Enhance Aoe

100 Troll Shaman
11965
Is this even on the discussion table for developers? It seems like its being ignored, any insight would be awesome.
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94 Draenei Shaman
18960
It isn't bad, just awkward to use. I'll admit to frustration sometimes that I don't have on demand aoe like a dk or a mage does, for instance, but our aoe isn't exactly pitiful.
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89 Draenei Warrior
4700
Not every spec needs to be great at everything. Our AoE is ok, it used to be worse. Our single target is great though and we have good utility. I doubt it will change anytime soon.
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100 Tauren Shaman
18200
I wouldn't be surprised if they're looking at it, but I don't know that we'll see any big changes before the end of the expansion.
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100 Tauren Shaman
19625
Enhance Aoe is great for big piles of targets, sure it's not as straightforward as swipe or fan of knives. A well spread flame shock onto bats on Tortos, now you're in the money. Especially if you're talented for Echo of the elements. Glyph of chain lightning helps too.

As with all AoE it's situational, and a modicum of planning means you'll be able to compete. We do have great single target, and on Megeara I did 15 million off heals between Ancestral Guidance, free healing rains and my healing stream totem.
Edited by Hamnurabi on 4/19/2013 2:32 PM PDT
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100 Goblin Shaman
16265
It's bad design and I can only hope that it's on the table for a mechanics rework. Those mechanics frustrate me every single time I have to AE anything. I absolutely hate those bees and grub quests or those little sprites for the celestial dragon dailies and I feel useless and annoyed for every single form of AE that shows up during any sort of raid or quest encounter.

I wish they would either take the time to fix fire nova's mechanics or just give up on it entirely. We have enough buttons as it is so maybe dump the spell and then just buff the hell out of magma totem to compensate for the lost AE damage. I know I would be much happier with that then the cluster frak system we have been saddled with now.

I thought maybe it was that I had just gotten back to the game. That the mechanics might grow on me or that I would find encounters where they just worked so well that it would make up for how awful they were while leveling. If anything my experience has been the exact opposite and I find myself hating the spell more with every single play session.
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90 Draenei Shaman
15135
Bring back fire totems centered Fire Novas...nuff said. Giving enhance earthquake might be nice. Or maybe implement a version of the buff those trolls put on themselves in ZG and ZA. The one that creates a random earthquake at a location.
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91 Dwarf Shaman
7085
I could see them adding something in the future, but this probably isn't considered a huge issue because we don't totally lack aoe. I could see them buffing our CL slightly, (without buffing ele CL more lol) that's about it.

04/19/2013 02:31 PMPosted by Hamnurabi
A well spread flame shock onto bats on Tortos, now you're in the money. Especially if you're talented for Echo of the elements. Glyph of chain lightning helps too.


Exactly. We might not be able to do as well at multi-dotting on fightly like council, but several classes struggle at that. On Tortos, spread FS onto bats. Keep single targeting the boss, but squeeze Fire Nova into the rotation during the parts that you're "waiting." You can do the something similar on Primordius. If mutated and tunneling boss, turn around for 2 GCDs and spread FS on some of the fluids. Once again, return to tunneling boss, but squeeze Fire Nova in there.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
13975
Bring back fire totems centered Fire Novas...nuff said. Giving enhance earthquake might be nice. Or maybe implement a version of the buff those trolls put on themselves in ZG and ZA. The one that creates a random earthquake at a location.


Oh so it can be completely immobile and then we can complain about how we constantly have to redrop magma totem to do a pitiful fire nova that barely covers 10 yards?

Do you not remember how awful ICC wrath and early cata were? The new AoE looks amazing compared to that, but it was a bandaid mechanic that needed a real design implemented an expansion ago.

Earthquake is already taken by ele anyway, I'd rather they keep it and we get fire nova worked into something that is fun. I have 4 bars of buttons, that's enough as is.

I could see them adding something in the future, but this probably isn't considered a huge issue because we don't totally lack aoe. I could see them buffing our CL slightly, (without buffing ele CL more lol) that's about it.


it's not the issue that we "lack" it, the issue is it's annoying to play with compared to every other class in the game. An enh shaman shouldn't be dreading AoE phases, they should be looking forward to them, we should look forward to murdering a ton of small hp adds like everyone else gets to.
Instead we get to remember that our flame shock initial hit will kill them and we get to redrop magma for the mobs to kill over and over.

Also I really don't want magma totem back unless it gets redesigned to turn our attacks into cleaves or SOMETHING that isn't its current iteration.
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90 Orc Shaman
13750
It isn't bad, just awkward to use. I'll admit to frustration sometimes that I don't have on demand aoe like a dk or a mage does, for instance, but our aoe isn't exactly pitiful.


It is when you don't get the chance to do it at all.

Bring back fire totems centered Fire Novas...nuff said. Giving enhance earthquake might be nice. Or maybe implement a version of the buff those trolls put on themselves in ZG and ZA. The one that creates a random earthquake at a location.


Totem centered AoE was horrendous.
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90 Draenei Shaman
7620
are you guys serious questing ok most of the little adds die to fast ti worry about aoe but raids i can throw down some beast aoe idk ifbyou guys are doing it wrong or what pretty simple do ur single target rotation/priority simply add fire nova on cd and replace bolt w chain lightning aoe dps is way easier now dont have to tab targets to spread flame shock lava lash does it for you
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100 Tauren Shaman
18185
If you're doing dailies or something and the mobs die too fast, I grab something tougher and drag it over just so I can use my aoe. And don't hesitate to use cd's and grab a ton of stuff. Ele totem, spirit wolves, healing totem, ancestral guidance, all can make your life easier and keep you up while take out a large pack of mobs.

And a tip for Fire Nova, if you've got a big group, after you spread your flameshock time it so you're using your unleash elements just before you hit nova for the fire damage buff.
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91 Dwarf Shaman
7085
And a tip for Fire Nova, if you've got a big group, after you spread your flameshock time it so you're using your unleash elements just before you hit nova for the fire damage buff.


This.
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100 Goblin Shaman
16265
Totem centered AoE was horrendous.


Yes it was but that was because of the second button, fire nova, not because of magma totem. If they had changed magma totem to pulse on the first second after drop and buffed the damage/range so that it did as much as the combination of magma + fire nova on cooldown I doubt there would have been any complaints at all.

They also could have taken magma totem off the GCD and there would have been far fewer complaints. It was the combination of dropping magma totem and it needing 2 seconds to do any damage at all and having to wait on the GCD after drop to hit fire nova that made the whole thing so frustrating. That combined with elemental hating the thing in it's entirety is what made the complaints so loud.


it's not the issue that we "lack" it, the issue is it's annoying to play with compared to every other class in the game. An enh shaman shouldn't be dreading AoE phases, they should be looking forward to them, we should look forward to murdering a ton of small hp adds like everyone else gets to.
Instead we get to remember that our flame shock initial hit will kill them and we get to redrop magma for the mobs to kill over and over.

Also I really don't want magma totem back unless it gets redesigned to turn our attacks into cleaves or SOMETHING that isn't its current iteration.


I agree with everything you said here but do want to clarify one point. Magma totem doesn't generate any aggro with it's attacks. It will aggro through it's presence (ie drop it into the path of some unaggroed mobs and then run away) but nothing more then that. If you body aggro a mob and then drop the totem the mob will keep attacking you. Swap the magma to a searing totem and that mob will immediately turn and kill it the moment the searing totem does any damage to it at all.

If they were to remove fire nova and make magma totem into the replacement specialty spell with the only change to the totem being a damage buff, I would be perfectly content with that. They even have plenty of room to do a significant buff to magma totem as it doesn't generate stacks of searing flames and those are worth a LOT of damage when there is only one target present. Looking at simulationcraft they could easily give it a 400% damage buff and it still wouldn't even be close to being considered for use when there was only 1 target present.
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100 Troll Shaman
11965
The problem I'm seeing in 25m is that when I finally do get my FS spread everything is dead or dieing. That and having our aoe tied to 4 different CDs, most of which are our single target rotation, is ridiculous. You want to aoe? oh wait you cant because you used lava lash 3 seconds ago and have to wait another 4 before you can do proper aoe, and in those 4 seconds everything is dead because everyone else can aoe with 1 GCD. This is an issue, the idea that everyone can't do everything is a BC and Wrath philosophy.

Perhaps changing fire nova into "Searing volley" which shoots searing flames to targets in range from the now empowered searing totem, this would help us cleave and be on demand aoe because searing totem should always be down anyway, and when its not fire elemental should be up so we have passive aoe there anyway.
Edited by Zinjan on 4/20/2013 11:00 AM PDT
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100 Troll Shaman
11965
Anyone else have anything to add to continue the discussion?
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100 Goblin Shaman
16265
Anyone else have anything to add to continue the discussion?


Problem is that everyone who plays the spec knows that the AoE is clunky. Even the most ardent supporter of the current mechanics will readily agree that it could benefit from some developer attention to relieve that "clunkiness".

Hard to keep a discussion going when we are all just waiting for Blizzard to get on the same page.
Edited by Rouncer on 4/21/2013 4:06 PM PDT
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90 Pandaren Shaman
14730
The easiest fix to our AoE would be to either let Fire Nova spread Flame Shock to ALL targets, or have Lava Lash spread Flame Shock to ALL targets. The reason why our AoE is so bad, is because it's limited to only 4 other targets. If it gets spread to all, AoE dmg goes way up.

And if dmg is too high, (whcih I doubt would happen), then just nerf Fire Nova dmg slightly.
Edited by Kridd on 4/22/2013 9:40 AM PDT
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