Rain of Fire in rotation?

90 Worgen Warlock
9185
Considering the fact the our kill time was almost a minute longer than yours and I did 11k more than you, i wouldn't consider that identical.
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90 Orc Warlock
8265
You are also in 25m with access to more buffs than I had. I don't see the possibility of keeping it up at that high uptime without going oom from my experience. Glad it works for you but telling someone they should be shooting for 80% uptime on RoF is just asking for trouble. It completely depends on your Grimoire and your reforge among many other things.

You went Haste first I'm assuming since you were going GoSup. I was GoSac with haste last. Very different situations.
Edited by Loktronotron on 3/29/2013 1:58 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Warlock
9185
All I said was when 80% was possible, even then I said it depended on a few things. But eh, sorry if I came off harsher than I should have, oh well, I'm done with this now.
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90 Orc Warlock
8265
I'm not saying it's not possible. It clearly is. I think even with a lower haste build once you get up to heroic level gear you're going to be using RoF as a DoT anyway. It's just something that can easily ruin a rotation if you don't know how to use it. There shouldn't be a % people should be trying for imo, just hit whatever you can while watching your mana.
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90 Undead Warlock
13160
If you're running destro you should be casting RoF every 8 seconds.


I don't think we have enough mana regen to keep it up 100%
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90 Troll Warlock
HC
9785
I'll say this one more time...ONE MORE TIME...

OOMING =/= BAD THING.
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90 Gnome Warlock
12620
I just do it after an immolate. Easier to manage even though it only lasts for half as long.

Having to worry about DoTs getting 100% uptime defeats the entire point of being destro.


Warlock have always been a DoT class. And keeping dots up isn't a challenge at all thanks to pandemic.
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90 Undead Warlock
13160
I'll say this one more time...ONE MORE TIME...

OOMING =/= BAD THING.


I am guessing that you spam Fel Flame then?
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90 Troll Warlock
HC
9785
I'll say this one more time...ONE MORE TIME...

OOMING =/= BAD THING.


I am guessing that you spam Fel Flame then?


RoF does more damage than incinerate on average
RoF generate more embers on average than one cast of incinerate
RoF costs 15k more mana, and doesn't benefit from backdraft
RoF has a higher ember generate per mana spent ratio than incinerate regardless of the higher mana cost
During backdraft, incinerate pulls ahead

So I ask you again, if it does more damage, gives you more embers for less mana, why then would casting that incinerate and not ooming in any way shape or form be better than casting the RoF and ooming?

Ooming: Your RoF does more damage and you get more embers/mana, same regen rate
Not ooming: Less damage, less embers/mana, same regen rate.

The only thing that changes is that you GET MORE OUT OF IT.
Edited by Gahhda on 3/30/2013 12:28 AM PDT
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90 Undead Warlock
13160


So I ask you again, if it does more damage, gives you more embers for less mana, why then would casting that incinerate and not ooming in any way shape or form be better than casting the RoF and ooming?


Because then you are just left sitting there for periods of time unable to do anything because you have no mana.
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90 Orc Warlock
13705
Because then you are just left sitting there for periods of time unable to do anything because you have no mana.


So would it be better if RoF had a cast time equal to Incinerate's and that prevented you from going OOM?

No.

That time spent OOM is time that would have otherwise been spent casting Incinerate for less embers and less damage.
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90 Undead Warlock
13160
/shrug, as soon as devs catch wind of it being an increase single target they'll nerf it anyway.


I have been using RoF single target since Beta, actually.

I have not gotten close to 100% uptime on it tho, and am still skeptical that current gear levels allow it to be so optimally.
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90 Troll Warlock
HC
9785
I have been using RoF single target since Beta, actually.

I have not gotten close to 100% uptime on it tho, and am still skeptical that current gear levels allow it to be so optimally.

yeah but only recently is it proving to be a consistent dps increase to maintain uptime on it.


I proved that half way through last tier. I've been telling them about it for give or take 3 months with mathematical evidence to support my case. They have done nothing.

This falls under the 'slight gain for clever use of game mechanics' department. As long is its less than a 2% dps increase, they shouldn't change anything. It isn't mandatory, it is simply a way to get a slight dps increase by changing your playstyle.

Nerfing RoF also effects destro aoe, which doesn't need a nerf. I've also suggested multiple ways they can fix it via buffs to other abilities, to no avail. Welcome to blizzard land.
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90 Undead Warlock
13530
I find that Rain of Fire is useful for a number of things:
A high amount of ember generation with the least amount of time spent to apply it. For one GCD, you get an 8 second buff that randomly generates embers, while dealing damage with multiple chances to crit. It also functions as a DoT, making it similar to a second Immolate in terms of proccing trinkets.

Keeping away from the mana cap. If you're going through a burn phase, and going to be casting 3~4 chaos bolts, why wouldn't you drop RoF inbetween one of those casts while you won't be spending any mana? If anything, it might allow enough ember generation along with Immolate to add in an extra chaos bolt into the mix.

Damage. It might not seem like much because it hits for small amounts of damage, while only buffed when hitting immolated targets (which should always be happening anyways), but thousands of little hits adds up pretty well.

If you have issues managing mana, don't use it. If you can throw RoF out in the after-cast of an Incinerate or Chaos Bolt where the GCD is less of an issue without actually running OOM, go for it, it will provide a small damage boost over the course of the fight even on single-target encounters.
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90 Human Warlock
16820


I proved that half way through last tier. I've been telling them about it for give or take 3 months with mathematical evidence to support my case. They have done nothing.



I'd be interested in seeing this math. I'm not denying it's validity, I use rain myself, but I would like to see what you mathed out. Especially, if the downtime(not casting), while oom is being subtracted from the gains.

Like you said backdrafted incinerate beats rain, so really you'd want to be fitting rain in during the non backdraft incinerate times, and if that time led to being oom, I'd think it wouldn't be 1 non backdraft incinerate you compare it to, but it would have to be 2. Though that would depend on where you are with haste and your mana regen.
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