Arcane Mage PvP
A certain kill can be set up with just a pet freeze (25 second cooldown). If you need to massacre whole groups of players then by all means use frozen orb and/or icy veins.
Frost has an incredible amount of cleave damage while maintaining your optimal single target rotation. It is stronger than just your arcane barrage to finish with.. which may or may not crit.
With frost you can save alter time for defensive purposes rather than trying to set up burst damage and then you still have the tools to drop someone if your leader calls for it at a moments notice without hoping you have cooldowns available.
Also, the on use pvp trinket aligns perfectly with frozen orb so there is no wastage on its uptime.
And.. players shouldn't be able to simply run from your frozen orb because any decent frost mage would have rooted them in place to shatter it.
Correct me if I am wrong but mastery is still arcane's best secondary stat? Or close to it. Either way your mana levels SHOULD matter as arcane (e.g. use of spellsteal).
Watchmeblink has been streaming arcane mage all night. Doing quite well, but he is a r1 player after all so who knows.
I would say arcane could be viable for arena due to its single target focus, but after watching some of that it looked pretty painful. He was constantly complaining of losing stacks by getting line of sighted or cc'd which is an issue frost has no problem with.
Arcane is great if your being left alone to hard cast constantly but since when is that ever the case.
I attempted arcane for a day or so in random BG's (yeh lul I know) and most of the time it felt like I was just nether tempesting and rarely getting any hard casted AB's off. I would hate to be in a competitive situation where people are actually on the ball with interrupts and CC.
I couldn't work out what arcane mages would bring to an RBG group. Atleast with frost you have the extra AoE roots as well as the cleave burst.
But I suppose my experience in arcane isn't all that much and is not a playstyle I enjoy ....if you can make it work then so be it..but I don't see it as a spec used in any high rated pvp.
Go ahead and peruse the first couple pages of these forums. What do you see? Complaints about lack of burst from frost in PVP (with complaints about fire burst being gutted).
I stopped taking anything you said seriously after the words "frost" and "lack of burst".
That's good that you stopped early because you surely would have made an idiot out of yourself otherwise.
Read what I quoted. Notice one important piece of information: FOR NEW PLAYERS
This is most certainly the case. Sorry if you can't understand why.
Biggest difference between the specs is frosts damage ability scales up with additional targets. As it gets easyer to find fof procs. Which in turn gives you more opportunity to cc/spell steal/cs.
Now if your talking about a 1v1 situation, which can happen in bg's alot, arcane has no pet to loose, and no orb to dodge. And it does more damage with spells like cone and fireblast while keeping a endless slow on ONE target. Which makes it easy to kite and give yourself time to build up racksa stacks. Also in bg's if you get ignornored for even 20 seconds you can blow the entire team up. Popa timewarp/buffs and spam arc blast and youll be hitting 150k in a global.
I enjoy both specs
Also played against one in 3's the other night. Match lasted forever. It was him hunter and shaman. They were 1950 and they had some wicked burst but we just countered it by cc'ing or interrupting him. We knew when the burst was coming when he started stacking arcane blasts. Easily countered. Once we started controlling him we just killed the hunter.
Moral, I wouldn't do arenas as arcane. Apparently it's viable in RBG's. Still prefer frost personally.
Except that I've been up against competent players (such as Abn's team) and have been able to easily cast Arcane Blast and Missiles. Abn does it as well.. along with other 2k Arcane Mages I've seen on occasion.
If you think that Arcane is really that bad it's obvious to me you don't know the spec.. or you're limiting our conversation to duels and 2s.
And by what rating do you consider as 'competent'? 1.8k ? 2k? 2.4k?
So do I.
Shows how little you know how to play an Arcane spec if you think that they can't deal damage while having a DK on your back.
I'm convinced that you imagine in your head how bad it is rather then actually playing the spec properly and seeing how it works for yourself.
I don't troll. I play the spec and know how it works. I get told by the likes of yourself and others of why Arcane isn't viable while presenting situations which I simply do not encounter, even against high-rated teams. If these are based on your own personal experiences, then it's clear to me you don't know the spec and can't really comment. If you don't play Arcane, then you're judging it on your own preconceptions. Either way, rather then taking the word of an Arcane player, you continue to hold onto your own beliefs.. which is just stubborness and arrogance.
I can understand it if you were to say "well Arcane doesn't work for me".. because that's what I think sums up this argument.
EDIT: Just because you haven't seen a Frost Mage do something doesn't mean it's not entirely possible. But in the duration of a single trinket/Icy veins combo, I expect to land 2-3 kills in the average BG. Greatly depends on skill/gear. I can land more, or less. The other day I landed 8 KBs in under 30 seconds in an AB.
Ever done that as Arcane?
I have in the likes of a random BG with a ton of undergeared bads like the AB match you were in. cmon mate, no high-rated team would allow 8 of their players to fall by a single Mage. If you're gonna have a go at me for not playing "real PvP" with "good players" , then at least stick to your own level of expectations .. sheesh ;)
Honestly, you can pursue the arena route if you want...but it's probably a stronger case to argue about arcane's use in BGs. As you keep mentioning, positioning is everything. Everyone here who is telling you arcane isn't viable is assuming you will be targeted, trained/focused, and killed the minute you appear on the field. You know this isn't the case in BGs and making this assumption is idiotic in itself.
One of my favorite things to do in WotLK as arcane in PVE gear (!@#$ PVP gear with quad core) was to find a nice bush or obstacle to hide behind (especially in AB off the cliff of BS or off the cliff of any EotS tower..or even in the middle of EotS where the flag was) and spam arcane blast on a person who had no idea where it was coming from because it didn't leave a trail back to me unless I used arcane missiles.
It's one spec that can take huge advantage of your allies distracting the other team to deal tremendous amounts of damage. It's great when you're sitting at max stacks and letting loose on someone who is being healed. You then just find the healer, target him, and start spamming at max stacks. Healer drops by 50-75% HP in a couple seconds without knowing what happened to him.
I can do that on frost but I'll most likely be targeted the minute I unleash a lance/ffb/fb at the healer since it's a projectile that leads right back to me. Best I can do to mimic that behavior on frost is invisible > set up camp right behind where the healers are positioned > unload.
Just keep doing what you're doing and let the misinformed stay the way they are.
One of my favorite things to do in WotLK as arcane in PVE gear was to find a nice bush or obstacle to hide behind (especially in AB off the cliff of BS or off the cliff of any EotS tower..or even in the middle of EotS where the flag was) and spam arcane blast on a person who had no idea where it was coming from because it didn't leave a trail back to me unless I used arcane missiles.
Gnome Mage w/ Shard of Woe, Cunning, and Tarecgosa in AB was pretty ridiculous too. Wasn't out of the realm of possibility to go 40-0 in any given game just with me hiding the bushes, lol. Never died because I had Imp Blink, Gnome racial, and instant invis to get away. We were true glass cannons. Snipers, if you will, since the objective was to not be seen.
04/28/2013 11:19 PMPosted by PsyopsExcept that I've been up against competent players (such as Abn's team) and have been able to easily cast Arcane Blast and Missiles. Abn does it as well.. along with other 2k Arcane Mages I've seen on occasion.
You do realize that his playstyle revolves around control and opening up opportunities for damage for his partners than it does around damage by a huge margin, right? So, given that, everything you've said referencing him is fairly useless.
Well yeh there's that too. Though my point is that he casts Blast and Missiles.
I don't know why you continue, Dact. You'll just run into idiots who think they know what they're talking about because they played arcane for one BG and deemed it unfit.You're right. I rest my case.
Thanks to Dact, I will remain arcane for RBG's. Anymore good arcane info out there please post it.
I still play frost in arena, but it's not fun. Our comp for 3's is shadow, resto, and frost mage(me). Literally we cc the other team and let the shadow dps them down. Shadow has way more burst / dps than frost, so eat it up as you frosties.
RBG will be where my arcane mage style of play shines.
I guess he doesn't know that Nether Tempest deals way more damage as Frost than Arcane in over.
Guess he never tried to get a NT on frozen target either.
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