Atonement healing nerf

90 Human Priest
11345
05/25/2013 04:29 AMPosted by Volios
Disc feels like it has a difficult time carrying it's share of the load during extended periods of very high damage.


During the last 40% of Ra-den this week - which is when he starts AoEing the raid heavily - I did ~220k effective hps (over 350k hps including overhealing) for just over two minutes. How much throughput does a spec that is also bringing powerful damage reduction cds and added dps need?

Yes, other healers will be able to exceed disc's maximum sustained throughput when the situation is good for them (see: healing rain on a stacked raid) but that's fine - every spec should be the best at something. There are very rarely situations where the incoming damage is so high that disc throughput gets left behind (a few fights on 25man heroic), and even then if the raid is able to stack up under barrier, it's providing a ton of damage reduction - comparable to the amount healed by hymn or tranq - that isn't showing up on the meters.
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90 Human Priest
11345
Also yes, you should still penance pretty much on cd during heavy raid damage. I haven't checked for lower gear levels, but it should be the same. PoH is higher throughput on paper, but this assumes no overheal (PoH overheals more than atonement penance). Having the T15 4p is enough to push penance ahead even in zero overheal situations, and of course you also get evangelism stacks (and you'd rather not have to smite for them during high damage phases).

Edit: T15, not T14
Edited by Amabella on 5/25/2013 2:09 PM PDT
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90 Pandaren Priest
12820
During the last 40% of Ra-den this week - which is when he starts AoEing the raid heavily - I did ~220k effective hps (over 350k hps including overhealing) for just over two minutes. How much throughput does a spec that is also bringing powerful damage reduction cds and added dps need?

Yes, other healers will be able to exceed disc's maximum sustained throughput when the situation is good for them (see: healing rain on a stacked raid) but that's fine - every spec should be the best at something. There are very rarely situations where the incoming damage is so high that disc throughput gets left behind (a few fights on 25man heroic), and even then if the raid is able to stack up under barrier, it's providing a ton of damage reduction - comparable to the amount healed by hymn or tranq - that isn't showing up on the meters.


Fair point I suppose. Yes, there aren't a wealth of situations where it becomes problematic. And yes, Barrier is worth a mention. It's not necessarily about Disc being weak enough to be at a severe disadvantage here. It has more to do with how absorb significance varies across different types of content.

I'd agree Disc more than makes up for it's weaknesses by being valuable or strong in other areas (damage, DR CD's, stabilization, etc). What I question is whether it could be weaker where it's currently strong now, and stronger where it's weak, but still remain the best at it's niche while giving the "healing game" more consistency across different levels of content and encounter design.

Admittedly this creates a bit of an internal conflict as well. I recall a time period in this game where healing was more tightly specialized, and as a result it certainly felt more interesting. So on one hand it I'd prefer if Disc were as specialized if not more specialized for absorbs. The problem is as new expansions have come about, and the game has evolved, it seems like there has been a shift more and more toward homogenizing the healing specs. In that type of concept I question whether Discipline should be as specialized toward absorption, despite the fact I don't necessarily prefer the concept to begin with.
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90 Human Priest
11345
I agree that absorb significance (and disc's strength) varies between content types. I just see it more as roughly balanced for those 25man heroic super heavy damage fights that eat through absorbs and wildly overpowered for everything else (as opposed to some people who think it's balanced on normal modes and weak on heroics).

It's also harder to turn theoretical maximum hps in a zero overheal environment into actual hps for most other classes as they suffer a lot more from overheal than disc does.
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90 Night Elf Priest
13930
Your argument basically boils down to saying that evenly distributed healing is somehow better than the same amount (or even more) healing focused on the players most in danger of dying. If you're just shielding random players (or full health players over low health ones) then that's pretty bad, but if you are finishing a PoH cast and there's a raid member at very low hp and you choose to cast another PoH instead of shielding them, you made a significant error regardless of raid size.


Well, when raid damage is high enough, it's very possible that many if not most of the raid will be at very low HPS. When that's true, I believe prioritizing one when many are so low is a significant error.

05/25/2013 04:29 AMPosted by Volios
I mean, that discussion has come up before but I still disagree that the absorbs don't need a bit more trimming, with a little bit of compensation on the healing side of the coin. The primary reason is absorbs end up dictating where the healing/peak output of the spec has to be for it to be relatively balanced. And the healing/peak output of the spec seems like it's lacking.


Oh, I didn't mean to imply that absorbs are in a perfect place. I wouldn't argue too much if it were trimmed more and we saw some sort of change to our raw healing. I don't want to see much change to PoH; I think it's already carrying too much weight. That leaves PoM and our level 90 talents.

I've been adamant against in the past, but I'm wondering if it might not be time to introduce a new AE healing ability for Disc.
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90 Human Priest
11345
Well, when raid damage is high enough, it's very possible that many if not most of the raid will be at very low HPS. When that's true, I believe prioritizing one when many are so low is a significant error.


This isn't the situation I was referring to (and I agree that casting PoH is fine when everyone's low unless you know someone in particular is about to take more damage). I was referring to situations like the following: the raid is at ~70% and one person drops to 20% (maybe they have biting cold during Kazra'jin's discharge on council or something).
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90 Night Elf Priest
13930
Ah, yes. I wanted to clarify because the situation I offered was the point of view from which I was speaking. I fully agree with what you just brought up.
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90 Pandaren Priest
13030
How does everyone feel about this? a 10% drop in atonement healing... Outrageous


Power Word Solace isn't using atonement. it uses its own kind of atonement and that is still 100%. basically only smite and penance got nerfed.

Using a crit heavy build and by using atonement a !@#$ ton (most fights i'm 50-60k dps) i'm top HPS on normals pretty much every fight in my group.

Although the monk in my group does 70-80k dps just fistweaving. healing through atonement has lower hps than normal heals but it has the benefits of doing alot of dps.
by using a hybrid you can 3 heal fights that are supposed to be 2 healed, That in itself is outstanding.
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90 Human Priest
9830
Bah humbug!
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90 Blood Elf Mage
11000
Saw OP in an LFR about a week ago doing 9khps on Lei Shen, not AFK either.

Needs more Atonement.
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