I want more paladin in my class!

90 Blood Elf Paladin
10465
When I started playing WoW, I chose paladin because that's the class I like to play in any game. That was four years ago, and I really enjoyed the introductory quests and class-specific quests that made you feel like your character was a paladin.

Danqna started out as a young knight from Silvermoon who earned his sword and paladin (blood knight) status, then set out into the world, learning how a paladin used his abilities. At 80, the differences between Retribution/Protection/Holy were mostly what got powered up and enabled via talents. You were a full paladin with almost all abilities, but they were significantly empowered or weakened when you were in the alternate specs.

That's gone, and with it has gone the feeling of being a paladin. Seriously, I forget how to consecrate ground when I'm holy? I don't have aura's any more? My ability to sacrifice my life to shield another player from all damage for 5 minutes has been forgotten? My raid damage buff is gone? My blessings are now watered down to exactly the same ability as other classes? Why don't I have the ability to decrease damage intake by my raid any more, or the ability to take damage for the raid? My beacon now only works with some of my heal spells because apparently there's two versions of the Light, the Light that works with beacons and the Light that doesn't. My judgements went from healing/regenerating/slowing enemies to simple damage spells.

It seems like class balance has taken the "paladin" out of my class and replaced it with other classes abilities with a "holy" name tacked on.

Sorry for ranting a little, but does anyone else feel we're slowly losing our class? Is there a positive change in our class that you think makes us more like paladins that I'm missing?

(I have adapted to the changes, I'm not complaining that my class is hard to play. If anything, healing is easier now than it has ever been. I just don't like moving towards "Generic Healer #10941151")
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90 Human Paladin
13955
While not all changes have been bad, I am kind of annoyed at how Paladins get almost totally revamped every expansion.
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90 Human Paladin
9970
Perhaps this is a side effect of playing too many different games, but I have a really hard time getting attached to any specific mechanic as "this is what it means to be a Paladin". Sure, some of the removed abilities were thematically really cool (e.g., Divine Sacrifice), but so are some of the new abilities (e.g. Glyph of Battle Healer).

Do I still wear heavy armor, fight in melee, wield Light-based powers of healing and smiting, and place a large emphasis on protecting allies? If yes, I'm a Paladin; the rest is just details.
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90 Dwarf Paladin
12730
Mostly, I'm with Rav on this one - slap a label on, but give it the right tools, and it's still a Paladin to me. But, looking back at DKs now that I'm leveling a second and looking at the Monk I leveled, I do agree that the class flavor needs to be brought back. Monks are the only class with a class-specific daily for a unique, long, persistent buff and free gold. It's kind of a slap in the face to the other classes. We don't even get a quest every ten levels any more - I think the Vanilla classes get special quests to thirty, then they're done.

I remember, back in BC when I started, busting my ass to solo instances to craft Verigan's Fist. It felt epic, connected me with the character and the game...Sure, I was disappointed that it was an Int piece (and, at that stage of my WoW career, disappointed that it was a two-hander - Sword'n'Board Ret for life!) but the undertaking was what mattered, especially since there was no Dungeon Finder, no mounts before 40, and a lot fewer flight points.

I'd like to see some of that brought back to the game. I think that feeling, that connection, is what's kept me on my Paladin even though it was about two years between first rolling and becoming a serious WoW player; I had no illusions or thoughts about rolling anything fresh when I came back for good, I just wanted to get back to my Pally.

Now, from an "in-game" standpoint, it could be argued that the Light grants to us the powers it sees fit; with the Aspects becoming mortal, that speaks to a rather serious shift in the aethereal dynamic. The Aspect of Magic was slain, replaced, then the new one chose to retire - how could the mystical powers of Azeroth not be affected in unforeseeable ways? And, being that were forces for Good, Light, and Justice, I see us as being more aligned with the Alexstraza and the Red Flight, and her sudden shucking of power would thus have affected us deeply. Mere conjecture, of course, as I'm not as up on the lore as most, just simply pointing out that the world has changed a lot since those early days when many of us first embarked out on our journeys of discovery - and I don't just mean the scars left behind form Deathwing's Cataclysm.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
10465
I don't mind getting revamped when that means "Adjusted your damage around, added a new ability, modified the time effect of some of your skills to balance." It's not even losing a few abilities. I understand that change happens, but when you can look at the class you started off with and what it has become and there appears to be two totally different classes, you do wonder why.

For "what it means to be a paladin", I still play Pathfinder, a derivative of the older D&D 3.5 OGL, and I was able to loosely apply those references to my paladin. BC strongly focused on the Light with the Sunwell and Silvermoon's quests reflected it as well. Tyrion Fordring in Wrath channeled the Light as well, and paladins really messed up the undead. Protection paladins had abilities to suck up damage the raid was taking and to reduce incoming damage etc. We've lost that part, at least.

I can see where you could say that any class with the label and a few of the paladin tools can fit the category, but then it sort of becomes "Blizzard's Paladin v.1.1". I'm not saying paladins are not paladins right now, I'm saying they don't appear to have the same goals and abilities that they did back when I first rolled.

Class flavor is very cool. Back when everyone had an item they required in Shadowfang Keep to create something for their class, it was great to be accomplishing a solo goal while advancing a group as well. I guess Blizzard is moving away from it though - I mean, we no longer even have to have a class trainer to teach us our abilities, we get them automatically - there's no reminder of "Oh hey, I'm a paladin and this guy's a paladin so he trains me."

I guess part of my memories are that WotLK was a very "undead" flavoured expansion, which fit my paladin's goals. The last two expansions have left me wondering what my paladin is doing.

I mean, MOP, it's basically a holiday in a foreign continent! Uther would be screaming "Get back to work!"
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90 Human Paladin
9970
In MoP, we're protecting a land from its infestation of ageless, unkillable abominations that feed on fear and despair, while also trying to check the aggression of more than one would-be conqueror. It's not tailor-made to Paladins like WotLK was, but I haven't felt particularly out of place :)

I do see what you mean about "v1.1"; I don't think it's worse by any meaningful measure, but the modern Paladin certainly is very different from the Classic or TBC or Wrath Paladin.
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90 Human Death Knight
6425
BC pallys sucked at everything minus heals. Enjoy the changes
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90 Human Paladin
7065
I, too, miss my class quests. Verigan's Fist was the shizz, but yeah... damn nostalgia.

I do miss judgement changing with seals, and I miss auras. And those little spells you rarely used but just seemed so paladin-y like Divine Intervention were the icing on the cake. I would like paladins to be more like they were in vanilla-wrath; all our utility (even though I never used it because I admit to being a keyboard turner back then!) and other spells made me feel like a paladin. Now, I just feel like a generic warrior with fancy armour and better visual effects.
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90 Human Paladin
5205
BC pallys sucked at everything minus heals. Enjoy the changes
Class utility isn't everything in a game. There's also a little thing called flavor, that every game designer will recognize as key to get gamer engagement.

A little example. There's a game named Darksiders, which is basically a Legend of Zelda clone. You have a sword, a blocking device (a giant gauntlet) and you explore around as you move through the story. But this story is different enough to be engaging, and the game mechanics (like jumping, swimming at one own's content, and the timing related attacks that makes devastating combos) make it unique. And the blood. It's pretty satisfying to see a demon turn into a gooey fountain of blood while you lay the smack down to it.
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90 Night Elf Druid
3800
Druid dropping in to say I feel your pain and agree. Druids too have lost their quests and stories that set them apart. I quested for my forms on this toon and did not on my second druid......really big difference in the experience. Moonglade now is basically a joke...just another place to have the Ancients holiday event....may as well be Darkmoon fair...

I am leveling a Pally and have wondered "what am I missing"? I know Shamans had quests to get different totem abilities that were yanked too.

I understand making the new abilities as they come more accessible, but give people some sort of class specific flavor....a story and things to do. It is odd they have given to the Monks what other classes had and at the same time they just threw away the flavor for the other classes....remember the ally bar fight with the drunk to start warrior training....rogue missions....so much more I probably don't have a clue about....

Bring some of that feel back Blizz
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90 Draenei Paladin
7280
While I never played a Paladin before Cata, I do find that I enjoy the class and I get a feel for being the benevolent protector. Of course I've made some sacrifices to DPS in Ret spec. I enjoy being able to use abilities such as "Selfless Healer" and "Stay of Execution" or "Light's Hammer" to help my fellow mates in Dungeons or Raids. I figure that since I'm not gonna make top DPS (or anywhere near it), I can at least make sure the DPS we do have stay around a bit longer.

I keep Healbot up and have all of my Hands and such configured. Using Hand of Sacrifice, Hand of Freedom, or the dreaded Hand of Protection to keep someone alive or out of the fire long enough for a healer to help them is part of my enjoyment of the class. I've never used Lay on Hands on myself in Ret spec (while in a group). It would feel... wrong.

Sure it's harder to keep up an optimal rotation, which I can't seem to do as a Ret pally anyhow, and my DPS may suffer some, but I have a Fury warrior for fulfilling that need to kill things as efficiently as possible. This character is about smiting the enemy while keeping an eye to my compatriots and being willing to lay my own life on the line to help those who are in a pinch.

Tanking is a different story... The thought process is pretty much, "Stay alive, watch that, taunt this, move, move, move..." Less poetic, but still noble since in a raid, or occasionally a heroic, my life is the main thing allowing others to keep theirs.
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90 Human Paladin
15265
No, I dont miss 2 of my specs being useless.
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90 Human Paladin
6105
I still have verigans fist. I lived and died as a shockadin which in my opinion was the epidemy of a paladin . I would love to see holy power coming from our eyes or some kind of visual that shows we have pure power iminating from us. AS far as melee classes no other class represents this genre of game more than the paladin show us some love blizz!
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90 Human Paladin
6105
Paladin=America
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
7685
Why don't I have the ability to decrease damage intake by my raid any more


well, you got devotion aura, a raid cooldown that reduces raid damage, removes silence and prevents silence!

i do think the consecrate thing is kind of stupid, the lights hammer talent is a nice fill in though if you are missing consecrate. still, holy wrath i also miss.

they need to bring back some more of our old blessings, simply having a mastery and 5% stat buff is kind of lame. they should create a spellpower/crit blessing, perhaps call it blessing of wisdom or something.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
10465
There's more to a game than how powerful you are. There is an argument that to be engaged by a story in a game you need to feel like you're in the hot seat. Just visit any paper-based RPG website and ask how many people would play if their GM just sat there and told them all what their characters did. Part of feeling like part of the story is for your character to make their goals his/her own. For me, that is best expressed by a paladin (as most stories' heroes tend to be good).

MMO's are linear already, but unless WoW's ultimate goal is to let people pick their own spells and abilities and create their own class, then I don't see a reason for all these changes to make us one great big melting pot of generic heroes.

05/15/2013 08:05 AMPosted by Jerris
Druid dropping in to say I feel your pain and agree. Druids too have lost their quests and stories that set them apart.

Druid was my second character to 80, loved the class for its flavor. I remember what a pain it was to find trainers, I ended up making my home in Silvermoon as it was the quickest way to a trainer when we didn't have flight. Still, reminded you that your kind wasn't the city-loving type.

they should create a spellpower/crit blessing, perhaps call it blessing of wisdom or something.

I believe a Cata decision was made to remove Spellpower from everything except weapons and replace it with INT. Prior to 4.1 we had a spell called Blessing of Wisdom that restored mana, like shamans had a totem that did the same thing. Heh, there's a class that could be outraged - shamans losing their totems.

Now, I just feel like a generic warrior with fancy armour and better visual effects.

I say it best, when I just quote someone else!
Edited by Danqna on 5/15/2013 11:03 PM PDT
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90 Dwarf Paladin
12730
05/15/2013 10:55 PMPosted by Danqna
I believe a Cata decision was made to remove Spellpower from everything except weapons and replace it with INT. Prior to 4.1 we had a spell called Blessing of Wisdom that restored mana, like shamans had a totem that did the same thing. Heh, there's a class that could be outraged - shamans losing their totems.


Spellpower still exists in buff form - Mages, Warlock's, and, I think still, Shaman bring it.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
12310
The only thing I truly truly miss are Auras -- especially when I see a priest with a Chakra on. That could have been us! T_T
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90 Draenei Paladin
16880
We have lost a lot of flavor over the years and you can see some of the homogenization for the sake of class balance to be sure.

Also removing all the class quests and such that actually taught you what it meant to be your class was one of the hugest mistakes Blizzard has ever made.

That said I still feel like a Paladin, but I can agree with your sentiment somewhat.

especially when I see a priest with a Chakra on. That could have been us! T_T


Yeah, very jelly of the Chakra thing.
Edited by Cadenbrie on 5/15/2013 11:30 PM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
10465
Spellpower still exists in buff form - Mages, Warlock's, and, I think still, Shaman bring it.

Thanks for the correction, it's been a while.
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