Subterfuge

90 Troll Shaman
7330
in this thread u will find bad rogues defending a broken ability...nothing to see here.

Same rogues in s11 that were claiming the same thing.

Rogue is faceroll right now. Cant be peeled on openers. Porting around with cloak and dagger shadow dance. Spamming throw with interrupts or retarded spam dmg. Easily applied 50% cast time reduction.

If u know how to add to 5 (for combo points) you are ready to face roll on rogue.
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90 Undead Priest
6075
Rogue is faceroll right now. Cant be peeled on openers. Porting around with cloak and dagger shadow dance. Spamming throw with interrupts or retarded spam dmg. Easily applied 50% cast time reduction.


cant be peeled
always get the opener even if they play terrible with nooberfuge
kill in 4 seconds
insane survivability

i cant believe people defend this garbage, is jaw dropping, what is wrong with them?
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Rogues are fine atm, just because you died to a geared rogue in random bg with zerking doesn't mean they need nerf.

If anything they need to buff our survivability on top of the current tool-set we have.
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90 Undead Priest
6075
Rogues are fine atm, just because you died to a geared rogue in random bg with zerking doesn't mean they need nerf.


lol, no zerging, no orbs, no pots, not even the shadowpan trinket and rogues still kill before the first garrote ends, you have no shame
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04/20/2013 03:26 PMPosted by Paihn
Rogues are fine atm, just because you died to a geared rogue in random bg with zerking doesn't mean they need nerf.


lol, no zerging, no orbs, no pots, not even the shadowpan trinket and rogues still kill before the first garrote ends, you have no shame
\

keep making up those stories.
They are indeed, interesting stories.
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90 Night Elf Druid
4475
Halo and 500% rain of fire along with all the other BS aoe abilities that drag people out of stealth we're introduced in MoP.

Come to think of it, quite a few classes ALL got AOE abilities in some form or another. I'm not saying they're all useful for just that, but:

Halo was bad enough that they nerfed the ability for it to get rogues out of stealth?Now I barely see spriests using it.

EDIT: Point is, it became alot easier to get stealthies out. AND several more classes suddenly got some sort of stealth ability.


What are the new AOE abilities introduced in mop? Spriests had mindsear regardless of halo. Locks had like spammable hellfire in cata ( or still do). There were just as much AOE before MOP. List me several classes that never had an AOE.

Lacking subterfuge never made rogues crappy... good rogues still managed to get openers without subterfuge before mop.
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yea before mop LOL.
we need it now.
sry to say.
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90 Undead Rogue
4445
Subterfuge was fine before CnD and extra Energy. The problem is cloak and dagger more than anything else.

The best way to fix it would be, imo:

1. Cloak and Dagger has a 4s internal on each person. You can port from A to B to C, but if you teleport stun A, he trinks or blinks, you can't port back to him for a bit.

2. Subterfuge should break actual stealth as soon as the Rogue attacks, but lets them continue using stealth abilities for the duration. Sort of like a mini dance, but without the 45 energy ambush. If the Rogue doesn't attack but stealths and takes damage, it should continue as is

or just remove cloak and dagger, and revamp hit and run to something that wasn't so flawed
Edited by Crookston on 4/20/2013 11:23 PM PDT
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in conclusion, l2p issues.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
17885
Subterfuge was fine before CnD and extra Energy. The problem is cloak and dagger more than anything else.

The best way to fix it would be, imo:

1. Cloak and Dagger has a 4s internal on each person. You can port from A to B to C, but if you teleport stun A, he trinks or blinks, you can't port back to him for a bit.

2. Subterfuge should break actual stealth as soon as the Rogue attacks, but lets them continue using stealth abilities for the duration. Sort of like a mini dance, but without the 45 energy ambush. If the Rogue doesn't attack but stealths and takes damage, it should continue as is

or just remove cloak and dagger, and revamp hit and run to something that wasn't so flawed


I'd just be happy if when I actually was able to unstealth the rogue, he wasn't restealthed for three seconds and free to open on me anyways. It really should be reworked into a 3 second dance.
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I dont understand how a geared player could die in a opener?
Unpeelable? I think not. Any AOE cc will get the job done and mess things up for us.

all i see is people qqing about a broken class that happened to get some much needed tools. If people knew the amount of retarded mechanics a rogue has to deal with, they would shutup and just L2P.

Why should blink break stuns?
Why do DK's have double grips?
Why do paladins have 2 bubbles?
Why do kittys make better rogues then the real deal?
Why are hunters immune to melee in camo?
Why do warriors have charge on a 12 sec cd?
Why do locks have a million ways to f*k us?
Why does it take 2 players a minute or more to take down a monk?
Why can spriests dispersion while stunned?
Why does arcane shot mark me after ive vanished?

Lastly, why the f*k can people see me when im in stealth, 25+ yards away?

The point of the game is to better yourself when you see that your struggling with something in a certain situation. Thats the mark of a good player. All you scrubs do is QQ about it till its nerfed..

Cloak and Dagger has a 4s internal on each person


that would totally ruin CnD Dance, dmg wise. Some of us dont have the latency to position ourselves without it. Does that mean we should forever be stuck in mediocrity? We pay to play this game too...
Edited by Velexin on 4/21/2013 2:40 PM PDT
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88 Worgen Druid
4720


that would totally ruin CnD Dance, dmg wise. Some of us dont have the latency to position ourselves without it. Does that mean we should forever be stuck in mediocrity? We pay to play this game too...


One of the most interesting arguments for CnD I've seen yet.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
17885
A six second ICD would be a pretty solid fix and prevent this stupid 100% uptime.
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A six second ICD would be a pretty solid fix and prevent this stupid 100% uptime.


its fine as it is.
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90 Troll Priest
12745
It should be re-worked to allowing you to use your stealth bar for 3s after leaving stealth.

There is pretty much no reasonable argument against this. Pretending rogues are weak or need buffs is absurd.
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90 Blood Elf Hunter
10875
04/21/2013 04:01 PMPosted by Kalopsia
A six second ICD would be a pretty solid fix and prevent this stupid 100% uptime.


its fine as it is.


it's funny, warriors said that about their uptime as well. Look at what happened.

One person shutting down an entire team is entirely absurd and needs fixed. Otherwise, why bring anyone if the they or their team are going to be made trivial?

Even other rogues are agreeing with that.
Edited by Triztala on 4/21/2013 4:09 PM PDT
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It is still fine.
Over reaction isn't gonna convince any of the developers.
They aren't even concerned at all. (last time I asked Holinka (2 days ago), he said rogues are at good spot right now).

Sry to say.
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