamooster
Dragon Roar is terrible in AoE situations.
Lolwat


He's right. DR is good single target, but it's awful for AoE.
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90 Human Warrior
9055
How about adding another mechanic to it? I don't think it's situational feeling needs to be altered, but rather the actual ability adjusted slightly so it can be present in more situations.

If the target is on Stun DR, increase the damage for when Storm Bolt hits to the 300% it is now. This lets it take advantage of other Classes large amounts of Stuns, and increases Warrior Skill Cap.

If the target is permanently immune to Stuns, increase the 300% it will do now to 500%.

This takes advantage of both the amount of CC in this game being too high overall while not adding anymore CC to the problem. It also doesn't set any Class up for a Buff or Nerf.

Maybe if it's Range was also increased to 40 Yards, it would guarantee that you can hit a caster with it at any time, so long as they can hit you. This would also give it more use at times that a Boss pulls out a certain mechanic and doesn't allow you near them.

I feel that Warriors are balanced by a 'Situational Offensive/Defensive' design. This is highly present in Defensive Stance and the recent change to Shockwave. Taking a look at those two abilities together, we can see that, while taking Damage reduces ours, it also reduces Damage done to us by using situational CC to get back on our feet.

By continuing to balance more around this design, we can get into a position where taking large amounts of Damage gives us more Defense while dealing large amounts of Damage doesn't gimp the other player.

Balancing around this design guarantees that balance is noticeable and apparent while having the outcome of the fight still be dependent on a Players skill and not entirely their Class. It also holds true to Blizzards current talent design of giving the Player their independent choice of play without hindering a Class overall.
Edited by Draw on 3/26/2013 9:50 AM PDT
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100 Orc Warrior
5695
Another Idea is to make stormbolt baseline, keep its damage at 125% wep damage, and replace it with something else such as:

Deadly Calm
1.5 min cd
You enter a battle trance, causing all abilities that cost rage to become free. last 6 sec. while under the effects your speed is increased by 30%.

Then we have baseline utility plus a another actual damage cd on that tier.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
15120
Let me spell it out for you: Using DR on more than 1 target to 'spread bleeds' is a poor use of both DR and BB. When DR hits more than 1 target it starts splitting damage, and since BB is based on the damage dealt, it's ticks get reduced as well. Instead of putting a 50k bleed on the boss, you're putting 3k bleeds on a bunch of adds. DR may be on the 'AoE' tier, but it's hardly a real AoE ability, and trying to use it as one gives poor results.


so boss dps is more importantly then clearing adds quickly? both are short enough that they will be up again by the time i need to swap back.

but i will bow to your obviously superior raid experience.

i can't blood and thunder bleeds around because i am fury i can meatcleaver and dragonroar them around. or do you suggest i go arms for raiding?

either way. stormbolt doesn't need to be good for pve, its already good for pvp. just like BB doesn't need to be good for pvp.
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