Which classes can't hit 1#DPS in raids?

90 Orc Death Knight
16805
05/01/2013 03:29 PMPosted by Vex
They are simply better off bring in an alt dk over taking a windwalker monk with them.


There is a point in which it simply isn't worth taking other classes with you. I guess, I could be doing something wrong. But, minor errors on a windwalker monk quickly kill off your dps.


http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-1bfev9dbf6ztyufb/sum/damageDone/?s=1961&e=2646#Vex

lolololololololololololololololololololololololol


Congrats you got to sit on Horridon the whole time.
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90 Night Elf Druid
10140
Congrats you got to sit on Horridon the whole time.


Step 1) Be the role the fight caters to

Step 2) Don't not be the role the fight caters to

Step 3) ?????

Step 4) Forums
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90 Gnome Monk
7430
The difference between the ABSOLUTE top spec and the absolute lowest spec is 20.8%. That's from the very top to the very bottom. So "over 20% in some cases" is accurate only if you are counting from the #1 spec to the #32 spec-- any other gap is less. (and that lowest spec has a spec of the same class that is much closer).


Based on what evidence?

Looking at some specific fight samples you regularly see deltas greater than 20%

25H Jin'rokh, all: top-218k, bottom listed-148k, difference ~30% (bottom overall is 135k with insufficient parses)

10N jin'rokh, all: top -162k, bottom-111k difference >40%

25H Primordius, all: top 227k, bottom-141k difference > 40%

10 N Primordius, all: top-146k, bottom-105k difference ~40%

That clearly looks like > 20% "in some cases" to me.

Now if you mean "average overall dps" then yes, the range from top to bottom is right sround 20%. That just means either the fights that favor certain specs REALLY favor them or there is a pretty even distribution on how fights favor specs. However, it doesn't alter the fact that on average there are differences between specs up to or greater than 20%
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100 Troll Shaman
10705
Except he is completely and 100% right, unlike you. I could be wrong but I have to imagine your knowledge of this game and its mechanics are rather shallow to be making ignorant comments like this.

Now I am not claiming that a ret paladin cannot beat a warlock in his casual allstar guild but that is hardly indicative of how well off a class is. Theoretically if all people had the exact same skill level then the #s on a site like raidbots are actually pretty (but not 100%) accurate depiction of top end class dps for the tier they are sampling from. Trying to claim otherwise shows a clear lack of understanding of not only this game but trivial statistic applications.


There is not a "huge gap" between the "haves" and "have-nots". Raidbots is a terrible metric to compare classes against each other. And classes are not getting sat in normal modes based on performance issues. So yes, literally everything in the post I quoted was wrong.


Life must be easy when you willfully look at numbers and facts and say "wrong".

Even assuming you were not incorrect the OP was clearly inquiring about heroic progression, so I have no idea why you just brought up normal mode. It makes the entirety of your posts illegitimate and off topic.
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90 Orc Warrior
11450


There is not a "huge gap" between the "haves" and "have-nots". Raidbots is a terrible metric to compare classes against each other. And classes are not getting sat in normal modes based on performance issues. So yes, literally everything in the post I quoted was wrong.


Life must be easy when you willfully look at numbers and facts and say "wrong".

Even assuming you were not incorrect the OP was clearly inquiring about heroic progression, so I have no idea why you just brought up normal mode. It makes the entirety of your posts illegitimate and off topic.


Dude sounds like a republican.
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90 Orc Warrior
11450
"But, Mr. President, they dont have weapons of mass destruction."
"Shut up, yes they do!"
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Now if you mean "average overall dps" then yes, the range from top to bottom is right sround 20%. That just means either the fights that favor certain specs REALLY favor them or there is a pretty even distribution on how fights favor specs. However, it doesn't alter the fact that on average there are differences between specs up to or greater than 20%


You're right. On fights where certain specs get to take more advantage of gimmicks than other, yes, there are. Overall for the course of a raid there are not

"But, Mr. President, they dont have weapons of mass destruction.""Shut up, yes they do!"


Pretty sure you need to not say this kind of things unless you want this thread locked. Or we can start talking about Syria and what's been going on there for more than three years with no response from the current President.
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90 Orc Warrior
11450
Pretty sure you need to not say this kind of things unless you want this thread locked. Or we can start talking about Syria and what's been going on there for more than three years with no response from the current President.

Pretty for sure if you dont want to be completely ignored and mocked you should probably not ignore and discredit the most accurate form of pure data in a real raiding environment there is... just saying.
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Pretty for sure if you dont want to be completely ignored and mocked you should probably not ignore and discredit the most accurate form of pure data in a real raiding environment there is... just saying.


Cherry picking single encounters that prove your point and ignoring all data that doesn't? Í didn't realize that was the most relevant for of data there is.

Here, let me show you some great conclusions we can make with Cherry picking. . .

http://raidbots.com/dpsbot/Durumu_the_Forgotten/25H/all/14/60/default/

OMG Fire mages! Nerf Nerf Nerf!

http://raidbots.com/dpsbot/Durumu_the_Forgotten/25H/all/14/60/default/

OMG Fire mages dead last! Buff Buff Buff!

http://raidbots.com/dpsbot/Durumu_the_Forgotten/25H/all/14/60/default/

Ele Shamans super broken! Must Nerf!

http://raidbots.com/dpsbot/Tortos/25H/all/14/60/default/

Ele Shamans dead last! Must Buff!
Edited by Alordis on 5/1/2013 8:17 PM PDT
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90 Human Warlock
14650
The average guild isn't going to sit you because you're a Ret Paladin as opposed to Fury Warrior.


He said heroic setting. Not average guild.
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100 Human Monk
22305
05/01/2013 04:49 PMPosted by Drefty




http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/rt-1bfev9dbf6ztyufb/sum/damageDone/?s=1961&e=2646#Vex

lolololololololololololololololololololololololol


Congrats you got to sit on Horridon the whole time.


Wrong.

Go tank something and get punched in the face, thanks.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11000
Even assuming you were not incorrect the OP was clearly inquiring about heroic progression, so I have no idea why you just brought up normal mode. It makes the entirety of your posts illegitimate and off topic.


Gosh, maybe the post I was replying to brought them up and I was directly replying to it?

EDIT:

The post you said was "100% right" said that classes were getting sat in normal modes. You're now calling me out for mentioning normals, when your first reply in the thread is to quote a poster saying that "There are classes getting sat for normal" and say that he is "completely and 100% right".

So, basically, thanks for obviously not reading the thread before replying.
Edited by Mahourai on 5/1/2013 9:18 PM PDT
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90 Orc Warrior
11450
Original Statement in question.
05/01/2013 06:45 PMPosted by Flexxun
Raidbots is a terrible metric to compare classes against each other.


Cherry picking single encounters that prove your point and ignoring all data that doesn't? Í didn't realize that was the most relevant for of data there is.

Lolwut. Dont try to shift the argument to suit your conclusion troll.
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Deleted. This guy is obviously just trolling.
Edited by Alordis on 5/1/2013 9:39 PM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11000
I'm sure you just did this accidentally but please do not quote my posts and attribute them to yourself, Flexxun. Thanks.
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I'm sure you just did this accidentally but please do not quote my posts and attribute them to yourself, Flexxun. Thanks.


And please don't argue against me by using Mahourai's posts. . . I realize we are both mages and agree on a lot of things, but we're different people so calling me out for things he's said or vice versa is really really useless.
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11000
05/01/2013 09:59 PMPosted by Alordis
I realize we are both mages and agree on a lot of things


Let's not get too wild here.
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100 Troll Shaman
18935
You're best off doing the research yourself, WOL and Raidbots combined are a decent way to pick out mid to slacking dps specs. Asking the forums is just retarded as lfr heroes apparently know class balance. Don't look at just one fight or the avg over all fights, look at each encounter individually.

TBH you're not going to get much competition no matter what you play in normals and lower, though. Best playing what you like, as it's probably a bad spec. c:
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100 Troll Shaman
10705
05/01/2013 09:15 PMPosted by Mahourai
Even assuming you were not incorrect the OP was clearly inquiring about heroic progression, so I have no idea why you just brought up normal mode. It makes the entirety of your posts illegitimate and off topic.


Gosh, maybe the post I was replying to brought them up and I was directly replying to it?

EDIT:

The post you said was "100% right" said that classes were getting sat in normal modes. You're now calling me out for mentioning normals, when your first reply in the thread is to quote a poster saying that "There are classes getting sat for normal" and say that he is "completely and 100% right".

So, basically, thanks for obviously not reading the thread before replying.


You are honestly grasping at straws here. His original claim was still rooted in the fact that the classes are being sat on heroic, and that is what is important. The fact that he also said they were getting sat for normals was merely an exaggeration (I hope. Although I suspect some guilds might actually do that even though it is unnecessary). I did read the thread thanks. You however seem to be missing some key points in other users posts, which is hardly surprising at this point if I had to be honest.
Edited by Mera on 5/1/2013 11:24 PM PDT
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100 Undead Priest
12670
So, if I'm understanding this right, you just want to hit the "easy" button and play an FotM class?
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