The Alliance: Giving in to our Troll lords

90 Night Elf Rogue
14280
I read these two articles on Wow Insider recently.

http://wow.joystiq.com/2013/04/14/know-your-lore-what-is-the-alliance-missing/

http://wow.joystiq.com/2013/04/15/another-take-what-is-the-alliance-missing

I thought these both were pretty astounding with how right they sound. Honestly it is true, the Alliance is not getting nearly the amount of, significant, victories that the players need to feel like badasses. The articles were pretty clear that we got our asses handed to us in the Cataclysm and even in Mists, we are still being beaten by and just watching as Garrosh gathers a metric ton of superweapons and titan artifacts. The Seige of Orgrimmar seemed like it was finally going to be an Alliance win but now it is evident that Varian is giving the reins to Vol'jin who by rights has far too few of forces to actually win this uprising. I read some of the comments on that first article and someone made a point that this should be the shattering of the Horde as we know it. We don't have to slaughter them, but we need to break them to the point that they aren't even a threat anymore. The Alliance as been collectively beaten and sassed by Horde leaders while our own sit by and do nothing, looking at you Tyrande/Malfurion/Council/Mekkatorque. Where is the Worgen justice we deserve and with Garrosh maintaining his forces in a locked down Orgrimmar, how is it possible he is still in Night Elf lands? I want some other opinions on this and how Blizzard can let us sit by while we become Horde to help Vol'jin REUNITE the damned Horde to just later again become a threat.
Edited by Felradin on 4/17/2013 11:36 AM PDT
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55 Draenei Death Knight
470
Actually voljin have a lot of forces. Lets do my favorite plot counting forces under Vol jin command.

All the dark spear trolls
All the taurens under Baine
All the blood elves undr lor themar
All the goblins of kezan because of thrall and profit.
All the forsaken which hate being under the Korkron thumb, I fully expect the Korkorn forces in undercity to get wiped out.
The frostwolves clan, and those that are Thrall loyalist.

Garrosh forces are only half the orcs and that's being generous.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
14280
Not yet he doesn't. The Blood Elves and the Forsaken are all still in either Pandaria or in the Eastern Kingdoms. The Kor'kron have a stranglehold on the Darkspear at the moment it seems and Baine can't do anything as long as a good number of his Tauren are stuck inside of Orgrimmar. How are the Orcs going to be a driving force at all in the Horde after this if so many are siding with Garrosh. Anyhow, I still think the Alliance should leave the Horde to their own devices and not throw in with the Seige but to sit back and let them destroy themselves. After that, we have a great opportunity to just stride in and demolish the remaining forces until there is no chance of them returning the "favor" and just having Vol'Jin betray us later on. That or we stroll up and get Gilneas back while Sylvanas is distracted. Hell, force her out of the Eastern Kingdoms altogether for all the !@#$ she has put us through
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90 Troll Shaman
5420
Just a few things to correct here. Firstly, that first link isn't an article, it's a picture. Secondly: Paragraphs. Use them. Thirdly, the whole "The Alliance was getting whooped in Cataclysm and MoP" thing is a load. Fourth, there are no fewer than three threads dedicated to this subject still on the front page, and there's no reason to zerg rush the Story Forums with another one.

Furthermore, there's zero support for this idea that the Alliance is deferring all authority to Vol'jin, whereas there is evidence the Alliance will be acting independently from (albeit concurrently with) the Darkspear Rebellion.

Lastly, this little fantasy that the Horde should be, for all intents and purposes, removed as a playable faction, is nothing short of insane.
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55 Draenei Death Knight
470
Patch 5.3 is the start of his revolution. Whencthe horde get on his side, not if but when which seems soon. Then the Horde could dethrone garrosh easily.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
14280
First, I fixed the picture to make it what I had meant to link.

Second, really? You are concerned about that small of of post and it needing paragraphs?

Third, give me an example of how the Alliance won territory or a battle that the Horde hasn't already taken back from us. Otherwise don't tell me it is a "load"

In response to your Alliance ISN'T throwing in with Vol'jin comment. The new faction is called the Darkspear Rebellion. There is no Alliance equivalent.

I never said the Horde is to be removed, you said that. I am saying that they need to be beaten back and shown that the Alliance will not just be little play toys and punching bags like we have been for this and last expansion.
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90 Troll Hunter
10125
I love the title of the thread.
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90 Troll Shaman
5420
Third, give me an example of how the Alliance won territory or a battle that the Horde hasn't already taken back from us. Otherwise don't tell me it is a "load"

All of Ashenvale. All of Stonetalon. All of Darkshore. All of Felwood. Swamp of Sorrows. Feralas. Badlands. Thousand Needles. Southern Barrens. Durotar. Gilneas.

The Alliance wasn't losing in Cataclysm, and it sure as hell isn't losing now.

The Alliance's assistance of the Darkspear Rebellion in 5.3 (not 5.4) is being handled unambiguously as a means for the Alliance to achieve an end. The rebels are a tool to be used by the Alliance, and from whatinformation we've gotten so far, the Alliance's forces in 5.4 will work independently, if concurrently, with the Horde rebels.

There are no grounds to say the Alliance is being subordinated to Vol'jin.

And while you may not have said you wanted the Horde removed in so many words, but the crux of your argument wants to see all Horde presence removed from an entire continent and for the entire playable faction to be made irrelevant in all future content.

You are effectively asking they be removed for all intents and purposes.
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All of Ashenvale. All of Stonetalon. All of Darkshore. All of Felwood. Swamp of Sorrows. Feralas. Badlands. Thousand Needles. Southern Barrens. Durotar. Gilneas.


7/10 Alliance players will never know of the supposed victory of Wolfheart in Ashenvale.

Stonetalon was a definate loss. No matter what you say, we tried to save a druid school, and we failed at that.

Darkshore was a huge depressing scene on how our people got roflpwned in Ashenvale.

Felwood is largely unknown of it's fate. And the Alliance clearly had not a single victory there.

Swamp of Sorrows victory was piss-poor represented. It may be an Alliance victory, but the game showed absolutely no display of such. The only reason Swamp of Sorrows is around is for the stupid portal, where as the Alliance losing Theramore and a death drop for teleporting there is perfectly fine.

Badlands had no over-arching victory or loss. It is still lacking any type of Alliance victory, and the Gilnean zone in the bottom did not support the war.

Feralas was a zone with little Horde/Alliance interaction.

Thousand needles had Alliance and Horde working together to get the Horde zone back.

Southern Barrens was the ultimate loss. We lost a dwarven settlement, and with Tides of W. Northwatch was decimated by Molten Giant Elementals, Honor Stand is abandoned of soldiers, presumably all killed.

Gilneas? Oh please, that zone is "apparently alliance held, although nothing indicates such crap".

Durotar is Horde ground, our attempt at getting a hold ended up with the Northwatch regiments gtting slaughtered.

Alliance lost more than won, kid. Cataclysm butchered any possible victory for ourselves. We were on the losing side and it was surprising we were even called a faction for how easily the Horde stomped us around.
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90 Night Elf Hunter
17875
Garrosh is going to have an army empowered by an Old God and the highest powered Titan tech in the world. Alliance or Horde solo would lose horribly against him.

Also, I agree the game is too Horde Biased. We need to have a parallel. Where are my quests to kill all the Humans in Elywnn forest in 5.3 leading up to 5.4 when we raze SW and kill Varian?
Edited by Threeslotbag on 4/17/2013 12:33 PM PDT
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55 Draenei Death Knight
470
Garrosh is going to have an army empowered by an Old God and the highest powered Titan tech in the world. Alliance or Horde solo would lose horribly against him.


Ulduar,Lick king,death wing and a demoic invasion says high. As they say in Oklahoma," This ain't our first rodeo." Yee haw, we gonna hog tide Garrosh without breaking a sweat. I'm sorry but Garrosh is not on that level. Heck he lost to Thrall and now Thrall's returning.
Edited by Crappytank on 4/17/2013 12:36 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Priest
15015
Garrosh is going to have an army empowered by an Old God and the highest powered Titan tech in the world. Alliance or Horde solo would lose horribly against him.

Also, I agree the game is too Horde Biased. We need to have a parallel. Where are my quests to kill all the Humans in Elywnn forest in 5.3 leading up to 5.4 when we raze SW and kill Varian?


Why does this matter? We've fought and defeated actual titans and old gods along with all their minions and won.
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90 Draenei Monk
16325
At least they aren't human.
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90 Troll Hunter
13200
We've fought and defeated actual titans and old gods along with all their minions and won.

We've never fought Titans before.

And, are you saying you want to do that again? Just throwing troops at something doesn't make it go away, especially Old Gods. For all we know, Garrosh's fiddling with the Heart will infect he rest of Azeroth with the Sha. You know what that means!

No more hatred, doubt, violence, fear, anger, despair, or pride.

Saying, "We've beat worse before!" Is like saying you want to fight WW2 again. Why not? We won!
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90 Night Elf Rogue
14280
Thank you Kinria for saying what I was about to say. It is pretty obvious Kellick has no idea what he is talking about. Gilneas won? If you claim that lands overly destroyed by the plague is "won" then you are as insane as you claim I am. Durotaur has no Alliance presence anymore and neither does the barrens due to Tides of War. Claiming we "won" Darkshore is like claiming we have won Tel'Drassil. We already had it dude. If we are going by your standards, the Horde won Orgrimmar!
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90 Troll Hunter
13200
The Alliance was winning in Cataclysm.

It was not well represented, but they were indeed winning. They were actively assaulting two Horde Starting Zones and pushed the Horde back on every front except Hillsbrad. Meanwhile, Stormwind and the other Alliance cities lived in safe security while Orgrimmar and Thunder Bluff could have been attacked at any moment - And Orgrimmar, at one point, was attacked.

Tides of War made the war equal.
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90 Night Elf Rogue
14280
If Orgrimmar and TB could have been attacked at "any moment", then why didn't we? It was so easy for the Horde to stomp the Alliance in Cata so that makes me think they weren't such a easy target to begin with or else they just magically made hundreds of new orc, tauren and troll forces right when Deathwing blew up the world so that they could take advantage of such an upheaval.
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90 Troll Hunter
13200
04/17/2013 12:51 PMPosted by Felradin
If Orgrimmar and TB could have been attacked at "any moment", then why didn't we?

You did attack Orgrimmar. Luckily, the player was there to stop the attack.

Also, because the Great Gate held up, the Alliance couldn't get into Mulgore. But they were actively siegeing it until Tides of War.
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90 Night Elf Hunter
17875
Thank you Kinria for saying what I was about to say. It is pretty obvious Kellick has no idea what he is talking about. Gilneas won? If you claim that lands overly destroyed by the plague is "won" then you are as insane as you claim I am. Durotaur has no Alliance presence anymore and neither does the barrens due to Tides of War. Claiming we "won" Darkshore is like claiming we have won Tel'Drassil. We already had it dude. If we are going by your standards, the Horde won Orgrimmar!


Gilneas was won by the Alliance, is 100% under Alliance control up to the wall, and there's no plague any more. Blizzard hasn't updated it, but even at the end of the Cata quests that's how it stood.
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90 Worgen Priest
15015
04/17/2013 12:38 PMPosted by Pyronaptor
We've fought and defeated actual titans and old gods along with all their minions and won.

We've never fought Titans before.

And, are you saying you want to do that again? Just throwing troops at something doesn't make it go away, especially Old Gods. For all we know, Garrosh's fiddling with the Heart will infect he rest of Azeroth with the Sha. You know what that means!

No more hatred, doubt, violence, fear, anger, despair, or pride.

Saying, "We've beat worse before!" Is like saying you want to fight WW2 again. Why not? We won!


Well not titans no, but their constructs. We've beaten Elegon, Algalon, and Lei-Shin after all and Garry can't have anything more powerful than that. We've also bested all the constructs in Ulduar and Yogg with a band of heros and the Explorers league.

Really, what danger does he pose that we haven't already proven perfectly capable of beating? Hell, we even beat the sha that you're so worried about manifesting on the rest of Azeroth.
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