amz NERF?!?! DK changes in 5.4

90 Night Elf Death Knight
9800
A new ptr build has been released, and I thought I would take the oppurtunity to discuss some of the changes to DK's coming in 5.4. All of these are taken from Wowhead and MMO Champion.

General changes:

Icebound Fortitude no longer costs a Frost Rune.


Now, that wording is a little strange since IBF currently costs rp, not runes, but I assume that means IBF will now be free to dps dks. Thank GOD. It made absolutely no sense that our only method of physical damage reduction came at a resource cost, especially since its only 20% on a 3 min cd. I still believe the damage reduction it provides needs a buff, but this is a step in the right direction.

Anti-Magic Zone no longer has spec specific tooltips. Now reduces spell damage done to party or raid members inside it by 40%, down from 75%. Now lasts 3 sec, down from 10 sec / until damage absorbed.


...wat? WAAAT!?!

Don't get me wrong, I'm happy that the absorption limit is gone, but that alone is not worth a 70% duration reduction AND cutting the magic mitigation nearly in half. Plus which, AMZ's real issue hasn't been fixed, that being it is next to worthless against heavy ticking damage. At least now it's useful against large bursts of damage like on lei shen, but if this change goes live, that won't even be true. If this change to AMZ makes it to live, I can guarantee most dks will avoid it like the Light.

Death Siphon damage and AP scaling increased by 10%.


So an ability already OP at lower levels will now be even more OP? Great...

As for max level, its hard to say whether this will be worth taking. I'm inclined to say no since it still costs a Death rune, but we'll have to see.

Dark Command now also increases threat that you generate against the target by 200% for 3 sec


This is part of a change to all taunts (even ones my lock/hunter pets) which doubles threat generated shortly after the taunt, effectively making tank switching a whole lot easier. Definitely a change I think a lot of tanks can get behind.

Sanguine Fortitude no longer makes Icebound Fortitude free.


Further evidence I believe that IBF is going free next patch.

Riposte (New) When you dodge or parry any attack, you gain 50% of your Parry and Dodge as additional Critical Strike for 20 sec. Death Knight - Blood Spec.


Now this is an interesting change. What this effectively does is take the average of you dodge and parry and converts it to crit. Its also worth noting that Prot warriors are getting this too, which makes sense, as Blood dks and Prot warriors seem to be the two specs having the toughest time holding threat against other tanks. So not only is this a dps boost to dk's and warriors, it makes dodge and parry actually worthwhile. That said, while this is amazing for warriors, I'm not too sure how beneficial this is to Blood dk's since the don't get much of a benefit from crit. I personally would rather have the dk version grant haste, but we'll have to see.

So, what do you all think about the changes coming in 5.4? Discuss.
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90 Troll Death Knight
14815
(I'll repeat what I said in the DK thread on the PTR Discussion forums.)

IBF: YUS. This isn't just good for PvP DKs, PvE DKs can benefit from it as well with mechanics like Tortos' Quake Stomp and Durumu's Life Drain.

AMZ: On MMO-Champ, they linked Rygarius' twitter, where it is said that we should expect more AMZ changes. As for what we have at the time of this post, I don't think it's either a nerf or a buff. We lost the ability to stack the whole raid under AMZ to cheese huge bursts of magic damage, but now it's far more valuable for things like Jin'rokh's Lightning Storm and Mageara's Rampage. It has the potential for a lot more group utility but the solo utility was gutted.

Death Siphon: I only use it for Brawler's Guild, so small buff for that I guess. Not as important as other changes.

Dark Command: This changed for all tanks, even hunter and lock pets, so I'm guessing it's just a QoL buff for tanks. A moot change since every relevant spec got it.

Sanguine Fortitude: No point in making IBF free if it's already free. An update to a tooltip.

Riposte: Underwhelming to the extreme. Note that only Blood DKs and Prot Warriors got this, which I guess means that Blizzard is trying to prop up damage for those specs or make Dodge/Parry more attractive. Except this benefits Prot Warriors because of Enrage (resource generation and damage) but does nothing mechanically for Blood DKs. We all know that Dodge/Parry go completely counter to Blood DK mastery, so I'm thinking this won't change anything about how Blood tanks operate. Enjoy a little extra crit, I guess?
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90 Human Death Knight
13115
I hope AMZ isn't gonna stay like it says in the current notes, pretty much makes it a waste of a talent for PvP DK's.
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90 Troll Death Knight
9575

AMZ:We lost the ability to stack the whole raid under AMZ to cheese huge bursts of magic damage


Huh? How can you not do this anymore?

It's not really a nerf. What world are you guys living in that AMZ lasted 3 seconds anyway? Either you used it on a large meteor or some spell, and it faded immediately after, or your raid leader decided it was good to use on periodic damage, and it faded immediately after.

It will still do what it was used for before: soak large single hits.
It will ALSO now work during situations that it sucked at before: constant ticking aoe damage

The only way it's an actual, legit, nerf is if the reduction stays at 40%, and the damage hit you take is less than about 500k or so. That would result is less damage soaked overall. 50-55% seems a better target, but I suppose they'll be tweaking it.
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
8550
I'm a fan of the changes, considering it can be used as raid utility now.
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90 Troll Death Knight
14815
Huh? How can you not do this anymore?


Soaking 40% of a single huge burst vs. soaking 75% of a single huge burst.
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
12105


Riposte: Underwhelming to the extreme. Note that only Blood DKs and Prot Warriors got this, which I guess means that Blizzard is trying to prop up damage for those specs or make Dodge/Parry more attractive. Except this benefits Prot Warriors because of Enrage (resource generation and damage) but does nothing mechanically for Blood DKs. We all know that Dodge/Parry go completely counter to Blood DK mastery, so I'm thinking this won't change anything about how Blood tanks operate. Enjoy a little extra crit, I guess?
false. dodge and parry have no negative effects on mastery unless you aren't timing death strike for max heals
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90 Worgen Death Knight
10910
I'm a fan of the changes, considering it can be used as raid utility now.


06/20/2013 12:05 PMPosted by Sigtyr
Huh? How can you not do this anymore?


Soaking 40% of a single huge burst vs. soaking 75% of a single huge burst.

If anything, the nerf reduces DK raid utility.
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90 Human Death Knight
SnP
15595
That said, while this is amazing for warriors, I'm not too sure how beneficial this is to Blood dk's since the don't get much of a benefit from crit.

Roughly 5% crit for 20 seconds.
Crit rating is more beneficial the less crit rating one has.
Now, if it was a haste buff! ooooo.
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
9660
06/20/2013 10:25 AMPosted by Karaahl
Death Siphon damage and AP scaling increased by 10%.


OH YES. I TOLD YOU ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
14590
Something to note about Riposte: From looking at an MMO-Champ thread, it looks like its only going to be biased off ratings not %. So Does this mean things like Str, DRW, and SwordShattering would have no effect on the crit given?

I may be understanding the concept wrong, but if that is the case...... it looks even worse for us then it did from my PoV before.
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90 Human Death Knight
6500
Wow got to love Devs who just want to continue to nerf a Class that is already hurting.

I would like to know which school where 40% is greater than 75%... in most cases for pve you will use ams for a huge burst of incoming damage to help out the heals. Now with this uhm buff.....the heals will have to heal 35% more.

Furthermore this also means AMS will no longer be useful in PVP, you go to help your team mate who is being focused, oh wait... DKs are the focus target of choice... Sweet we will take a additional 35% more damage that lasts 7 sec shorter...

Sorry I don't see the buff...

IBF they are freaken stupid they need to change IMF to a get off me button... Keep the CD, keep the cost just raise the damage reduction to 40% to all incoming damage.
Edited by Darkeruin on 6/20/2013 10:25 PM PDT
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You deserve this nerf, you are OP at this moment.
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90 Blood Elf Death Knight
12105
You deserve this nerf, you are OP at this moment.
lolno
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90 Worgen Death Knight
14820
If they plan on keeping the 3 second duration, at least lower the CD to compensate.
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90 Draenei Death Knight
14590
Well if they leave it as is, maybe if we cry enough like locks we can get it reverted.
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90 Undead Death Knight
9085
06/20/2013 01:18 PMPosted by Reynic
Death Siphon damage and AP scaling increased by 10%.


OH YES. I TOLD YOU ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL.


I use this a lot and greatly welcome the change. if you note we can rotate this a bit with death strike. DS then Death siph/ death siph then DS again you can gain quite a bit of health back in short order, even as frost.

And in those oh crap moments where you have to kite,this ability is awesome as it has an even farther range than death grip.

protip: ANY mob will heal you for the full amount, even random critters on the ground with 1 hp.
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90 Night Elf Death Knight
0
I hope AMZ isn't gonna stay like it says in the current notes, pretty much makes it a waste of a talent for PvP DK's.


Lol, was a waste to begin with being on the same tier as lichborne. DK's are already strong against casters, you didn't need a crappy talent that only absorbed one mage spell when you have AMS, especially since lichborne is a cc break and a self heal(remember we are squishier than cata arcane mages right now)
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1 Undead Warlock
0
I agree with the people saying Riposte should give Haste for Death Knights. The Anti-Magic Zone change... I used to take it on my PvP Frost spec, looks less useful as a healer saving CD now. I'll have to see.
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