T15 Druid - LOL Rejuvs

90 Tauren Druid
8435


My Regrowth hits normally for 42-44k. IT crits anywhere from 83-86k. Short cast, slightly more expensive than Healing Touch.


Stopped reading right there.

That means you're not glyphing regrowth which should *ALWAYS* be hitting for 125k+. No druid with half a brain does not use that glyph. It's literally a function of all our other glyphs being so terrible that there's no other option, and the fact that, that makes it hit as hard as HT, cost the same, and cast far faster...
Reply Quote
100 Night Elf Druid
18495
[quote]
That means you're not glyphing regrowth which should *ALWAYS* be hitting for 125k+. No druid with half a brain does not use that glyph. It's literally a function of all our other glyphs being so terrible that there's no other option, and the fact that, that makes it hit as hard as HT, cost the same, and cast far faster...


I do NOT glyph regrowth. Why? Living seed isn't the greatest in my opinion - back when we had trees it got 1 point out of 3 or something like that from me.

I have seen the HoT/refresh from regrowth save lives(how it refreshes if they below 50% HP), especially in heroic raiding!
Reply Quote
90 Tauren Druid
15560
05/09/2013 11:07 PMPosted by Marathel
Wait, what? I haven't raided this tier due to RL issues but I can't imagine why ToT would inspire me to put HT back on my bars (other than my Nature's Swiftness+HT macro). HT is bad. Glyphed Regrowth >> HT


Harmony boosts the power of your direct healing spells which include Healing Touch. The more mastery you have the stronger it heals for.

To give you an idea. My resto druid is 489ilvl. Mastery is at 4183 which boosts direct healing by 18 percent.

My Regrowth hits normally for 42-44k. IT crits anywhere from 83-86k. Short cast, slightly more expensive than Healing Touch.

Healing touch hits normally for 84kish. With almost a 1 second cast time difference. It crits for 165k plus. On my 489ilvl resto druid.

All of this is just how I see it in my opinion.


Using the argument that Harmony boosts your direct heals and then mentioning healing touch is pointless. Guess what's also a direct heal? Glyphed regrowth.

As you stated it's all opinion based, but it was awhile before I took to the regrowth train and can't see myself going back. As you stated your regrowth heals for 83-86k with a quicker cast time versus 84k healing touch. If you glyph regrowth you're guaranteed a living seed proc for about 25k with your current gear every time. Based on your ilvl I would guess you're around 15% crit raid buffed, so you can't count on healing touch critting very often.

The mana difference is like 480 mana which is also fairly negligible in the grand scheme of things. Quicker heals = More GCDs = More healing in those burst situations.
Reply Quote
100 Tauren Druid
19385
I do NOT glyph regrowth. Why? Living seed isn't the greatest in my opinion - back when we had trees it got 1 point out of 3 or something like that from me.

I have seen the HoT/refresh from regrowth save lives(how it refreshes if they below 50% HP), especially in heroic raiding!

Glyphed Regrowth + Incarnation = Godmode on certain fights. I love it as my second CD on Megaera as I can pop Incarnation before Rampage, pre-LB as many raid members as possible, then spam crit Regrowths using the OoC procs.

Since there really aren't any glyphs I find more compelling than Regrowth, it is the one glyph I haven't swapped out since MoP launced. The HoT ticks on it seem fairly weak, so other than losing a second source for Swiftmend, I really don't miss it at all.

Living Seed is nice in PvP, because rogues happen.
Reply Quote
94 Worgen Druid
13000
Honestly, the only way they're going to get HT and Nourish back into the druid rotation would be to add synergy to those spells.

Something like changing Nourish's 30% heal bonus if a HoT is present into Nourish increasing periodic healing taken by 30% for 4 seconds. Or change Nourish into a channel like Malefic Grasp, causing extra HoT ticks on the target you channel at plus its own small periodic heal.

Have Healing touch also extend the duration of your rejuv by 4s? Have healing touch generate a Living seed equal to 30% of its overhealing? Make it interact with Swiftmend by having HT splash targets inside Efflo for a % of the base heal? Or just plain make it worth the extra cast time by having the base non-crit heal be at least 10% stronger than a crit Regrowth.
Reply Quote
92 Undead Priest
14890
You druids forget ice crown citadel too easily. My rotation for blood queen was 5xRejuv 1xWild Growth. Repeat until dead.
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Paladin
11435
Stopped reading right there.

That means you're not glyphing regrowth which should *ALWAYS* be hitting for 125k+. No druid with half a brain does not use that glyph. It's literally a function of all our other glyphs being so terrible that there's no other option, and the fact that, that makes it hit as hard as HT, cost the same, and cast far faster...


Ok first of all wow. My druid is ivl 489..not 505ilvl, not 520ilvl. 489.

Second of all the glyph merely GUARANTEES it critcs. . If I said I get 85k regrowth crits I'm not going to magically get it for 125k because I glyph it. Jeez....The glyph merely makes the crit chance 100 percent and it removes the HOT. It does not make Regrowth magically hit harder than before in its critcs. So your number is wrong.
Edited by Marathel on 5/10/2013 10:26 AM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Blood Elf Paladin
11435
Using the argument that Harmony boosts your direct heals and then mentioning healing touch is pointless. Guess what's also a direct heal? Glyphed regrowth.

As you stated it's all opinion based, but it was awhile before I took to the regrowth train and can't see myself going back. As you stated your regrowth heals for 83-86k with a quicker cast time versus 84k healing touch. If you glyph regrowth you're guaranteed a living seed proc for about 25k with your current gear every time. Based on your ilvl I would guess you're around 15% crit raid buffed, so you can't count on healing touch critting very often.

The mana difference is like 480 mana which is also fairly negligible in the grand scheme of things. Quicker heals = More GCDs = More healing in those burst situations.


I know. I merely listed all of that for information's sake because that's how I like to post but nonetheless thank you. I may be one of the few druids but I still have HT on my bar. I don't have nourish though.

Overall I honestly don't know how Blizzard would or could ever shift away from the resto druid style of healing. It's been so consistent for better or worse for a long time now.
Edited by Marathel on 5/10/2013 10:37 AM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Worgen Druid
6550
You druids forget ice crown citadel too easily. My rotation for blood queen was 5xRejuv 1xWild Growth. Repeat until dead.


We are implying that it is getting TOO similar to ICC like healing where the majority of our healing is coming from rejuv spam (but not the 100% uptime blanket of wrath). Many of us remember the horrors of ICC and our 1 - 2 button spam. I recall keeping rejuv rolling on 15 people until the end of fights and coordinating with another druid to make sure they had rejuvs on at least the 2 other groups I did not have them on. I think I only squeezed in WGs on the rare moments I had an available GCD. Mana didn't matter in wrath and it was kind of sickening how difficult it was to OOM even when you reforged out of spirit.

Edit: Unlike druids pallys aren't all about holy light spam anymore, shamans are not all crazy about spamming chain heal, and disc isn't too focused on PW:S blankets (although apparently this is happening now for mechanics that hit really hard). Druids are still primarily all about rolling the rejuvs and on most fights it's 40% - 50% of our healing.
Edited by Stratis on 5/10/2013 2:17 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Pandaren Priest
14930
05/10/2013 02:10 PMPosted by Stratis
You druids forget ice crown citadel too easily. My rotation for blood queen was 5xRejuv 1xWild Growth. Repeat until dead.


We are implying that it is getting TOO similar to ICC like healing where the majority of our healing is coming from rejuv spam (but not the 100% uptime blanket of wrath). Many of us remember the horrors of ICC and our 1 - 2 button spam. I recall keeping rejuv rolling on 15 people until the end of fights and coordinating with another druid to make sure they had rejuvs on at least the 2 other groups I did not have them on. I think I only squeezed in WGs on the rare moments I had an available GCD. Mana didn't matter in wrath and it was kind of sickening how difficult it was to OOM even when you reforged out of spirit.

Edit: Unlike druids pallys aren't all about holy light spam anymore, shamans are not all crazy about spamming chain heal, and disc isn't too focused on PW:S blankets (although apparently this is happening now for mechanics that hit really hard). Druids are still primarily all about rolling the rejuvs and on most fights it's 40% - 50% of our healing.


I wish I could agree with you, but the meta is pushing Disc back into shield spam. Even without the meta, there's so much regen it's possible to do so.
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Druid
12410
05/10/2013 02:18 PMPosted by Tiriel


We are implying that it is getting TOO similar to ICC like healing where the majority of our healing is coming from rejuv spam (but not the 100% uptime blanket of wrath). Many of us remember the horrors of ICC and our 1 - 2 button spam. I recall keeping rejuv rolling on 15 people until the end of fights and coordinating with another druid to make sure they had rejuvs on at least the 2 other groups I did not have them on. I think I only squeezed in WGs on the rare moments I had an available GCD. Mana didn't matter in wrath and it was kind of sickening how difficult it was to OOM even when you reforged out of spirit.

Edit: Unlike druids pallys aren't all about holy light spam anymore, shamans are not all crazy about spamming chain heal, and disc isn't too focused on PW:S blankets (although apparently this is happening now for mechanics that hit really hard). Druids are still primarily all about rolling the rejuvs and on most fights it's 40% - 50% of our healing.


I wish I could agree with you, but the meta is pushing Disc back into shield spam. Even without the meta, there's so much regen it's possible to do so.


After Playing my Disc priest I saw that myself. With the nerfs to DA I felt that the only reliable thing I could do besides SS is spam shields. After I saw this I was like NOPE!! and promptly switched my spec to holy...
Reply Quote
90 Pandaren Priest
14930
After Playing my Disc priest I saw that myself. With the nerfs to DA I felt that the only reliable thing I could do besides SS is spam shields. After I saw this I was like NOPE!! and promptly switched my spec to holy...


I feel like a heretic for saying it, but I'm beginning to think we have way, way too much mana. There has to be a middle ground between "so starving for mana that I can't keep anyone alive in a 5 man" and "swimming in mana up to my eyeballs, I can spam shields for daaaaaays."
Reply Quote
90 Pandaren Monk
12990
05/10/2013 03:38 PMPosted by Tiriel
After Playing my Disc priest I saw that myself. With the nerfs to DA I felt that the only reliable thing I could do besides SS is spam shields. After I saw this I was like NOPE!! and promptly switched my spec to holy...


I feel like a heretic for saying it, but I'm beginning to think we have way, way too much mana. There has to be a middle ground between "so starving for mana that I can't keep anyone alive in a 5 man" and "swimming in mana up to my eyeballs, I can spam shields for daaaaaays."


Careful, lest we return to 4.0 (and some sick bastards might actually enjoy that).

I think that it might be a symptom of the (usually) avoidable raid damage design that we've had lately. My guild is still very much capable of wiping on Horridon N, and the difference between when we play well with the *insert boss fight here*'s fight mechanics and when we don't is pretty polarizing to my bar. There's also an extreme lack of consistency between healer mana regen, so it's hard to generalize. For example, I sometimes wonder how good I'd be on my mana if I wasn't running with both a Priest and Shaman, since I've never been in a situation where I wasn't healing with at least one of them. I can certainly run myself OOM in short order on my Monk if I play poorly as well, but can be insane if I keep up.

The again, it might also be scaling, as you said. I've been wondering for a while now how MoP scaling would turn out since Blizzard decided not to go through with the "item squish", and predicted it would have turned out similar to the end of Cata where mana was a non-issue for most classes in most situations for one reason or another. It might actually end up worse than I thought, since it *seems* similar to the regen levels of the end of Cata, but a tier earlier. The issue will be compounded as people test their limits and start actively reforging out of regen stats for more throughput.
Reply Quote
55 Worgen Mage
11525
05/10/2013 03:38 PMPosted by Tiriel
After Playing my Disc priest I saw that myself. With the nerfs to DA I felt that the only reliable thing I could do besides SS is spam shields. After I saw this I was like NOPE!! and promptly switched my spec to holy...


I feel like a heretic for saying it, but I'm beginning to think we have way, way too much mana. There has to be a middle ground between "so starving for mana that I can't keep anyone alive in a 5 man" and "swimming in mana up to my eyeballs, I can spam shields for daaaaaays."


Is there though? Unless they put a scalin mana cost on spells that went up or down compared to your current gear level, at some point you'd always end up with too much mana. In Cata the same thing happened. They made a push for healer mana to actually be an issue, and it totally was! Success! Except it lasted all of 1 full tier because it was really only balanced for that 1 tier and people got better gear.

It'd be difficult to come up with a system that makes it not incredibly stressful for newer healers and keepin it so that veteran healers don't have too much mana, while at the same time makin gear upgrades actually matter.
Reply Quote
100 Human Paladin
13880
They need to do something.... Anything, to make Nourish and Healing Touch viable options when HPS needs to be high and mana efficiency is an issue. Can the solution be a proc based system not unlike the Omen of Clarity procs we spend on Regrowth? Think about it.

A least give us a reason to consider using something else.


One idea I had was that casting Nourish or Healing Touch would heal surrounding players within 10 yards of the target, equal to the number of active Rejuvenations, for 50% of the amount healed. For example, if you had 5 Rejuvenations rolling and you cast Nourish on a target for 40k, it would heal up to 5 players within 10 yards of your target for 20k each.

Another idea was to apply the Rejuvenation over-healing buff to your Nourish and Healing Touch, increasing its healing done by an amount equal to 25% of over-healing done by your Rejuvenation.

Random suggestions are random.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
8670
There have been a couple of good suggestions here to diversify our toolkit. I'm not going to get into the spaminess of other classes (disc priest shielding for example) but in the case of druids, I like the idea of some of our spells interacting differently. Turning nourish into a channel that gives our hots extra ticks (copy of malefic grasp) would feel amazing to me. Maybe some people wouldn't want to do that as mistweavers already have a channel and copying warlocks so directly wouldn't be different enough but I still like it.

As far as living seed, it would be nice if it was a smart heal in that it wouldn't proc until the person went below 100% thus adding synergy with absorb classes. Also unless I'm mistaken it only procs on direct damage thus changing it to proc on any damage would go a long way to making it more attractive to put on the raid.

As far as healing touch, I'm not sure what to do with it. Maybe add some synergy with effloresence in that mana cost and cast time are reduced by 50% when anyone is standing in it. Actually I take that back, it would be better if healing touch added time to rejuv as someone suggested. An extra three seconds would be great.

Surely if this was all added to our toolkit as is it would be overpowered but if it was put in the variety of spells we would heal with would go up as well as improving synergy with other healers. Of course also this wouldn't be able to be implemented until next xpac, but with that implementation numbers could be tweaked to be balanced. There's a lot they can do with this class to get away from rejuv spamming via implementing spells that interact with each other more and I'm sure the same could be said for other classes as well.

As far as this xpac goes, there are a couple realistic things they could do in my mind. Reduce swiftmend cooldown by 2 seconds or remove glyph of wild growth and make it baseline (with possibly a buff to healing done or no cd penalty and more importantly make it hit players that are at full health and not pets) and to promote healing touch possibly reduce the cast time by .5 seconds and forget swiftmend reduction as removing wild growth glyph could promote the use of healing touch glyph which with a reduced cast time would promote more healing touch use (2 healing touches per swiftmend could be realistic) and result in that 2 second reduction on swiftmend. If these additions are op simply nerf rejuv a little bit.
Edited by Halfatree on 5/11/2013 2:13 PM PDT
Reply Quote
90 Night Elf Druid
9210
@Halfatree

Another channeled spell will just hurt our mobility, like Tranq does sometimes.

May need to nerf RG glyph in exchange for redesigned HT and Rejuv glyphs, which have never been great.
Reply Quote
90 Troll Druid
11195
so last night I was mostly just rejuv - on everyone. Rejuv spamming the raid over and over and not going OOM.


Xiata, I think you're exaggerating a bit here. I have a lot more regen than you and even I can't continually spam RJ (when it's actually needed) endlessly.

We loose the 10% cost from the t-14 2pc which is really a costly thing in terms of rj spamming. The only way to counter this at all is to stack more spirit than mastery.
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]