Did they finally take the suit off?

90 Human Paladin
3955
I agree with Bright. Too much effort required to keep up and keep competitive.

Dailies, Dailies & Dailies killed it for me.


Don't forget to run LFR, those upgrades are needed for your guild to progress. Done your profession dailies? What about the 2 world bosses? Did you check the BMAH every day? Don't forget about your Halfhill farm.

You don't get capped VP from just raiding either, so try to do a heroic or something every day or you're left running heroics for hours on Monday night.

Oh don't forget to do it all again on your alt, you need to maintain that so you can do a normal clear to funnel loot into your main team.

MoP is ridiculous for the amount of upkeep a single toon needs, let alone 2/3/4/5 that 25m raiding guilds require.

edit: Don't forget to do Flex raids next tier too!

doesn't matter if the content is the best its been in years, being forced to raid with down syndromes because they're the only ones applying is the problem


^And to note that the Oceanic raiding scene has rotted out, the recruitment pool is nonexistent.
Edited by Deluggy on 6/10/2013 7:37 AM PDT
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90 Human Paladin
14960
The time it takes to have multiple characters at their best... I'm talking capping valor, running lfr, doing dailys for coins, actually learning how to play it, the list goes on.
Believe it or not people actually have a job and/or study as well as all the other things normal people have to do. The effort vs reward is just... no... not worth the trouble.

This isn't just limited to 25 man either.


Absolutely agree with you there and that's why I've found stepping back to a 9 hour raid week that much more beneficial. Occasional alts whenever I can be bothered, Not capping valor as a mandatory thing - all of those increased my enjoyment as opposed to chasing an oceanic or server first and feeling like it's a second job.

Although Exodus/Vodka example is not that relevant to Oceanic raiding guilds, since none are pushing for World First rankings, it is somewhat accurate in the sense that players are growing out of the game. Quality replacements are nearly impossible to find, be it in 25 or 10 format.

Oceanic 25 mans died a long time ago with Adept.


It's probably just as relevant given the proliferation of guilds on a similar level in the region. We saw at the start of this tier how many oceanic guilds raided during the day, something that really came into play in the first place with Adept.

doesn't matter if the content is the best its been in years, being forced to raid with down syndromes because they're the only ones applying is the problem


That's the problem. 10mans need far less commitment organisationally and are simpler to micro-manage so people don't want to break that up. I know whilst we've chased the idea it's a difficult proposition to sell. Where before SU could have gotten people from the rank 2-10 guilds, now they're not interested.
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90 Blood Elf Hunter
20175
Although Exodus/Vodka example is not that relevant to Oceanic raiding guilds, since none are pushing for World First rankings, it is somewhat accurate in the sense that players are growing out of the game. Quality replacements are nearly impossible to find, be it in 25 or 10 format.

Like I said, no oceanic guild is going to the lengths that some of the top world guilds are, but the sheer amount of hours that still went into pushing for rankings was like nothing I've seen prior to this expansion. Being "Oceanic first" has never been a big achievement, striving for top US rankings was the end goal really.

I'm really bad at putting what I'm thinking down on paper so this won't come out right. But yes, the fresh blood coming through to fill the holes the old players have left are just not on the same level, by no fault of their own. Learning all the things that seem second nature to experienced players takes time, can't really be fast tracked.
That being said, there are some great players around but who wants to raid like 25-30+ hours a week without breaks between tiers. Like you mentioned, player base is ageing and with that comes less free time generally.
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90 Pandaren Monk
13940
Unless you can clear the raid at world first pace and slow down within 2-4 weeks of the tier opening, it's just not worth the time commitment and stress to raid at a hardcore level. Just getting oceanic top ranks alone requires throwing yourself at bosses for months and you still end up with an almost nobody US rank, because 1st is all that tends to matter.

The game has been much more fun since I stepped back from 12-16+ hours a week raiding to 7 hours a week. Sure, I have to live with not seeing my name up at oceanic 2nd/3rd anymore but I got past that quickly.

I'm still killing bosses, and still having a blast doing it.
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