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I'd rather go with the legs from Horridon or Durumu. Pathogenic gloves have so much hit... fabled feather does not like those gloves.
I'm personally going for helm, shoulders, chest, and gloves for the prot 4 piece. I have the heroic horridon legs atm and I believe I won't be replacing those.
Then again, I did not do the math.
Edited by Perseus on 5/25/2013 7:49 AM PDT
Ret tier chest.
I have to disagree. The 4pc, if I had it, would be one of the better set bonuses out there. Even on normal, I could see the use of Divine Protection (especially with unbreakable spirit) making things much easier than they would be without it. That's not to say it's required, but it certainly does help.
I can't think of a fight where the prot 4 piece would not be extremely useful. Perhaps Iron Qon.
Bosses don't hit me for upwards of 20% of my HP at a time even on 10H outside of... ehh... H Horridon rampage, that's about it. For H Primordius, it'd sure be great, but I'm not there yet.
In any case, getting 4pc would mean, in my case, dropping from 12.5K haste (which is like, a LOT of haste) to something like 7k. That's a huge drop considering I get a set bonus I basically won't ever use (2pc) and a set bonus that's useful on pretty much 2 fights this tier, with 1 being a farm fight... and on top of that only in the last ~2minutes of the fight (Horridon, Primordius).
I mean, lacking 4pc doesn't mean you suddenly can't use DP, or DP+Unbreakable Spirit. It makes it better if you're taking truckloads of damage, but you DON'T on normals. Like, seriously, you just don't.
So.. yeah, nah, pass.
Edited by Kangarooster on 5/25/2013 10:56 AM PDT
You use Fabled Feather as a tanking trinket? That's an interesting choice. I recognize that I'm using a pair of STR trinkets now myself but its only because I've had terrible luck with trinket so far. Fabled Feather just seems odd as that much Hit is bound to cause wasted stats somewhere and the biggest value doesn't last long at all.
Too much Hit is almost always going to be an issue anyway, but if its a huge issue (thanks to using Fabled Feather, for example), then yeah Pathogenic won't be as good (though they don't really have that much hit). But that misses out on Pathogenic's extra socket over tier which is what puts it over the top. Its got good itemization AND an extra socket, a combination you'll be hard pressed to find on any other off-tier piece.
For legs there are a lot of good choices. The ones off Horridon and Primordious are strong, but Whipping Ionization off Lei-Shen are also good thanks to the extra socket. Depending on how you value things, I could see an argument for using anyone of those three *or* Pathogenic gloves as your offspec. I've personally already upgraded my Dark Parasite legs (don't have tier there yet anyway) but I'd swap to tier legs and Pathogenic hands if I had the option.
For 4 piece, it varies by fight. Ballpark, each 20% of your health you take during DP (assuming once/minute) provides the defensive value of another ~400 Haste. Haste isn't a great defensive stat, but it does have some value, and the value is concentrated since you're getting the extra HoPo right then when you're getting slammed.
Edited by Wrathblood on 5/25/2013 11:08 AM PDT
I also have H Feathers (reforged to haste). I'm at like 8% hit but it's really a better alternative to... okay, well, actually, I have zero other trinkets. So there's that.
Honestly, right now I'd prefer Rising Winds as the stacking STR is rather underwhelming when you have like 200k Vengeance, but loot in 10m is a fickle thing.
Its got good itemization AND an extra socket, a combination you'll be hard pressed to find on any other off-tier piece.I actually like the DPS Qon gloves more if you're flooded with hit like I am, since crit>hit since... well, yeah, hit past excess is literally 100% useless.
Temporary solution to replacing Feathers with perhaps a H Lei Shen's Final Orders 2/2 and/or Fortitude+Rising Winds, though.
The excess of hit is actually why I'm sticking with H Horridon legs as (functionally) BiS over H Durumu legs. Okay, so Durumu legs have expertise rather than hit, but all the native hit on my gear is being reforged into expertise anyway, plus the more haste you have, the better mastery is, of course. I basically have enough haste to the point where I feel like mastery is a stat I almost rank as high as haste now, although never to the exclusion of haste of course.
I really, really, just dislike 4pc. Not only do you have to drop haste for it, pieces like the shoulders are more poorly itemized (hit/mastery instead of exp/mastery... when we're rolling in hit) so that's even more suboptimal.
Especially in 10m, I also value my DPS a lot more - to the point where I really just shun avoidance since they don't grant significant damage boosts.
Edited by Kangarooster on 5/25/2013 11:15 AM PDT
I thought you were rolling a Warrior this tier, Kanga?
As for 4piece, yeah, that's why I kinda soft-sold the value of 4 piece this tier. There's value to it and I'm happy that I've finally be able to at least ballpark that value (I'm sure Theck will soon chart out my incorrectness to the 4th decimal place, which will be to the benefit of everyone including me, but for now I'm happy with it), but I would not say the value is high enough to recommend everyone going out an getting it.
For most folks I suspect its a matter of managing around what drops. If tier head drops for me, I'll happily swap my helm for it and pick up my 4 piece. If Pathogenic drop, then I'll happily swap my tier for it and lose nothing by going from 3 tier to 2. It only becomes an issue when you've putting the final touches on your BiS list or if you're incredibly lucky with your drops, in which case I'm a little bitter.
I was forced to swap ( http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/cho'gall/sparklefever/advanced ) after someone brought up 1 tanking Qon and also we have 5 people on Prot tier :c
It's okay though, outside of DKs and Druids I actually really love how BrM/both Prots play this expansion. Took a lot of readjusting from Wrath/Cata to get used to my Paladin though, and it is still very annoying that base Prot Pally damage is stupidly low.
There is literally nothing in the Prot Warrior or even Brewmaster kit that compares to the sheer LOL I AM A FREAKING GOD feeling of Holy Avenger during Bloodlust though. I am guessing it's pretty much what Bears feel during Berserk/Incarnation as well, except I'm at 1s GCD with lust so... pretty much a god.
Edited by Kangarooster on 5/25/2013 11:35 AM PDT
i like ur shield
Haha. Int shields are always an option if you have really, really horrid luck with legit tank shields. I remember mathing out 522 Tortos' Discarded Shell to be a huge, unequivocal upgrade to the 489 Steelskin, Qiang's Impervious Shield I started the tier with and weeping softly. Fortunately, I had decent tank shield drops and it never came to that.
I mean... *cough* he's bad.
Heh, off-hands/shields simply don't exist for us. I'd have gone with an INT shield if we'd had an extra.
We started heroics late this tier because of attendance issues yet we still had 4 people with 476 off-hands at that point. We've had exactly 2 shields drop so far this expansion. I got the tanking one off Spirit Kings and our former holy pally got the healing one and then split.
Getting a shield out of a heroic scenario was absurdly good fortue for me.
Yes, I did a thread on that already. I don't know what Blizzard was thinking when they itemized the Prot chest piece with BOTH Avoidance stats.
Parry/Expertise or Parry/Hit or even Parry/Mastery would have been fine. However, like most say, the Ret chest piece having 3 sockets and Haste/Expertise is a much better choice and frankly, it's better than all the other offset pieces too.
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