Going OOM on MoP Dungeon

90 Gnome Priest
8220
I'm frustrated.

Went through Mogushan Vaults last night with this priest that im slowly leveling and went OOM on fighting Gekkan and his posse towards the end of the fight, Gekkon was around 15% when I announced I was OOM.

Then a rogue -- A Rogue -- of all people, said, "I find your heals lacking" and my response was "Thanks healer police!" with a salute.

I was going to shrug that off, but then he started dissecting my job and telling me I was over-healing. Which, I thought, well yeah, I use DPS to heal and I use heals, too so there's bound to be over-healing if I'm doing both DPS (which heals passively) and using traditional heals on top of that, when I see someone's health start to dip below what my DPS can heal..... make sense? And what harm was there? No one died, and everyone was alive. Why was it such a trial to wait literally 5 seconds for me to down some mana juice after the fight we all survived?

Anyway, TL;DR -- A rogue tells me I shouldn't be going OOM in a dungeon at lvl 88. Was that annoying little rogue right? I thought it was 'normal' to go OOM when you're wearing mediocre gear. Once I hit 90 with my resto Druid, I stopped going OOM because I was getting better gear. I was assuming this with the priest, am I wrong?
Edited by Gnomï on 6/15/2013 7:03 AM PDT
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Rogue was a butt.

That said: Lose the PW:S glyph, it is not good and spec into PW:Solace or Mindbender rather than FDCL and this will help immensely with any mana issues you are having.

In dungeons, with a shield on the tank, you should be able to keep the group up fine with Penance/Solace (or Holy Fire if you take Mindbender) and Smite, with the occasional PoH for groupwide damage.
Edited by Morenn on 6/15/2013 7:09 AM PDT
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90 Troll Druid
11540
This is my 3rd rdruid and the difference between your toon and mine is that I still opt for spirit even if that means reforging at this level. You have such little spirit and much that can be reforged to it.

Do you bring pots? Perhaps flask? If you're going Oom it's either because the party is taking way too much extra damage or you're not doing your part by having enough spirit to make it through the run.

It might sound extreme to reforge or flask and pot but I'm telling you that some 5 mans at that level still require a lot and it's our job to make sure we are prepared.

You have 930 spirit compared to my 4192. That's your problem right there...
Edited by Treenuts on 6/15/2013 7:34 AM PDT
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90 Pandaren Priest
4455
Rogue was a butt.


You need more spirit.

It will get worse at 89

and be crappy at 90 till you get some gear. (save your justice to convert to honor for the PvP set, it will be your biggest spirit boost)

Gekkon is one of the spots where I would go OOM.

If they CC both adds, nothing to it. If they expect you to just heal through it as the mobs heal themselves, not going to happen.

Same thing with the sha on the stairs at Shado-Pan. The one heals, the other puts out a debuff and the third will wreck the tank. If the tank understands how to point the cone damage and int the debuff, you just need to throw out a couple heals and a dispel or two. If they don't you are OOM half way through that pull. Nothing you can do about it.
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90 Troll Druid
11540
http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/5721/712i.jpg

And that's helping to dps on top of no CC
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90 Gnome Priest
8220
Rogue was a butt.

That said: Lose the PW:S glyph, it is not good and spec into PW:Solace or Mindbender rather than FDCL and this will help immensely with any mana issues you are having.

In dungeons, with a shield on the tank, you should be able to keep the group up fine with Penance/Solace (or Holy Fire if you take Mindbender) and Smite, with the occasional PoH for groupwide damage.


So I changed that talent changed pretty much all my glyphs and it did make a difference when I ran the same dungeon two more times for comparison reasons. I also dropped off on doing so much DPS, as I was used to doing a lot in lower level dungeons. My over-healing dropped to about half of what it was, it was around 50% and now it's been between 20-25%

Thanks for the useful input. :)
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90 Gnome Priest
8220
the difference between your toon and mine is that I still opt for spirit even if that means reforging at this level. You have such little spirit and much that can be reforged to it.

Do you bring pots? Perhaps flask? If you're going Oom it's either because the party is taking way too much extra damage or you're not doing your part by having enough spirit to make it through the run.


I never thought of re-forging at this level, and tho it's not necessarily monetarily practical, I did do it on a couple of items. I don't think I'll do it again until I'm level 90 and it's more worth it with heroics.

With that said, I did get a Flask of Falling Leaves and ran my 2nd dungeon with that and it made a considerable difference. Instead of reforging gear, I'd rather make my own flasks to increase my spirit until I'm able to earn the gear I need at 90.

As for druid VS. Priests, they're two different types of healing IMO and (I have a resto druid with IL 498) the druid has been the easiest to heal with by far, in my healing experience between the two. I have a holy priest, this disc priest and a resto druid. Although I love all three and my druid is my main toon, I think she's far easier to play/heal with.
Edited by Gnomï on 6/15/2013 10:34 AM PDT
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90 Gnome Priest
8220


Gekkon is one of the spots where I would go OOM.

If they CC both adds, nothing to it. If they expect you to just heal through it as the mobs heal themselves, not going to happen.



This was the problem, they CC'd nothing, attacked it all, more than the tank had aggro and I was expected to not go OOM. <shakes head> Needless to say, it still provided me a way to improve my talents and glyphs, but it definitely wasn't "just my fault."
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100 Night Elf Priest
10520
A lot of people have gotten spoiled with overgealed healers. Priesting is actually pretty rough until you get some spirit -- they're some of the most gear-dependent healers. But once you get the gear, they're freaking superheroes. Don't take your mana issues personally. Of course you can always learn to play better, and evaluate your talents and glyphs to see which supports your mana better, but you're inevitably going to have mana issues as you progress towards 90.

If you have the spare gold, you can pick up the Relic of Chi-Ji once you hit 90. It's equivalent to some of the best raid trinkets. Six months after I got it it is still propping up my mana bar.
Edited by Dreamling on 6/15/2013 10:49 AM PDT
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90 Pandaren Priest
14930


Gekkon is one of the spots where I would go OOM.

If they CC both adds, nothing to it. If they expect you to just heal through it as the mobs heal themselves, not going to happen.



This was the problem, they CC'd nothing, attacked it all, more than the tank had aggro and I was expected to not go OOM. <shakes head> Needless to say, it still provided me a way to improve my talents and glyphs, but it definitely wasn't "just my fault."


Do this for me.

Go to Binan Village and talk to the Blacksmith there. He has a variety of gear, one of which is a pure Spirit Trinket. Buy at least one of these.

Go to your auctionhouse and invest in a Ghost Iron Dragonling. Then buy a Sparkling Tinker's Gear and a Fractured Tinker's Gear. Finally, buy either a Quick Tinker's Gear or a Smooth Tinker's Gear (depending on your stat preference). Slot the gears into your Ghost Iron Dragonling and use it in place of the exploding barrel or the alchemist's trinket. If you have an engineer friend, it will be much cheaper (the items themselves are dirt cheap to make).

I would also recommend that you scour the various gear vendors to find some spirit gear. It will cost you some gold, but it's worth it. You have far, far too little Spirit.
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90 Pandaren Priest
4455
http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/5721/712i.jpg
And that's helping to dps on top of no CC


I am not sure what I am looking at in this picture. But it looks like the adds are dead, you are good on mana, and the boss is about to die.

I am really not trying to argue against your point, perhaps the tone of that rogue.

Priests do have an issue with spirit. Your 4k vs the 900 on the OP is significant, especially due to the Priest Vs. Druid issue
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Thanks for the useful input. :)


You are very welcome :)
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100 Tauren Warrior
12410
Correct me if I'm wrong, but a tank with 500k health shouldn't be taking 250k damage in one hit from a MoP heroic boss, should they?
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100 Night Elf Priest
10520
http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/5721/712i.jpg
And that's helping to dps on top of no CC


I am not sure what I am looking at in this picture. But it looks like the adds are dead, you are good on mana, and the boss is about to die.


I'm seeing him at 60% mana at the end of the fight. He has 9k spirit in total, 3400 from gems, carrying mana pots and spirit flasks. He has 50 item levels on the priest. Since our advice is "get more spirit and gear", I think he agrees with us.

I also don't see an icon for Innervate anywhere on the screen, which is odd, since he's tracking Harmony .... but not Innervate. Also there's no way he raids with those Vuhdo frames.
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90 Troll Druid
11540


I am not sure what I am looking at in this picture. But it looks like the adds are dead, you are good on mana, and the boss is about to die.


I'm seeing him at 60% mana at the end of the fight. He has 9k spirit in total, 3400 from gems, carrying mana pots and spirit flasks. He has 50 item levels on the priest. Since our advice is "get more spirit and gear", I think he agrees with us.

I also don't see an icon for Innervate anywhere on the screen, which is odd, since he's tracking Harmony .... but not Innervate. Also there's no way he raids with those Vuhdo frames.


I was same level (88) at the time of that post and have of course changed because I leveled up since that post. My gear was similar at the time though and I was simply trying to explain why spirit was important in early dungeons.

I also don't see an icon for Innervate anywhere on the screen, which is odd, since he's tracking Harmony .... but not Innervate. Also there's no way he raids with those Vuhdo frames.

Yes I do look again it's on CD the innervate macro "45" timer in blue.

As for raiding with those frames of course I do - look here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0auk3JrcD2c

That's my main Trollmendous and all my rdruids use similar raid frames.
Edited by Treenuts on 6/16/2013 12:39 AM PDT
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90 Pandaren Priest
14930
Correct me if I'm wrong, but a tank with 500k health shouldn't be taking 250k damage in one hit from a MoP heroic boss, should they?


Well, no, unless they did something terribly wrong.
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100 Dwarf Priest
9095


Gekkon is one of the spots where I would go OOM.

If they CC both adds, nothing to it. If they expect you to just heal through it as the mobs heal themselves, not going to happen.



This was the problem, they CC'd nothing, attacked it all, more than the tank had aggro and I was expected to not go OOM. <shakes head> Needless to say, it still provided me a way to improve my talents and glyphs, but it definitely wasn't "just my fault."


While I was leveling my Monk, I would very rarely go oom, but one fight that would drain my mana was Gekkan, if no one cced anything. Your gear/talents/glyphs did need improvement too, so it's good that you made the thread and got advice, but yeah, it really wasn't your fault.
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100 Human Priest
7120
Gekkan is tough on mana if no one CC's, especially the hezzer, as you end up constantly cleansing yourself so your casts aren't abysmal.

On another note, I actually felt weaker at 89 than at 88 or 87 with the mana cost scaling.
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90 Draenei Shaman
10225
Gekkan is tough on mana if no one CC's, especially the hezzer, as you end up constantly cleansing yourself so your casts aren't abysmal.

On another note, I actually felt weaker at 89 than at 88 or 87 with the mana cost scaling.


I definitely felt the struggle on my Priest and ended up just doing Dreadwastes on her pretty much from 89-90. She then had a high enough ilevel for heroics. I crossed myself, solo queued and got some really good groups for her first heroics.

The second boss in in there is a real pain, especially if you have a caster mob on you on top of the curses. At least on my Shammy I can CC him for a bit. I remember getting that on heroic while my Priest was still mostly in greens/blues. I came in right before that boss fight. Tank just leaps over the edge without the gear to back anything up. The high DPS saved us.

That being said, surprisingly I had fewer issues with my Shammy. She chugged a bit at 87 but I found myself healing all the way to 90 and beyond with her between questing. (I made a macro that politely asked the group to wait if I came in as DPS so I could switch). I don't know if it's just a Priest thing, or that I got better groups (though I doubt that one) or I just had better luck in general through experience.

While it may seem weird to reforge before 90, I can tell you that both my healers where at 3k or higher spirit at 89 which helps immensely. :)

Correct me if I'm wrong, but a tank with 500k health shouldn't be taking 250k damage in one hit from a MoP heroic boss, should they?


I see you've been getting some of my tanks. Yeah I've seen ones like that. They're also the ones that pull big causing me spam HS just to keep them in the red and not dead. So yes, something is terribly terribly wrong. My only solace is that those types of tanks tend to be bad at agro, and with the DPS being easier to heal it makes my life less stressful.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
11870
Anyway, TL;DR -- A rogue tells me I shouldn't be going OOM in a dungeon at lvl 88. Was that annoying little rogue right? I thought it was 'normal' to go OOM when you're wearing mediocre gear. Once I hit 90 with my resto Druid, I stopped going OOM because I was getting better gear. I was assuming this with the priest, am I wrong?


The thing to remember with randoms, is that the "demand" of healing is going to be different. You are going to have groups where you just aren't going to have to do any healing. And then you are going to have groups where you will be constantly amazed at their ability to conjure damage from thin air. And if I recall correctly, Gekkan was very talented at making all my healers go OOM while leveling in crap gear with even crappier groupmates.
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