My opinion of best>>worst healers atm

90 Pandaren Monk
15705
Monks can do everything on the move. Monks also have tools to get to a position faster and limit the amount of moving they have to do
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90 Tauren Druid
18635
And druids have tools to get the rest of the group to a position faster. :P

We are like warlocks, only fluffier.
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Like it matters. If the PTR changes go through, both Druids and Monks will be awesome.

I hate you both equally.
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90 Troll Druid
9775
Monks can do everything on the move. Monks also have tools to get to a position faster and limit the amount of moving they have to do


And Druids don't? When it comes to moving into position as fast as possible in order to spend less time not healing I would argue that Druids are better at that as well. Cat form (or travel form when outside) gives us a significant, passive speed boost + 15% more on top of that if you take Feline Swiftness. Or you could take Displacer beast and get a blink/sprint in the same ability. We also have Dash, which is a 70% speed increase for 15 seconds, which puts us over 200% speed when in cat form. And last but not least we also have Stampeding Roar. A 60% speed increase for 8 seconds for everyone within range.

Also

Monks can do everything on the move.


I disagree. Without stopping to channel Soothing Mist or CJL you generate significantly less chi, which equates to significantly less uplifts/enveloping mists, a problem Druids do not have.
Edited by Trolljin on 7/3/2013 11:05 AM PDT
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90 Blood Elf Priest
8340
I am surprised at the lack of Shaman changes. The rest of the healers all bring things to the table, but shaman cool downs are not enough. They need major buffs.
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90 Troll Druid
10000
I disagree. Without stopping to channel Soothing Mist or CJL you generate significantly less chi, which equates to significantly less uplifts/enveloping mists, a problem Druids do not have.


Given current damage patterns, a lot of chi is spent on TP/BoK. A higher mobility fight where somewhat less (remember, most mobility fights still allow you to be stationary a fair amount of the time) chi can be generated from Soothing Mist mostly means that the monk has to redistribute their usage of chi finishers.
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90 Pandaren Monk
8410
07/03/2013 11:28 AMPosted by Frozenorange
Given current damage patterns, a lot of chi is spent on TP/BoK.


I'm not sure what fights you're talking about, unless they're farm fights and therefore meaningless.

What he's talking about is situations like Megeara, if a monk gets a blue beam on them (it's happened to my raid many a time). If you stop, you die, simple as that, so monks are restricted to sending out ReM and maybe generate Chi through a Chi Brew or Expel Harm. That's really it.
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90 Night Elf Priest
4185
mistweavers don't get targeted by blue usually
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90 Pandaren Monk
8410
mistweavers don't get targeted by blue usually


Usually? No. But in my old raid, our mistweaver was targeted, alongside Morenn, multiple times. The situation does happen.
Edited by Fistlobster on 7/3/2013 12:24 PM PDT
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The mistweaver should camp in melee range of the heads, where they will not be targeted by blue laser.
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90 Troll Druid
10000
What he's talking about is situations like Megeara, if a monk gets a blue beam on them (it's happened to my raid many a time). If you stop, you die, simple as that, so monks are restricted to sending out ReM and maybe generate Chi through a Chi Brew or Expel Harm. That's really it.


Just because a fight is progression doesn't mean there is constant damage going out 100% of the time. There simply isn't always a good way to spend chi on healing and it's better to generate mana tea stacks and generate mana through muscle memory than to sit at cap on chi. Unless you think the mana generated from muscle memory is worthless on progression fights.

Blue beams don't last the whole fight (and outside of heroic, most guilds don't actually kill the blue head). You can also double roll out and then have time to cast/channel if necessary. Some guilds also set up warlock portals back in to range so you spend minimal time actually running.

But in my experience, melee have NEVER gotten blue beam, even on heroic. It's possible if your group doesn't have enough ranged + non-mw healers I suppose, but it shouldn't happen. I've also heard but cannot confirm (and actually highly doubt) that mistweavers only count as melee if they're actually in melee range.
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I've also heard but cannot confirm (and actually highly doubt) that mistweavers only count as melee if they're actually in melee range.

Eiko told me this so it must be true.
Edited by Evry on 7/3/2013 12:28 PM PDT
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90 Troll Druid
10000
07/03/2013 12:27 PMPosted by Evry
Eiko told me this so it must be true.

Eiko is right about everything. Why was he out of melee to find this out in the first place? owait, because he's bad.

More seriously, though, if MW 'melee' consideration required melee range, why don't they get targeted by abilities on lei shen's transitions?
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90 Blood Elf Monk
17050
Mistweavers are always melee regardless of the situation. If they weren't, our heroic lei shen strategy wouldn't work.

I'm 99% sure that anyone can be targeted by blue as long as they are out of melee range of the boss. I've seen melee get it when they were running out a fire, etc.
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90 Gnome Monk
7430
Mistweavers are always melee regardless of the situation. If they weren't, our heroic lei shen strategy wouldn't work.

I'm 99% sure that anyone can be targeted by blue as long as they are out of melee range of the boss. I've seen melee get it when they were running out a fire, etc.


Some abilities decide based on whether you are actually in melee range, others it doesn't appear to matter. For example, I've been targeted by the lightning skull on Jin'rokh when out of melee range but never if in melee range.
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90 Pandaren Priest
9920
This isn't completely accurate but it gives a pretty decent representation of where all the healing classes are:

http://www.raidbots.com/dpsbot/Spec_Score/25H/all/14/60/default/#0000000000000000000000000000111111

If you're lazy and don't want to click the link it shows:

Disc Priest
Holy Priest
MW Monk
R Druid
H Pally
R Shaman

I think it should also be noted that buffs/nerfs to one class effect how other classes perform so all the classes are dependent on where everyone else is at at that moment. And that pure HPS isn't everything. Each class has a niche on what they do well and how they support the raid in terms of utility. For instance there is a reason that you see some of the top shaman have 20k spirit because of how they interact with the other classes. Between their horrible mastery, ancestral vigor, and vast array of CDs, shaman also have the best ability to "pick the raid up." There isn't really a best and worst in terms of overall performance. I would say a more interesting thread would be best to worst raid comps as that is something that has less data behind it and more room for discussion. Do some classes need buffs. Yes. Do others need nerfs. Yes. Choose a class and play it the best you can. When a good healer doesn't outheal a bad one then there are real balance problems.
Edited by Torantine on 7/3/2013 10:13 PM PDT
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90 Troll Shaman
18930
With the most recent updates and seeing raid testing, here is how I would rank the healers now.

1A - Druid
1B - Monk
1C - Disc Priest

2 - Holy Priest

3 - Shaman

4 - Paladin

Druids, Monks and Disc Priests all look in a really strong position. Genesis and other Druid changes seem to be playing out better on the PTR than expected, and they are keeping up with the other 2 healers. They're all going to be really close.

Holy Priests have really strong output - they have had really strong output since 5.3. The only reason the spec is underrepresented is how strong Disc is and continues to be.

The Shaman buffs announced today are on paper, about a 25% buff in 25 man raids (HTT buff is 10-15% and AG adds another 10%). You just have to remember that we were in a weak spot to begin with and Shaman toolkit in spread situations (which looks like almost all of SoO - moreso than ToT) is terrible. The problem will be somewhat papered over by being able to use a burst throughput CD every 45-60 seconds (HTT, AG, SLT, Ascendance, new 4pc). These changes brought Shaman from being nearly useless next tier to probably being fully viable, but obviously not on the level of Priests/Monks/Druids.

Paladins are likely to be the weakest healer next tier, but that may change when they announce what the "compensation" will be for gutting Eternal Flame.
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90 Pandaren Priest
9920
I said this in another thread but I think that more than other tiers the set bonuses and legendary cloak (and how the cloak actually functions) will make a huge difference in how effective each class is. If it ticks off hots that will make a big difference versus not. If it works on atonement or not, that's a big difference. I think that Tiberria's list is probably pretty accurate for 5.4 as of the current incarnation of the PTR. However fight mechanics will determine a lot as well. Stack versus spread. Another Horridon/Elegon. What fight determines a good amount about which class is "best" and "worst."

I would like to just get a bit of priest rage off my chest. Not directed towards anyone in particular but you know who you are. There is such thing as a holy priest. We as a class have 2 specs for healing that are very different in style and healing and I think a lot of people discount how good a holy priest can be and will be. With talent changes and set bonuses in 5.4 I think a well played holy priest will demolish almost everyone else. It may be a personal opinion but I see so much synergy coming out of the way the spec will work that I can't discount how top players will use the class. Thank you for my minute of rage and enjoy the rest of your forum experience. =P
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90 Human Paladin
15420
Paladins are likely to be the weakest healer next tier, but that may change when they announce what the "compensation" will be for gutting Eternal Flame.


Maybe we will see another TotGC. All progression guilds' raids healer composition was 2 Holy Paladins + any 4 raid healers they could scrap.

HM Anub + No Holy Paladins = Lots of tanks' deaths.

Not impossible by any means, but a lot harder.
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85 Tauren Paladin
10920
Monks are OP in burst heals. Which seems to be most important currently.
Druids will be OP again next patch.
Disc will fall behind and be equal to pallies where most the nerfs were reverted.
Disc will be dead last.

If I had to guess. (10 man)
1.) Monk
2.) Druid
3.) Disc
4.) Holy Paladin
5.) Holy Priest
6.) Resto Shaman

(25 man)
1.) Monk
2.) Holy Priest
3.) Druid
4.) Holy Paladin
5.) Disc
6.) Resto Shaman
Edited by Xersian on 7/4/2013 6:05 PM PDT
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