WoL Resto Druid help

90 Draenei Priest
12030
This past week we brought in a new druid for our 10m ToT raid. We recently lost our monk healer unfortunately, not long after losing our original resto druid.

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/q0l59p6pnse5lkvr/ and

http://worldoflogs.com/reports/39muao57axkej29p/

We didn't get the logs for the first few fights, but I'd like to know how the druid was doing. I do have a resto druid at 90 but I've never raided and I really only pvp and 5man when the mood strikes. I sort of felt like they had no idea what they were doing but again, I don't raid as anything but a priest.

I did go holy for the first time on Tortos so I may not have been doing the best there either.
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90 Night Elf Druid
14585
His Harmony and Lifebloom uptime are way too low. His rejuv % shouldn't be that high. Mushrooms on fights like Megaera should be 2nd or 3rd on his healing.
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I only know the basics of Druid, but a couple of things that jump out at me.

Not really going to talk about actual healing numbers as you guys appear to 3 heal which is gonna negatively impact his numbers straight off the bat (as well as being with a paladin and sometimes disc priest).

That said...

The biggest issue, imho, is his uptime for Lifebloom and Harmony are REALLY low. Council: 81.8% Lifebloom/72.9% Harmony Tortos : 58.4% Lifebloom/32.9% Harmony. Megaera: 36.9% Lifebloom/82% Harmony. I didn't look at the other set of logs as I assume they are more of the same.

Lifebloom/Harmony uptimes are pretty much THE thing I look at for Druids to see if they have a good understanding of their class. There are other, of course, important things but these are very very basic things that every Druid should know before raiding... and it does not appear he does.
Edited by Morenn on 6/15/2013 2:07 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Priest
15415
Tell him to use mushrooms on fights like Megaera, where the raid will be stacking.

Also, lifebloom and harmony uptime are really, really low. They should be up to around 100%.
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90 Troll Druid
10395
Harmony and Lifebloom uptime have already been mentioned but it can't be stressed enough how important it is to keep them up. There are some other issues I'm seeing as well such as gemming and glyphs. Haste is at 4878 which is a big waste. I would highly recommend dropping down as close to 3043 haste as possible without going under, and putting the extra stats into mastery. All that extra haste in between break points is very mana costly for a minimal increase to healing while mastery is more efficient and will boost their healing significantly, if they keep harmony up.

As for glyphs I would recommend dropping the healing touch and innervate glyphs for Glyph of Regrowth and Glyph of Wild Growth. Healing touch should only be used with Natures Swiftness and the boost to Regrowth + the guaranteed living seed proc will be much more beneficial. The wild growth glyph will increase healing a bit and the innervate glyph is pretty much useless, if they have enough mana to be casting innervate on others then they would benefit more by dropping spirit for mastery and then using innervate for themselves.

Also they are specced into Incarnation but didn't even use it on some fights. Hopefully this helps :)

Edited to add that they should use Wild Mushrooms more. They are sooo good for Quake Stomps and Rampages, and they should do their best to have them for every Quake Stomp and Rampage.
Edited by Trolljin on 6/15/2013 3:07 PM PDT
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90 Tauren Druid
18810
In addition to what everyone else has said, gemming pure spirit and then reforging out of it as much as possible is strange, at best.
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90 Troll Druid
HC
12650
Just a fair warning I was going to just give you a brief rundown, but the more I saw of your druid, the more issues I found. And I went a lil crazy... Just have him add me to btag or something. bex#1372

Gearing Choices:
1. Tell him to never gem straight int. Int/mastery gems in yellow and red sockets if he's going for throughput after reaching his 3043 haste BP. I do not understand the logic in gemming for spirit, just to reforge out of it. He also has an +80 stat to chest instead of spirit, while all of his other gear favors spirit. He doesn't seem to know what he wants and is all over the place.

2. His haste level makes no sense, tell him to look at this:
http://theincbear.com/math/resto-haste-breakpoints
You guys have 5% haste in your raid, so the # he's sitting at is illogical, especially considering he's reforging out of spirit for it. Idgi.
-The mentality is you reach you first haste BP (3043), you reach a level of comfort with your spirit, then you go for mastery.

3. Never should glyph for innervate. That's really, really bad on his/her part. And wtf, glyph of HT? You should just have this guy add me to realid 'cause this is horrendous. At least he got his LB glyph right.
- He should be glyph of LB, Regrowth, and WG for 10m raiding.

4. His talents are again, horrendous. It is redundant to get Feline Swiftness and then get the enchant that increases movement speed.
- Displacer Beast has been amazing this tier. I have consistently swapped between all 3 talents this tier, but for normalmodes, Displacer wins imo. It's still a personal preference, but as I said earlier, what he's doing is pretty much redundant.
- Faerie Swarm? You guys have a warrior, why he/she thinks this is even needed is beyond me. Tell him to get Typhoon or something so he/she can at least have a chance at using it for something. Even Mass Entanglement has its moments (Council).

Playstyle:
1. Council: His Harmony uptime should be much better, there are very little instances where I don't have near 100%.
- What I don't understand is his/her #3 spell is Regrowth, but has this low of an uptime on Harmony? I feel like your druid is just standing there sometimes waiting for something to do.
- His tank healing isn't really that high on either of the tanks, so I don't understand why your druid is spamming Regrowth unless people are standing in bad.

2. Tortos: Rejuv healing is normal, that's typically how high it is since it's our bread and butter. I'm glad he/she is trying to make use of shrooms on this, that's good. But the kicker is his Harmony uptime was a whopping 32.9%. Terrible. They are just gimping themselves. It should always be an upwards of ~90%.
- There's a lot more here to say but I think it'd be easier to just talk to him/her about it.

3. Megaera: Mushroom healing should be a lot higher on this. Lottttsssss higher. Harmony uptime is decent, could be better.

TL;DR: He forgets to use Incarnation, gimps his Innervate on every fight by using it when he's not @ 80% mana or lower (is using it too soon and not actually gaining everything he could, which means he doesn't understand what the spell does), needs better harmony and lifebloom uptimes, could do better about using his Barkskin and Ironbark, should try to make more use of his shrooms, needs to learn what his BPs are, and should probably look into what his talent choices do.
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90 Draenei Priest
12030
Thanks so much! I had asked him about his Lifeboom usage between fights, since I often didn't see it being used at all but got a vague "I switch it around a lot" and asked about Harmony but had gotten no reply. I try to be reasonably familiar with healers I play but this felt so all over the place it was overwhelming.

Times I would have instinctively hit tranq had it been me, wasn't happening either, like he forgot the spell even existed. I'm mostly always disc but I still have phantom divine hymn fingers all the time.

@Fleurs Yep you'd be right about the standing around, there were many times his mana bar was at 100% for extended periods of time and not seeing ANY heals going off. I know enough about druids that something should be going off now and again for LB/harmony alone.

I suggested to my group that we two heal things, and since this druid has next to no recent raiding experience we may just get a dps. Even so, if possible I want healers to improve regardless, if they consider healing their main spec.
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90 Troll Druid
10395
1. Tell him to never gem straight int. Int/mastery gems in yellow and red sockets if he's going for throughput after reaching his 3043 haste BP


I'm curious why you think he shouldn't gem straight int. Is mastery better than int at a 2:1 ratio and if so shouldn't they go straight mastery in yellow sockets?
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90 Troll Druid
11860
I want to make babies with Fleurs - just saying.

06/15/2013 04:23 PMPosted by Ocyla
I had asked him about his Lifeboom usage between fights, since I often didn't see it being used at all but got a vague "I switch it around a lot"


What that really means is "I'm not very good at tracking it so it falls off a lot which is most likely a win win for that big !@#$ blooming effect!".

It's likely his UI and not being able to see it very good. Have him post a screenshot of his UI showing -

HARMONY tracking
LIFEBLOOM stacks


That will tell us.
Edited by Trollmendous on 6/15/2013 4:33 PM PDT
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90 Troll Druid
11860
06/15/2013 04:29 PMPosted by Trolljin
1. Tell him to never gem straight int. Int/mastery gems in yellow and red sockets if he's going for throughput after reaching his 3043 haste BP


I'm curious why you think he shouldn't gem straight int. Is mastery better than int at a 2:1 ratio and if so shouldn't they go straight mastery in yellow sockets?


A lot of people do go straight 320 mastery in yellow - well at least some end game druids I check up on.

I believe the differences are very small honestly.
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90 Tauren Druid
8710
Lifebloom's important, but highly overrated when it comes to trying to help someone learn/improve.
Most important thing is gearing properly then Mastery uptime, then knowledge of toolkit/spell usage (when to use what etc) Then worry about lifebloom uptime.

I havn't even looked at those logs but ex;
Many things can be misleading, for example, I run hotw, and we 3heal just about every fight because RL refuses to let me 2heal.

Therefore, many fights I pre-pot, hotw, sotf moonfire and wrath spam.
My lifebloom uptime for the first 45seconds of certain fights will be near 0% because, it's not needed; The utility dps one can provide in the early moments of a fight far outweighs the value of a 2nd or even 3rd healer in many situations
Off the top of my head, Council, Tortos, Jin Rokh, Durumu, Consorts.

The result will show on logs a significantly lower lifebloom up time, even though it was utterly useless to maintain it during that part of the fight. Why I call it an overrated method of evaluating resto druids is because most people will just blanket statement by looking at it's uptime without actually seeing WHY it's 10-15% lower than "ideal"
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The result will show on logs a significantly lower lifebloom up time, even though it was utterly useless to maintain it during that part of the fight. Why I call it an overrated method of evaluating resto druids is because most people will just blanket statement by looking at it's uptime without actually seeing WHY it's 10-15% lower than "ideal"


I would have not commented if this were the case. However, the *only* damage he has recorded is from Nature's Vigil, so no, he wasn't just helping in a way that would be more useful.. he was just doing nothing at all.
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90 Tauren Druid
8710


I'm curious why you think he shouldn't gem straight int. Is mastery better than int at a 2:1 ratio and if so shouldn't they go straight mastery in yellow sockets?


A lot of people do go straight 320 mastery in yellow - well at least some end game druids I check up on.

I believe the differences are very small honestly.


I straight mastery if it pushes me past a % threshold for yellow. And straight Int if the int/mastery will not push me past a threshold in red sockets.
Ie, If I'm at 19.08 mastery and int/mastery will bring me to 19.68 for example, I'll go straight mastery to gain 20%
Edited by Tonydanza on 6/15/2013 4:42 PM PDT
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90 Tauren Druid
8710
06/15/2013 04:39 PMPosted by Morenn
The result will show on logs a significantly lower lifebloom up time, even though it was utterly useless to maintain it during that part of the fight. Why I call it an overrated method of evaluating resto druids is because most people will just blanket statement by looking at it's uptime without actually seeing WHY it's 10-15% lower than "ideal"


I would have not commented if this were the case. However, the *only* damage he has recorded is from Nature's Vigil, so no, he wasn't just helping in a way that would be more useful.. he was just doing nothing at all.


If he's doing nothing at all, he's bored. Start 2healing.

If he were the worst resto druid in the world he would still be doing something, probably casting nourish. But at least something every couple of seconds..

Boredom/no activity = drop a healer.
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90 Troll Druid
11860
06/15/2013 04:36 PMPosted by Tonydanza
Many things can be misleading, for example, I run hotw, and we 3heal just about every fight because RL refuses to let me 2heal.


At your gear level you could one heal normal Tortos, Council, Durumu and Twins with ease as I have.
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1 Gnome Warlock
0
I don't understand this unholy Mastery crusade. Maybe if you dissect the heal formulas very close you can prove it one way or the other slightly, but it can't be far off either way. I gem pure intellect and my logs are quite strong. It also helps out my offspec more on the few remaining pieces I share.
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90 Troll Druid
HC
12650
06/15/2013 04:29 PMPosted by Trolljin
1. Tell him to never gem straight int. Int/mastery gems in yellow and red sockets if he's going for throughput after reaching his 3043 haste BP


I'm curious why you think he shouldn't gem straight int. Is mastery better than int at a 2:1 ratio and if so shouldn't they go straight mastery in yellow sockets?

Like I said some threads ago, the difference in the int/mastery gem vs just mastery is almost negligible to the point that it's not really worth the time/effort in doing it, especially if you share gear with boomkin or ever have to go a hotw spec.

We are not at the scaling point yet where mastery is superior, not sure if we will be for quite some time.

I don't understand this unholy Mastery crusade. Maybe if you dissect the heal formulas very close you can prove it one way or the other slightly, but it can't be far off either way. I gem pure intellect and my logs are quite strong. It also helps out my offspec more on the few remaining pieces I share.

The math was done on this topic near the release of this xpac, and it was proven then that mastery > int.

Edit: I realize the two statements above sound contradicting ^

I mean to say, mastery IS superior, but in a very, very small way that it's not even worth it if you happen to share gear with boomkin/have to hotw spec every once in a while. If you are pure 100% resto, mastery is better for you. But, int/mastery gems are superior to pure intellect gems.
Edited by Fleurs on 6/15/2013 6:06 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Druid
13360
Guys let's keep this on track, it's not a threat for int vs mastery. And it's long been known it's mastery > int.

Read through what everyone else has said and I just have a few additional points;

Meg: He's not spiking how he should be, make sure he has mushrooms, SM at the start and WG on cd during rampage.

I THINK he's using treants? I couldn't find anything about incarn or soul in the buffs gained. Suggest if he's having mana issues or his 3 healers decide they want an extra CD to get incarn if not go soul.

Tort: Make sure he knows the patterns here. a druid should do well enough with this fight. Heroic is easier for rdruid but still. Rejuv blanket pre stomp and contiune it on and WG on cd afte a stomp till everyones' stable

Ji kun: I'll assume nests? No idea otherwise.

Durumu: Just tell him to blow every cd, (tranq/tree/nv) during beams and then just overheal to the max during this. :) Will make him feel better!
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90 Draenei Priest
12030
Yes, he was on bests for Ji Kun, and our shaman was screaming at him a lot saying they had to do all the healing instead. I've never had to do nests so I'm not sure what was going on there.
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