Fresh Lfr's ?

90 Pandaren Monk
12375
So today i was on my alt Shaman and qued up for lfr thinking id get a section done before raid time on my main, my bf and i qued for last stand of the zandalari and they had just killed jin-rok, we thought no big deal we'll que again after we finish since my shamans resto we get fast que times.
We finished our raid finder and que'ed again again on the second boss... we finish, we que a third time again jin-rok is dead... i thought i heard Lore on tank spot say once that it wasnt possible to get qued into a run where it wouldnt give you any loot off any of the bosses ?

we qued 3 times and got in after jin-rok was dead every time , we ran thru it and killed horridon and council twice after we entered the que the third time to find that jin-rok was dead once again we just left

we get a 30 minute debuff and wasted our time que'ing for the same lfr section 3 times and still hadnt gotten the first boss WTH ?
Edited by Alistarzza on 4/24/2013 5:32 PM PDT
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happed to me and a buddy very much the same earlier today... kinda BS... hope this gets fixed
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90 Undead Warrior
10980
How would you "fix" it in an effective way that doesn't create either:

1. Horrendously long queue times, or
2. Raids that are stuck when 4-5 people drop out after a boss kill?
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90 Orc Hunter
7870
I don't mind getting into half finished LFRs if it's a quick queue. 5 minute queue and I get put into an LFR on the last boss? I'm fine with that. I don't mind killing the boss and queuing back up to get the first two. If I've been waiting over half an hour or more for a queue to pop and I get dropped in for 1 boss? You're damned right I'm going to be a little angry about it for the simple fact that I'm looking at another 30 minute or more queue just to get a chance at fighting the first two which is not guaranteed.

As to how to fix it? I don't know. Perhaps they should add an element to the queue system based on how long you've been in the queue where it favors placing those who have been in the queue the shortest amount of time into partially finished LFRs over those who have been waiting longer.
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90 Pandaren Monk
12375
the problem is im not going to repeatedly kill the same last boss or two and miss out on my chance for loot and legendary items off the first boss
this happens far to often when i stay if i have a chance for loot off the last two bosses sure

but if ive already killed them and theres nothing in it for me but the valor at the end, the valor isnt enough to make me stay valors to easy to come by, i want the boss i havent killed yet and ill drop gruop every time essentially wasting my time as well as the gruops time when they have to wait for another person
Edited by Alistarzza on 5/4/2013 3:47 PM PDT
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90 Orc Shaman
6505
Not that this is here or there, but it seems to be more of an issue later in the Blizzard week. Tue/Wed-I get fresh runs. Fri-Mon.. No chance. Just an observation.

On topic, it is an issue. The bigger problem is that there isn't an easy fix. I have yet to see a suggestion that is fair to both the player queuing and to the 22 people in an partly finished raid waiting for 2 healers and a tank because people left early
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90 Blood Elf Rogue
15325
Happened today to me and my friend...both q'ing for second ToT LFR on our (healing) priests. 5-30 min que (yes, 30 min que for healers on a Saturday, go figure...) and 3 times in a row we got into a group that had just killed Megaera - absolutely absurd. "Kill Ji-Kun and re-que" blah blah blah - sorry, I'd rather wait 2 hours in a queue to get a guaranteed fresh run then have to queue 2-3 times ( or more) just to kill all the bosses.
Edited by Ashlí on 5/4/2013 7:42 PM PDT
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90 Gnome Mage
12440
People in the partial runs don't want to wait 2 hours just because a tank/healer/dps decided they didn't want to stay or because they might have had a rl emergency. The system is flawed because of the people using it.
Edited by Playne on 5/5/2013 8:35 AM PDT
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90 Worgen Hunter
9500
Okay, tough love.

Don't put people who need fresh runs in with groups who have downed bosses. The prime reason people leave a group early is because they have already been dumped into a group that was partially done with the run before joining the current group. The cycle perpetuates, and more and more people get upset.

Easy fix, make it a ticked option "raids in progress" if you want, or don't mind joining a raid in progress, offer other bonus loot bag or w'e for shortages as per usual. I know a fair number of people who would join a raid in progress to use runes, for tier or weapons, maybe just easy valor, the average que timer would also be significantly shorter I would think, so its a rather fair compromise.

And again breaking the joining cycle would fix perhaps seventy percent of the replacement and joining raid in progress issues on its own, blizzard just has to do it.
Edited by Jaegerzero on 5/5/2013 9:16 AM PDT
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90 Orc Shaman
6505
Okay, tough love.

Don't put people who need fresh runs in with groups who have downed bosses. The prime reason people leave a group early is because they have already been dumped into a group that was partially done with the run before joining the current group. The cycle perpetuates, and more and more people get upset.


This isn't true. Yes people leave because they already killed boss 3 and only need 1&2. But they also frequently leave because they need no gear from boss 3. They leave for plenty of reasons.


Easy fix, make it a ticked option "raids in progress" if you want, or don't mind joining a raid in progress, offer other bonus loot bag or w'e for shortages as per usual. I know a fair number of people who would join a raid in progress to use runes, for tier or weapons, maybe just easy valor, the average que timer would also be significantly shorter I would think, so its a rather fair compromise.

And again breaking the joining cycle would fix perhaps seventy percent of the replacement and joining raid in progress issues on its own, blizzard just has to do it.


So your solution is instead of making it unfair to 1-3 people to make the other 22 people wait an unfair amount of time(after they waited in that same queue mind you). The minority loses here.

I understand it sucks to zone in on Lei Shen repeatedly when all you need is Iron Qon, but frankly your time(or my time for that matter) isn't more valuable than the other people waiting for the few people to fill in raids. And as many horror stories as there are of people repeatedly zone in for the final boss, there were stories of raids sitting unfilled until they fell apart on Madness.

Frankly, this preference for a fresh run(not a guarantee) is the best system they have to keep it fair as possible for both those queuing and for those waiting. I have yet to see any suggestion that is fair to both that improves upon what is in place... Mostly it's people who only want fresh runs for themselves
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90 Worgen Hunter
9500
Really because most people I have talked to, have left the group because they have already done the next boss and ceebs hanging around for a Tiny valor reward.

These same people leaving for other reasons, that you mentioned, have to que again at some point too btw, and would probably prefer not doing the same first and or second boss again, so yeah I do think that sir.

A raid would be filled the same speed as before, maybe faster, by people who won't be frustrated the moment they are dumped into it. Maybe they won't, isn't it worth trying?

My first thoughts each week when I'm dumped into'lieshen is usually along the lines of "well this group must be garbage"or "so after this monster repair bill, I'm gonna have to wait a half hour again, f u too blizz" or "thanks a lot bastard" cursing the guy who I just replaced. Do you realty want a fifth of your dips annoyed, unhappy, upset about being there? Some of the healers and tanks I have had actively protested and did nothing, literaly afk,d till they could reque, wiped the raids, left raid but not group,wasting everyone's time, for two hours in one case, due to group apathy not kicking a tank. So yes, I don't view that majority as a greater priority when the minority, which can flip out and and ruin everything anyway.

Compensating people for dumping them in a raid in progress would be the least blizzard could do. Drop the que time for their next raid que by giving them priority, or Increasing their chance at loot off that particular boss, or if they have done that boss already, but not completed the wing, give them a fresh chance at loot, there are a lot of different ways blizzard could soften the blow to people getting dumped, they just apparently don't care enough to try.

The minority loses when the majority can't be bothered contributing towards finding a solution.
Edited by Jaegerzero on 5/5/2013 10:46 AM PDT
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90 Gnome Mage
12440
You should find another game or go outside if lfr makes you that angry.
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90 Worgen Hunter
9500
So because I see a way to improve something, I should instead quit it altogether?

I thought the point of the original poster was to try and find ways to get fresh lfr ques. And that these forums existed to debate issues and discuss them to try and find solutions to problems?

Lfr makes me "that angry" because it can be improved so much, its a great concept, just with questionable implementation, and debatable effectiveness. More good than harm was ghost crawlers comment, not exactly a stellar review.

Again I offered suggestions, I expected criticism and debate, a flat quit comment is neither and doesn't help.

If more peopled cared, lfr would be a much better place, even if the only thing that changed was our attitude.
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90 Orc Shaman
6505
But it doesn't improve it. They tried basically that by telling you how many bosses were down and giving you the option to then decline. Lots of groups never filled and fell apart because no one would accept the partial run
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90 Worgen Hunter
9500
So getting people on board with the idea of joining runs in progress would lie more in the realm of reward and incentives? Or is that just a pipedream hehe

I mean if we can't get. A fresh run, maybe the bonus reward will be enough to stop any rage problems?
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90 Human Paladin
15450
How many times do you need to kill Lei Shen in LFR before you can see Qon and Consorts?
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100 Pandaren Monk
18720
How many times do you need to kill Lei Shen in LFR before you can see Qon and Consorts?


Conversely how many people leave if you have not killed Lei Shen and just trying to get a full group to attempt him once. Been in this group for an hour and a half now waiting on people. Either they leave because they don't need him or annoyed at the length just getting a group together.
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100 Human Paladin
aus
18820
Don't put people who need fresh runs in with groups who have downed bosses. The prime reason people leave a group early is because they have already been dumped into a group that was partially done with the run before joining the current group. The cycle perpetuates, and more and more people get upset.


This might be the prime reason but its not the only reason,

Queue up for pinnacle lfr, Minutes after the reset. Outside of possible oceanic players nobody should be saved to a run a progress Start your fresh run, then watch in amazement as 2/3 of the raid leaves immediately after the 2nd boss dies.

They are their for the tier from the first bosses, they choose to not kill the last boss and forgo the valor and rewards.
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90 Human Paladin
15450
05/05/2013 10:58 PMPosted by Delritha
How many times do you need to kill Lei Shen in LFR before you can see Qon and Consorts?


Conversely how many people leave if you have not killed Lei Shen and just trying to get a full group to attempt him once. Been in this group for an hour and a half now waiting on people. Either they leave because they don't need him or annoyed at the length just getting a group together.


No idea. I queued for 45 minutes today and got Lei Shen. Which was expected. We killed him.

Queued again, and in about 6 stinking minutes I was put in on Lei Shen again. I was ported on the stinking platform just as somebody pulled him before the raid was ready. That did not end well. I left.

As far as I am concerned, I fulfilled my obligation. To expect me to stay and kill him again would be a bit much.
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