[quote]In this thread I didn't say ret is fine, we're not. We need a defensive that is reliable, we don't need more damage and we don't need more utility, those aspects of ret ARE FINE. Maybe bad players don't utilize them and get stuck at low ratings (yourself and Impulsikk) but it's not a class issue, it's a player issue. However way to be a typical 1800 player and think we need damage or utility as a solution to us "being the most trainable class in the game
Your clearly a reasonable player, but I would have to disagree on our damage, it is too low in PvE and PvP. We need to be about 10-15% higher sustained imao. Our CDs are easily countered by cc.
Our heals are easily shut down as utility (which I would be guessing we are balanced around).
I have no issues with my damage in PvP, I don't really PvE much as ret so I can't speak on that front but as far as arenas go, co-ordinating burst on CC from myself and partners has given my no troubles landing kills. Of course they don't happen in the first set of cooldowns usually but very very rarely do games last past my second guardian (if they even make it that far, usually in my experience my second wings is enough to land a kill)
The biggest part of it is having a confident team though, yes our cooldowns are easily stopped by CC but that's true of every class' cooldowns, that's where your healer and partners come in. Part of being a skilled player is knowing when to burst, so when your trinket is down and you're off fear DR while your healer is eating a CC you should NOT be trying to burst. This will lead to you eating cc.
Properly bursting means popping your cooldowns while you have CC on at least one of the opponents, or you have methods to stop CC/get out of it once it goes off, this includes bubble, trinket, healer dispel, tremor, mass dispel etc.
Once your team has that stuff down I think you'll find no issues with your damage.
Oh also even though it isn't directly doing damage remember sacing a partner from a fear, kicking a poly or bopping a partner out of a blind, or using devotion aura allowing them to use their abilities adds a HUGE amount of pressure to your team.