Enhance 5.3

90 Blood Elf Hunter
12480
So youre anecdotal evidence about duels and 2v2 arena is an indication that Enhance (and Shamans in general) arent a MASSIVE defensive nightmare in PVP.

Let me alert the presses and maybe people might actually bring a non resto shaman to a group then.


If you are speaking to me, I take little stock in what pvers say. Yes dueling enh shamans and in 2s they can be strong if played right. Obviously they have issues, every class does except locks and mages. But like most bads, the ones claiming enh shaman cant work are the same ones who claimed WW monks were weak and couldnt get 2.2k and same with MM hunters. And yet I dominate on both classes, in duels, 2s, and 3s. I get it, enhance shaman is in the same position WW monks are except we can use shamanistic rage during a stun where as monks cant use anything during a stun. Quit crying.
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90 Troll Shaman
8605
Enhance will be fine. Lightning shield glyph makes us a bit more tanky and with the damage buff on the ptr ive noticed that if I pop ascendance in a duel and dont get cced someone will melt very very fast. "But people will save their defensives/ccs for ascendance?!" That's why you force that !@#$ first, spirit wolves + stormlash totem mixed with the buffed damage to all our damage abilities makes us a very strong damage threat even without ascendance. With the spellpower buff i was seeing 90k elemental blasts on full resil gemmed people without any cds.
Edited by Narika on 5/11/2013 9:29 PM PDT
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90 Draenei Shaman
8775
I agree Enhance will be "fine".

But people who are getting ready for the Golden Age of Enhance Dominance are in for a huge shock.
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90 Troll Shaman
8605
I agree Enhance will be "fine".

But people who are getting ready for the Golden Age of Enhance Dominance are in for a huge shock.


I think most people would just be happy for a spec other than resto for shamans to even be middle of the pack viable in pvp. The middle of the pack isn't a bad place to be either, you can compete but you're less likely to be nerfed in to oblivion. (Every time blizzard makes a class op, they nerf it be worse than it was previously. If anything you should be glad they didnt overdo it.)
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f you are speaking to me, I take little stock in what pvers say. Yes dueling enh shamans and in 2s they can be strong if played right. Obviously they have issues, every class does except locks and mages. But like most bads, the ones claiming enh shaman cant work are the same ones who claimed WW monks were weak and couldnt get 2.2k and same with MM hunters. And yet I dominate on both classes, in duels, 2s, and 3s. I get it, enhance shaman is in the same position WW monks are except we can use shamanistic rage during a stun where as monks cant use anything during a stun. Quit crying.


I don't think you know what you are talking about. Here goes some facts for you

http://www.worldofwargraphs.com/stats-classesrepartition-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0.html

Enhancement is at .7% (2.2k rating+)

WW is at 1.8% (2.2k rating+)

I think WW is a better spec overall but that's not the point. Saying a bold statement or even hinting that Enhancement is some great spec for pvp is just not true. There maybe a handful of players that do enhancement over the rating of 2.2k but guess what? They also have very strong teammates.

You could be the most skilled player in the world and if you play Enhancement it wouldn't matter in Arena unless you have equally skilled teammates. You aren't going to carry anyone as Enhancement and you will need a babysitter for peels as well.

I would take a WW or Ret over Enhancement even after the 5.3 changes. Ret gives better heals and about the same burst also bringing freedom and bop. WW gives a good cc and utility and a solid sustained damage for constant pressure in 3s and a solid set of self heals. Ret may have survival issues as well but a good ret is more valuable than a good enhancement in my opinion.
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80 Blood Elf Paladin
410
05/11/2013 08:34 PMPosted by Rendis
claimed WW monks were weak and couldnt get 2.2k and same with MM hunters. And yet I dominate on both classes,


lol every time i read his posts i play this game

Is it troll or is it srs?! Verdict is troll.
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90 Orc Shaman
12790
I don't like the lightning shield glyph, well I like the effect, but I don't like that it's a glyph.

Blizz goes on and on about not wanting glyphs to be mandatory, well guess what, you can bet your !@#$ every single elemental and enhancement shaman will be using that glyph in PvP.
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90 Blood Elf Monk
5505
I don't like the lightning shield glyph, well I like the effect, but I don't like that it's a glyph.

Blizz goes on and on about not wanting glyphs to be mandatory, well guess what, you can bet your !@#$ every single elemental and enhancement shaman will be using that glyph in PvP.


I agree with you fully, it should just be baseline seeing how almost every elemental and enhancement shaman is going to end up taking this.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
13975
I don't like the lightning shield glyph, well I like the effect, but I don't like that it's a glyph.

Blizz goes on and on about not wanting glyphs to be mandatory, well guess what, you can bet your !@#$ every single elemental and enhancement shaman will be using that glyph in PvP.


I agree with you fully, it should just be baseline seeing how almost every elemental and enhancement shaman is going to end up taking this.


No because we'll get this goofy gimped version of it, instead of an outright DR like it was, and should've, been.

We need that old 10% DR, none of this only if it defensively procs stuff.

As for the buffs, they're helpful, but I doubt it'll do much, enh depends on 2 things: The gear, and their teammates. An enh with pvp weapons notices a world of difference compared to the enh without pvp weapons, same with the 4p.
They aren't a godspec, they need good teammates to help them live. They are a dependent spec that when helped, they do shine, but when they're on their own against most classes unless we have all our CDs we will, more often than not, melt.

This is part of why you'll see some enh shaman claim they're fine, while others will claim the reverse at how awful the spec is.

For pve, if you are rerolling to enh pve as a FotM, I hope you enjoy the worst aoe mechanics of all time (Save for T12 enh)
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90 Draenei Shaman
7745
seriously i wish ppl would stop crying about our aoe i mean we arent the best spec for it but we still hold our own and i still top fights like tortos and thats a !@#$load of aoe majority of my damage is the bats i did an lfr and ended at 170k normals i do 130-140k i guess its not bad to me since i played it in cata where your flame shock wasnt spread w lava lash it sucked
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90 Blood Elf Hunter
12480
05/11/2013 11:54 PMPosted by Ferocityy
claimed WW monks were weak and couldnt get 2.2k and same with MM hunters. And yet I dominate on both classes,


lol every time i read his posts i play this game

Is it troll or is it srs?! Verdict is troll.


Coming from a scrub who has never stepped into arena this means little. I said I dominate on both, my hunter is who i got 2200 with in cata before I sold my account, and my monk on this account wins almost all my duels. WW monks are still gimpy in arena tho. Seems the troll is you, especially considering the fact you misuse the word.

05/11/2013 11:29 PMPosted by Nuckles
f you are speaking to me, I take little stock in what pvers say. Yes dueling enh shamans and in 2s they can be strong if played right. Obviously they have issues, every class does except locks and mages. But like most bads, the ones claiming enh shaman cant work are the same ones who claimed WW monks were weak and couldnt get 2.2k and same with MM hunters. And yet I dominate on both classes, in duels, 2s, and 3s. I get it, enhance shaman is in the same position WW monks are except we can use shamanistic rage during a stun where as monks cant use anything during a stun. Quit crying.


I don't think you know what you are talking about. Here goes some facts for you

http://www.worldofwargraphs.com/stats-classesrepartition-0-0-0-0-0-0-0-0.html

Enhancement is at .7% (2.2k rating+)

WW is at 1.8% (2.2k rating+)

I think WW is a better spec overall but that's not the point. Saying a bold statement or even hinting that Enhancement is some great spec for pvp is just not true. There maybe a handful of players that do enhancement over the rating of 2.2k but guess what? They also have very strong teammates.

You could be the most skilled player in the world and if you play Enhancement it wouldn't matter in Arena unless you have equally skilled teammates. You aren't going to carry anyone as Enhancement and you will need a babysitter for peels as well.

I would take a WW or Ret over Enhancement even after the 5.3 changes. Ret gives better heals and about the same burst also bringing freedom and bop. WW gives a good cc and utility and a solid sustained damage for constant pressure in 3s and a solid set of self heals. Ret may have survival issues as well but a good ret is more valuable than a good enhancement in my opinion.


Most classes being trained need peels, welcome to arena. WW monks have it alot worse than enhance shamans in arena, ret is in a better spot than either atm though. WW has little sustained damage, if you have never played one they lack sustained and were turned into a poor mans ret with TEB changes. Difference is TEB has to be built ascendance doesnt. You are welcome to your opinion but I still think next patch will make enhance shamans be on par with rets. Then again rets get a 15% damage buff for all physical damage.
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90 Blood Elf Hunter
12480
Enhance will be fine. Lightning shield glyph makes us a bit more tanky and with the damage buff on the ptr ive noticed that if I pop ascendance in a duel and dont get cced someone will melt very very fast. "But people will save their defensives/ccs for ascendance?!" That's why you force that !@#$ first, spirit wolves + stormlash totem mixed with the buffed damage to all our damage abilities makes us a very strong damage threat even without ascendance. With the spellpower buff i was seeing 90k elemental blasts on full resil gemmed people without any cds.


Thats my point, exactly. People dont know how to play, they think they can pop all their cds and win but good players save defensive cds for cds. Like a ret popping his wings and holy avenger and everything else all at the same time. As you said, make them use atleast a few defensive cds and then pop ascendance. Its not like we need cds to do damage, we have really solid damage outside cds and during them it just becomes insane burst. Good enhance shamans like the ones Ive dueled used this tactic on my hunter a few times. When they get in range and maelstrom me, I hurt, and then if they can stick on me Im forced to pop deterr or cds just to escape that damage, and then comes ascendance which is actually hard to see when you are on the defensive simply because you gotta watch your hp and his.

Also, LoS is your friend.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
7805
seriously i wish ppl would stop crying about our aoe i mean we aren't the best spec for it but we still hold our own and i still top fights like tortos and that's a !@#$load of aoe majority of my damage is the bats i did an lfr and ended at 170k normals i do 130-140k i guess its not bad to me since i played it in cata where your flame shock wasn't spread w lava lash it sucked


Your other raiders need a crash course in playing better, if you're the one topping boss encounters.
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90 Draenei Shaman
8775
seriously i wish ppl would stop crying about our aoe i mean we arent the best spec for it but we still hold our own and i still top fights like tortos and thats a !@#$load of aoe majority of my damage is the bats i did an lfr and ended at 170k normals i do 130-140k i guess its not bad to me since i played it in cata where your flame shock wasnt spread w lava lash it sucked


The issue is not the damage of the AoE, thats fine. Its the 5 GCD usage to even get it going. Its the whole "Ok adds are comming out soon, I cant use Lava Lash if I want to even get a hit on them". The whole spread mechanism is clunky, slow and crap.

On fights like Tortos where the adds are up for a decent amount of time, our AoE is fine. When you start getting to things like Lei Shen when those balls need to go down IMMEDIATELY is where you start noticing how terrible our AoE is.
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90 Blood Elf Hunter
12480
05/13/2013 02:17 AMPosted by Misnthropia
seriously i wish ppl would stop crying about our aoe i mean we arent the best spec for it but we still hold our own and i still top fights like tortos and thats a !@#$load of aoe majority of my damage is the bats i did an lfr and ended at 170k normals i do 130-140k i guess its not bad to me since i played it in cata where your flame shock wasnt spread w lava lash it sucked


The issue is not the damage of the AoE, thats fine. Its the 5 GCD usage to even get it going. Its the whole "Ok adds are comming out soon, I cant use Lava Lash if I want to even get a hit on them". The whole spread mechanism is clunky, slow and crap.

On fights like Tortos where the adds are up for a decent amount of time, our AoE is fine. When you start getting to things like Lei Shen when those balls need to go down IMMEDIATELY is where you start noticing how terrible our AoE is.


Well lucky for us aoe is one of the least important things needing to be changed about enhance shamans. Since boss fights are the only important fights.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
19615
05/13/2013 03:28 AMPosted by Rendis
Well lucky for us aoe is one of the least important things needing to be changed about enhance shamans. Since boss fights are the only important fights.

this might be the most ignorant thing I've ever read
Edited by Rude on 5/13/2013 4:16 AM PDT
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90 Draenei Shaman
8775


Well lucky for us aoe is one of the least important things needing to be changed about enhance shamans. Since boss fights are the only important fights.


I already had a hunch you were an idiot from your previous posts.

Cheers for confirming it.
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You are welcome to your opinion but I still think next patch will make enhance shamans be on par with rets


no, not unless shamans are getting 2 freedoms 2 hand of protections, Divine Shield and massive buffs to healing.

WW monks have it alot worse than enhance shamans in arena


no they don't. I literally just showed you the numbers and you think enhancement is doing better for some reason. Enhancement isn't even a 1%, they are at .7% and WW is 1.8% and actually that has gone up. Lemme put it to you like this, WW has DOUBLE the representation of Enhancement.

Unholy doesn't have burst either and it performs well in arena. Sustained damage is great as long as it's respectable damage. NS helps but even before NS unholy was doing well in arena
Edited by Nuckles on 5/13/2013 9:19 AM PDT
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83 Night Elf Druid
8615
05/11/2013 08:34 PMPosted by Rendis
monks cant use anything during a stun.


Really?

http://www.wowhead.com/spell=122464/dematerialize

Don't act like monks are completely powerless during stuns
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90 Human Hunter
7245
Im not really sure a 10% dmg reducing buff will help a class that gets ROFLPWNED by every other class in the game.
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