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1) We do raid
2) We do RBGs
Most of the people on this server who aren't experienced generally don't have the will to become experienced, because they have fun doing what they find fun, and most of the time that doesn't require experience. Only way to learn how to play your character is by playing your character, and doing any minor background research. mmo-champion.com and elitistjerks.com (if you're a number guy/gal) generally have awesome threads for discussion, and sometimes the WoW forums do too. If you want to find out stat weights and such yourself, simcraft is a good application that allows you to simulate what you character can do.
There's plenty of information available to the player-base online, you just have to search for it.
Wowhead is probably my favourite website, and I feel like it's underused half the time cause people are always asking questions that can be answered in a quick search.
I think he was referring to inexperience in an actual raid/pvp environment and not just character knowledge. Booksmarts is all nice and good but useless unless you have an actual reason to apply it. My Mom for example does alot of research into how to play her hunter but only has LFR to apply it in a raid setting (inner group raid team). Back in BC Zerra(?) used to put together Gruul runs for people who could not get a 25 man raid team together so that the server could get more raid experience, maybe something simillar could be applied here.
The issue is that the server has two majorly different personalities that cause bringing these two personalities to be very hard, and often causing people to get angry, or people to say "Calm down bro, it's just a game." enraging others even more. I personally wouldn't be in favour of joining these raids, mostly because I get frustrated quite easily (rarely voiced though) when people die to silly mechanics, even in Eolithic's raids. The more "calm" personalities on the server would most likely not enjoy raiding with me, or others like me. It's basically the same way a guild functions, if people get mad in a casual guild, then they no longer raid with the casual guild.
There's also the issue of server population. In the past we tried to make MSV pug raids, with very little people wanting to do it, and we always struggled to collect the last few people, and if we somehow managed it, we then had to spend time explaining fights to people who had never done the raid before, never looked up the fight on youtube, never looked at the dungeon journal, and most of the time lack the skill and/or gear to perform to the standard we expect to down a boss.
Well, as a member of a sort of casual guild, I don't raid or do RBGs much (okay, a Shaman probably doesn't belong in an RBG), but that's also because a lot of our members love playing alts and such, which makes it hard to gear up any one character (I only managed it by just ignoring my alts, which makes me sad). We used to do both, but that was during Cata, which people whined about because there was nothing to do because they were a bunch of whiny little babies and now we have MoP... *Ahem.* Getting off on a tangent.
Anyway, thanks to its nature, we do have plenty of helpful members and all. Which makes me happy, because occasionally I might need a touch of help.
We used to raid Goldshire and all for fun, but CRZ means you're now looking at a lot more people there, which can get nasty. (Ironically, it also means that when they call for help, it's a roll of the dice as to whether those people will end up in the proper instance of Elwynn to be able to help.)
I don't know what more people want in the realm... I've seen some raiding guilds and other types, at least Horde side. I see plenty of people out and about, and they're willing to lend a hand. So... what more do you want?
If you were Alliance, I guess I could understand... I pulled my top Alliance character over (I maintain a max Alliance so I can see both sides of the story), but ended up in a dead guild, and I have no idea whether there's a good Alliance guild or not. I'll have to look around for one.
This server is dying, people are either transferring or quitting but we might be able to make a comeback on this server just throwing out ideas here but maybe some of the guilds can get together and raid? maybe start a couple RBGS or something, also attack towns and cities and be more open with inexperienced players and show them how to do something it would step our game up and maybe get more people to transfer here. Some people are already backing me up on this to PST me or send me some ingame mail if you wish to talk about it and help me out with this "plan". Thanks!
This server is dying
server is dying
Try Ally side sometime on this server.
Been there done that and I have to agree it's definitely better Horde side on this server.
The server isn't dying it's mostly that the there are people who try, and then there are people who expect to get carried simply because they play the game.
The players who try typically exclude the lesser skilled people, and are labeled elitist or other negative terms.
*Actually learn your class*
*Suck up to Coker befriending him can get you a long way*
*No Shaman In Rbgs Ever*
Originally I had a long-!@# post about this thread- here's the TLDR version:
1. People from the progression guilds need to make themselves more visible, and in a nice, non-elitist way. You lead the server in downing bosses, but it benefits all of us if you interact with the community more. I'm sure this server has had iconic figures in the past that have offered tips, tricks and free online booze to whoever asked for it- newer, unskilled players with role models/mentors improve.
**Not to call out a specific guild, but, I know Chinese Take-Out is one of the most progressed guilds on our server, and I don't know a single person in it.**
2. Be more open minded. Seriously. If you're trying to pug someone, before going to Openraid to find that awesome 200k+ fury warrior in Herioc Throne gear (I know they exist, one is on my BNET friends list :D) try trade chat. Sure, some people may pull only 40k on an AOE pack. It happens- that's why it's called pugging. At least you've given them a shot- with some coaching and a tip of advice or two, people can surprise you. Personally, I have found that it's possible to carry people that die off in the start of a fight (in old content), given a decent group with a few friends in it. If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. Explain why, and if they're asses about it, oh well- they won't get invited back or checked on to see if they've improved.
**I know this is slightly hypocritical, as I have minimum requirements myself- I stress reasonable judgement and being a bit more lenient.**
3. Recruit! You rockstar guilds- I'm looking at you again! There are plenty of players out there, and I'm sure you have friends from other servers. With tools like BNET and Openraid, realms are much more flexible. Convincing a few knowledgeable, skilled players to roll an alt on Terrokar can help grow the pool of raiding players.
4. Initiative. All the moaning and groaning that the server is dying, that Terrokar is terribad... it doesn't help. Like I like to say when I'm losing in a twink lowbie PVP bracket- if you're going to QQ, leave. The true baddies are the ones who complain about issues and then do nothing about it.
Still long. Sorry. I think I'll log on later tonight to troll people and start a PUG lulz. So, about that Delver title....
In response to Celeinicus:
1. Many Eolithic raiders have alts that rarely get to raid. Such as today, I went on my 2nd raid this tier on my alts, and this isn't because I refuse to go with groups, it's because whenever I'm standing around doing nothing, nobody else is doing anything. I've just now started up a potential alt run for this Saturday, and will most likely be pugging a few if we have open spots. Hell, I've even been to a few of your raids for no reason aside from being bored and wanting to help people out.
2. I'm sorry, but I'm not going to spend multiple hours teaching someone that you can put an orange gem in a red socket, or that gemming is even a thing. And while you may be open to advice, the majority of this server plays with the "I know how to play my own class, thank you very much" attitude. Pertaining to the dps, if you can't pull your own weight, you don't deserve to be in the group. And "your own weight" doesn't mean you have to do the same dps as my ilvl 536 monk if you have 502 ilvl from LFR, it means doing as much as your class can do when played by a human, and know how to play you class. Boss mechanics can be taught in 5min and a couple of wipes, but teaching someone their entire class is another story.
3. The thing is, the "rockstar guilds" are 10 man guilds, and with that come very little room to recruit. As of right now, I believe Eolithic has maybe 13 raiders, if we recruit anymore then it will lead to people not getting in as often, and then leaving as they want a more consistent raid group. As far as convincing people to come to Terokkar, nobody will and for quite a good reason, and if they do, they leave within the next few weeks.
4. There's nothing we can do about it, as the same playerbase that is whining is killing itself by not taking the personal initiative to better themselves. No one is perfect, and everyone has something to improve on, whether you're 13/13H or if you just hit 90. It's not my job, nor anybody else's job but the player's to learn how to play their own class, and if they aren't willing to do so, then they will remain in the pool of players who come in a patch later to clear normal for the first time.
Good players do get noticed, whether they have gear or not, and those good players are worth spending the time to help out, and gear up. People expecting others to do everything for them, people who believe that they have nothing to improve on, and people who think "Oh it's just a game, why should I research anything about it?" have no right to complain about the server's population, progression, or any other common complaint.
Edited by Badger on 6/14/2013 11:07 PM PDT
Honestly Badger, I think you're one of the guys that has done everything that can be expected of someone trying to help the server, within reason. I'm just a sadistic jackass that loves to torture myself with pugging (e.g. Challenge Mode pugs with strangers, no feast/flasks, and no voice communication -_____-). I know you aren't going to coach somebody through learning their entire class, but if someone asks, they're trying to learn- a tip like "Use Holy Light as filler instead of Flash of Light" to a healing paladin can make them not go OOM. I think paying more attention to the small things can make a big difference. Other than that, I totally understand your sentiments, man. Check out the patch notes- Blizzard is coming out with some realm changes that could help.
**On a separate note, because I get work off today, if I see you recruiting for your alt run, I'd love to go and get some cheevos.**
Krag, dude u have been tryign so hard to try and get together some sort of thing together where people would start transffering over like they used to back in cata. ever sense MOP (and i had just come back) it seems like its a waste land now. but im always seeing u try to get people to sign up for world pvp and rbgs and all the good stuff. and beleave me it works. especially the World pvp when ever im streaming and u and your friends try and gank me, but dude keep it up, ur doing good. that "pvp chat" that u have going on is pretty handy, more people should have it.
Edited by Sathenis on 4/23/2014 10:22 AM PDT
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