Sad State of Resto Shaman: Mechanics Oriented

90 Pandaren Shaman
13745
I have to say though theres 3 Active threads on mmo Champ about resto shamans about 5 On Healing / Ptr Forums, Blizzard has a lot of insight to look at they just refuse to show any attention to us and thats a BIG problem on their part.
Edited by Thráll on 6/26/2013 2:42 PM PDT
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I have to say though theres 3 Active threads on mmo Champ about resto shamans about 5 On Healing / Ptr Forums, Blizzard has a lot of insight to look at they just refuse to show any attention to us and thats a BIG problem on their part.


Just because they are posting on another forum's post about babies and what not, and not posting on these does not mean they aren't reading them and taking notes. Blues have to have fun too or they would not be doing what they do...
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90 Pandaren Shaman
8490
I have to say though theres 3 Active threads on mmo Champ about resto shamans about 5 On Healing / Ptr Forums, Blizzard has a lot of insight to look at they just refuse to show any attention to us and thats a BIG problem on their part.


its cause we have 0.4% representation, no one is playing Ghost Crawlers foresaken shaman class, warlocks had like 180 page post for gosh sakes..if we had that they would be forced to respond. But we don't, because no one plays resto shamans, its a self fulfilling prophecy.

At this point, i wonder why there is still even a resto shaman class, we should jsut all go ele and just spam chain lighting, it doesn't take much skill.
Go assedance lava burst your way to ez victory. Keep up flame shock and lighting bolt here and a bit.
What also pisses me off, is that all the ele's get the gear first, if they dont have it, then the sole resto shaman gets it. Were not even worth investing gear in n e more, why invest into a mana tide battery.
Edited by Harrasupanda on 6/26/2013 5:07 PM PDT
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If I have to live through another tier as Elemental I'd rather just quit. GC needs to understand already that he doesn't always knows best. Resto shaman are plagued with issues from TWO expansions behind. How things can still be this way after the atrocity that was Heroic Firelands as a R Shaman is baffling and a sign of negligence.
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90 Pandaren Shaman
12980
With any luck, and no raid testing announced for the rest of the week (yet), we'll hopefully see a new build soon.

Wonder what the chances are of seeing any major shaman changes....

My hopes are not high, but eh... Blizzard never fails to amaze me (granted its usually how blissfully unaware they are).
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100 Draenei Shaman
12210
I dunno, maybe it's because I don't raid at a high enough level (we do as many heroics as we can each tier) but...

My only real shaman complaint is pretty much the same QOL stuff we've been complaining about forever.

I'm hopeful for the chain heal glyph change for 10m Resto shamans. And I think HTT needs to just be Resto baseline already.

Aside from that we just need a better spread healing mechanic. It doesn't have to be amazing, it just has to be useable.
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100 Draenei Shaman
12725
Shaman's balance a line where they can really shine in normal modes because stacking, muscling through, and less movement are all possible. In heroics where movement happens a lot more and people have to really stay spread it begins to hurt. I'm still not convinced the mechanics are sad or need an entire overhaul, but changes should be made none the less.
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93 Draenei Shaman
18325
I did some testing on ptr myself and after that I just give up, unfortunately my guild doesn't have any room for any other class other then shamans even after explaining to them how pointless a resto shaman will be in 5.4. So as blizzard clearly wants time to quit and move on. Good luck to you shamans

P.s: <Alone> is recruiting a shaman :p
@ Aloneguild.com
Edited by Kaylii on 6/27/2013 7:59 PM PDT
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90 Troll Shaman
17270
Shaman's balance a line where they can really shine in normal modes because stacking, muscling through, and less movement are all possible. In heroics where movement happens a lot more and people have to really stay spread it begins to hurt. I'm still not convinced the mechanics are sad or need an entire overhaul, but changes should be made none the less.

It's not even the stacking/spreading. Working on heroic Lei Shen now... everyone MUST be healed up in 2-3 second windows. We ARE the ultimate periodic healers. We have no AoE instant lols. We have no absorbs. I felt this way on normal mode with a lot less gear as well.

People have too little HP and do too much HPS for a periodic healer with no instant (< 4 sec window) raid burst or absorbs.

Unless heroic mode has a -40% healing taken debuff in the entire instance... it's going to be painful. If it did, which it probably won't, I could see shaman's being in a fine place. But it won't.
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100 Draenei Shaman
12725
Also, just considering options. Why not adjust Elemental Blast to be usable by Resto? Unless you're tank healing I find it tough to use Unleashed Elements, but it is at least usable. I was thinking of making it into a heal for Resto Shamans and then castable while moving at the cost of a Tidal Waves stack. Would make Primal Elementalist the best talent for more static fights, UE the best for single target/tank heals, and EB the best for heavy movement fights. It would need tweaks and possibly some for of a splash effect but it certainly could be powerful.

Again, not convinced we are atrocious but I'll be sad if we don't get at least a pass over outside of the minor glyph changes.
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90 Dwarf Shaman
8555
How about this

Elemental Blast redesigned. Now instant cast. When cast on an enemy, it functions as it does now. When cast on a player, it heals that player and 5 other low health raid members for XXX healing.
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1 Tauren Warrior
0
As long as absorb heals and spread out fights exist, shaman healing mastery will never be good.
Those that say otherwise don't truly understand resto shaman.
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90 Tauren Shaman
8940
06/28/2013 08:54 PMPosted by Orrukelem
As long as absorb heals and spread out fights exist, shaman healing mastery will never be good.

I disagree with this.

First off, it'd help if Mastery scaled better at higher health levels, rather than being effective mostly at mid-to-low health.

Second, our Mastery only shines in two situations. The first is during emergencies, the second is when encounter mechanics do not require the raid to be topped off a majority of the time.

Again, not convinced we are atrocious but I'll be sad if we don't get at least a pass over outside of the minor glyph changes.

I'm not expecting anything big until 6.0. Resto Shaman require a lot of work, and that degree of mechanics changes usually occur during beta testing for the next expansion, not during a PTR cycle (although smaller changes can and do occur during PTRs).
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100 Goblin Shaman
18890
The thing about that whole beta argument is that it was the same stuff posted last beta when MoP was being released.

Concerns were raised since the band-aid fix in DS really didn't address issues and so there was hope a new spell would be designed in the beta. HST kinda did that but we are limited by its cooldown and its really juts something you press on cooldown with no thought.

The biggest things they addressed past beta was our severe lack of cooldowns and now we are up to par with the other healers with those. Though we had other (similar) issues they were not addressed.
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90 Troll Shaman
18260
The thing about that whole beta argument is that it was the same stuff posted last beta when MoP was being released.

Concerns were raised since the band-aid fix in DS really didn't address issues and so there was hope a new spell would be designed in the beta. HST kinda did that but we are limited by its cooldown and its really juts something you press on cooldown with no thought.

The biggest things they addressed past beta was our severe lack of cooldowns and now we are up to par with the other healers with those. Though we had other (similar) issues they were not addressed.


Unfortunately they went a little *too* far with the cooldown thing because that's what we are based around now.

I miss the days when chain heal was our main source of throughput, I main changed to my shaman during ICC and yeah some fights really sucked for me, like HLK but I was competitive on the other fights. So while movement killed me when we did HLK, at least it was only a fight or two where I felt useless.

This is not the case these days where almost every fight in ToT makes me feel like I should just bench myself.

And Siege of Org fights look like hell on earth for resto shaman.

So yeah, they gave us cooldowns but they forgot that we also need something to fill in the gaps when those cooldowns are on cool down. Even the 20% buff to CH can not compensate for the OP instant, burst heals out there.
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100 Goblin Shaman
18890
The thing about that whole beta argument is that it was the same stuff posted last beta when MoP was being released.

Concerns were raised since the band-aid fix in DS really didn't address issues and so there was hope a new spell would be designed in the beta. HST kinda did that but we are limited by its cooldown and its really juts something you press on cooldown with no thought.

The biggest things they addressed past beta was our severe lack of cooldowns and now we are up to par with the other healers with those. Though we had other (similar) issues they were not addressed.


Unfortunately they went a little *too* far with the cooldown thing because that's what we are based around now.

I miss the days when chain heal was our main source of throughput, I main changed to my shaman during ICC and yeah some fights really sucked for me, like HLK but I was competitive on the other fights. So while movement killed me when we did HLK, at least it was only a fight or two where I felt useless.

This is not the case these days where almost every fight in ToT makes me feel like I should just bench myself.

And Siege of Org fights look like hell on earth for resto shaman.

So yeah, they gave us cooldowns but they forgot that we also need something to fill in the gaps when those cooldowns are on cool down. Even the 20% buff to CH can not compensate for the OP instant, burst heals out there.


Yup true.

Just regarding the cooldowns, the sad thing is even though we appear to be based around them because of how many were added, its not like we have absurd amounts relative to what other classes / healers possess.

Ascendance, Tier 4 (nature's swfitness / EM), Tier 5, SLT is really what we have (four cooldowns, one of which is almost barely used this tier). Even counting nature's swfitness is pretty iffy and if we are, then you can call 2/3 talents in paladin tier 6 paladin a "cooldown".

And then consider unique raid utility which don't necessarily relate to healing but are just as vital - we don't possess things like clemency double HoP which can trivialize certain fights, we don't have a burst mode dps talent we can take if you need high dps in a short period (to be fair, HoW is not as useful this tier), etc etc.

I guess our unique raid utility is ankh? Which isn't awful since it was changed a patch or two ago so that if you die, you retain the mana you had when you died and so you no longer come back with 20% mana. Its not awful by any means, but you definitely cannot rely, and honestly should not be able to rely on having a second life without wasting a brez every attempt.

Not sure how I feel though about going back to chain heal. I didn't like it how much it was used in ICC really at all. But.. yeah not sure. Its incredibly weak right now and still pretty limited and too clunky to use if you glyph it.

Seriously if you made the glyph instant cast with a 2 second cooldown..... a lot more people would be open to try it on a lot of fights.

EDIT - to be fair I did miss one big utility that we do bring. Our 10% Ancestral Vigor Buff. That alone probably in 25 man will guarantee a spot for a resto shaman who do bleeding edge raid content.

Not sure how much I have noticed it this tier in 10 man outside of the few fights where I can put healing rain down for an extended period where people won't move out of it (QoN phase 2, Horridon when doors are done, I would not include Megaera as it does fall off a few people in between Megaera's Rage, but these are really all the fights). That and I rarely have it fully stacked up to 10% (thats like four healing rains they need to be in to stack it up that high) on everyone on our raid... but yeah.
Edited by Gardiff on 6/29/2013 10:12 AM PDT
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90 Troll Shaman
9710
In regards to Gardiff, you did forget to mention Mana Tide, which is a bit of unique raid utility resto brings. Having mentioned that, though, just brings up another sore point. How on earth the devs ever thought basing it off the shaman's spirit was a good idea is beyond me. It needs to be based off the receiving player's spirit instead, so that shamans aren't forced to sacrifice throughput for spirit. The fact that other healer's basically receive 17% of the shaman's spirit via MTT will always create an incentive for them to push us to stack spirit, which I really resent.

On another note, I bit the bullet and made the switch to my pallie this week in my raid. On some fights, he was pushing up to 25% more healing done while being 5 ilvls lower. What a farce. This guy is now relegated to the B-team.
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100 Goblin Shaman
18890
That is true, MTT is there as well. I feel that is another thing though that is so much more important in a 25 man. Again I am pretty biased since I don't do them. Its just not as important in a 10 man where you 2 heal or 3 heal and where mana has become pretty irrelevant for most classes if you have decent spirit + the meta.

Yes in a 25 man, MTT and Vigor make it so that you will want one at the very least.

MTT used to behave the way you describe it actually. It was changed in patch 4.0.6 because of how spirit trinkets used to interact with it. of course they could have just fixed the trinket issue and kept it the same way, but they elected to not do it this way.

I guess I am just glad they at least fixed the issue with how holy priests / holy paladins got an extra benefit over shaman from MTT because of judgments of the pure / holy priest having a baseline higher regen gained from spirit. That was particularly egregious but at least its not like that anymore.
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90 Troll Shaman
18260
In regards to Gardiff, you did forget to mention Mana Tide, which is a bit of unique raid utility resto brings. Having mentioned that, though, just brings up another sore point. How on earth the devs ever thought basing it off the shaman's spirit was a good idea is beyond me. It needs to be based off the receiving player's spirit instead, so that shamans aren't forced to sacrifice throughput for spirit. The fact that other healer's basically receive 17% of the shaman's spirit via MTT will always create an incentive for them to push us to stack spirit, which I really resent.

On another note, I bit the bullet and made the switch to my pallie this week in my raid. On some fights, he was pushing up to 25% more healing done while being 5 ilvls lower. What a farce. This guy is now relegated to the B-team.


Yeah I had the same experience on my resto druid, made me so sad that I can do more effective healing on my 508 ilvl resto druid with crappy LFR than I can on my almost full BIS shaman :/
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90 Troll Shaman
18260
In regards to Gardiff, you did forget to mention Mana Tide, which is a bit of unique raid utility resto brings. Having mentioned that, though, just brings up another sore point. How on earth the devs ever thought basing it off the shaman's spirit was a good idea is beyond me. It needs to be based off the receiving player's spirit instead, so that shamans aren't forced to sacrifice throughput for spirit. The fact that other healer's basically receive 17% of the shaman's spirit via MTT will always create an incentive for them to push us to stack spirit, which I really resent.

On another note, I bit the bullet and made the switch to my pallie this week in my raid. On some fights, he was pushing up to 25% more healing done while being 5 ilvls lower. What a farce. This guy is now relegated to the B-team.


Yeah I had the same experience on my resto druid, made me so sad that I can do more effective healing on my 508 ilvl resto druid with crappy LFR than I can on my almost full BIS shaman :/
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