How is ele going under the radar?

90 Troll Druid
12880
07/07/2013 09:42 AMPosted by Datahsz
We may do plenty of damage, but all of skills are casted so most classes can shut us down. We're not very good at all when we're getting attacked.


Ele does not get shut down whatsoever by getting trained

Honestly depends on what spec they are. If they're trying to cast ele blast and getting trained they're going to be locked out 24/7, but if they're just riding on procs (which is what ele does anyway) there's little difference
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90 Orc Shaman
HC
16485
Because Elemental is not OP, you can counter the damage it's just not how damage is usually done. You have to be entirely proactive, dispel flameshocks constantly on the person they're tunneling, purge off lava surge procs asap, control him constantly. This won't guarantee his godsend rng won't work, but it'll stop a lot of it.

They said they know Elemental is quite strong, which is true and they're going to nerf lava burst a bit. But one nerf too strong Elemental is back to garbage because it brings nothing worth bringing other than loldamage which is how the spec has always been and when it doesn't bring damage only a few play it. So they're obviously thinking of a way to stop it but not make elemental worthless again for multiple seasons. ;)


Come on... you gotta admit Ele is overpowered. They can take someone from 60% - 0% without any warning at all.


Overpowered is a widely subjective statement that people throw around like water, I'd prefer not to partake in such :p.
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90 Orc Hunter
8665
What makes ele so strong is them playing with afflic locks atm so you have to go on the lock or watch your whole team die at the same time while being fear rotated.
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90 Orc Shaman
13105
07/07/2013 06:00 AMPosted by Meemoz


5 stack tfb was unstoppable unless you killed the Warrior. You can literally cut the Ele damage by 50% if you just cleanse Flame Shock. Or you can interrupt LvB/EB. Because you aren't getting globaled without at least one hard cast, which relies on a proc during the cast, and then you pray for even more procs off of that cast.

Or you could also learn what the UE animation looks like so you know when the Ele is about to try to hit you hard, and you can react accordingly. I almost never get hit by a UE LvB/EB from another Ele, because I know what UE looks like. I know to interrupt/ground/LoS their next spell.



At least Mage burst is reliable.

At least Mage has spammable CC.

At least Mage has a real "oh sh*t" button.

All Ele has is damage.

RNG is just how Ele works, and you aren't going to see that changed until 6.0 at the earliest.


Mage Burst can be ruined by a single dispel (not exactly reliable).

1 Minute %30 DR that removes all magic debuffs on you and lasts 15 seconds is better than a dispellable 5 minute cooldown ice-block (especially with Priests with instant MD running rampant).

Ele has crazy unpredictable damage and spiky pressure, good off-heals and are never at risk of being interrupted.


Explain to me how a class that has to hard cast is not in danger of being interrupted?

You do also understand it takes a MAJOR Glyph slot for Shammy Rage to remove magical effects?
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5 Night Elf Warrior
0
07/07/2013 09:42 AMPosted by Datahsz
We may do plenty of damage, but all of skills are casted so most classes can shut us down. We're not very good at all when we're getting attacked.


Ele does not get shut down whatsoever by getting trained


Exactly, training them does nothing. They don't have to cast much of anything so it makes no difference.
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90 Orc Shaman
5270
For all of you non shamans who dont understand the class, and bad eles defending it, heres what it is.

Echo talent is what is causing you kids to get globaled. I dont even run this trash talent, i run Ans Swiftness because i run comps that requires burst setups.

If you eliminate or completely change Echo, you take away the fireworks show, and if you nerf flameshock spreading for higher proc %, you eliminate more of the instant lava bursts and its chance to insta gib someone without setup.

Why do this? It will force ele to go back to swiftness for actually setting up their burst because they cannot rely on retarded CONSISTENT rng damage to solo healers. However, lavaburst damage should (imo) remain the same because, when you train an ele, they do little damage, when your off of them, they produce massive pressure. But mages do the same thing right? its what comes with leaving a caster open. We still need to be able to produce pressure if we are allowed to do so - just without the insta kills! if not we dont get on any arena teams. You people forget that.

Eliminate RNG burst, force shamans to setup burst kills like mages must do.
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90 Pandaren Monk
9140
07/07/2013 08:38 AMPosted by Sotec

un dks are somewhat peelable and predictable. ele shamans however are not.


Lolwot? UH dks peelable? Ele is considerably easier to deal with it is only hard to counter when they play with a lock and you can't keep FS off the team mate getting focused.

Also ele (much like dks) is heavily reliant on high damage because of poor utility, if they even reverted the buffs then ele would once again be a free kill.

PS: Before "lol op shaman defending class" I play resto atm and ele nerfs wouldn't affect how I play.


Please dear lord.

No one is talking about a normal fight with an elemental shaman.

Ascendance burst is cray, but it can be dealt with just like any other classes burst.

No one is talking about that. If they are then theyre bad.

You know for a fact that most everyone is referring to the random pants on head retarded damage that your class can put out due simply to RNG. Theres no setup, theres no predicting it.

WE KNOW YOU KNOW. Its no different from any other class that has broken mechanics.

The simple fact of the matter is yes, of course theres ONE way of countering it. Just like taste for blood. "Don't let the warrior sit there and beat on you to build 5 stacks" Theyd say.

But again, the simple fact of the matter is if a healer is wasting her dispel on your 6 second flame shock then I'd wonder why you're team couldn't have won WITHOUT insane RNG.
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Mage Burst can be ruined by a single dispel (not exactly reliable).

1 Minute %30 DR that removes all magic debuffs on you and lasts 15 seconds is better than a dispellable 5 minute cooldown ice-block (especially with Priests with instant MD running rampant).

Ele has crazy unpredictable damage and spiky pressure, good off-heals and are never at risk of being interrupted.


Explain to me how a class that has to hard cast is not in danger of being interrupted?

You do also understand it takes a MAJOR Glyph slot for Shammy Rage to remove magical effects?
Does it also take a major glyph to shut you up?
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90 Human Rogue
KGB
6210


You do also understand it takes a MAJOR Glyph slot for Shammy Rage to remove magical effects?
Does it also take a major glyph to shut you up?


I don't think that would even work, also don't think that this guy understands that most classes are forced into glyph choices for PVP.
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07/07/2013 05:41 AMPosted by Mungoh
5 stack tfb was rng. why was it nerfed?


5 stack tfb was unstoppable unless you killed the Warrior.


You're ignorant. Stahp. It was stoppable as long as you could CC the warrior or get away from him so the proc would fall off. The same goes for ele shaman. Stop crying and trying to defend your overpowered to hell class. "but they can dispel it and the shaman can be locked down", the warriors could be CC'ed and locked down and their TFB would fall off and it couldn't be dispelled, it was still nerfed to the ground, because of what it was doing (one shot kills, essentially the same with 5-8 procs in a row for lava burst which happens ALL the time, RNG or not. It's more RNG for it to NOT happen)
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90 Human Warlock
21265
So many 1500 rated shamans not having any clue what their class actually does. When someone dies to an ele shaman in real arena games, it involves at most one flame burst cast followed by nothing but instants. An ele shaman does not even need a second dps to do anything at all for most kills.

I know you terrible clueless shaman are saying to just dispel flame shock to cut your damage down, but unfortunately it isn't realistic to use s dispel on cooldown to dispel flame shock (dispel is an 8 second cooldown and flame shock is a 6 second cooldown). So since I don't trust any of you to be smart enough to do that math on your own, I'll do it for you. It is virtually impossible to keep flame shock off of even one target if you used your dispel on cooldown for literally nothing else ever. Even then, you could still die in the 2 second window that flame shock is up, which is how long it takes for someone to die from full health to an ele shaman right now.

What normally happens is an ele shaman gets one cast off, just one. They flame burst followed by procs, which no one can predict or burn huge cooldowns to counter, followed by fulmination. An ele shaman can literally do almost 400k damage in 3 seconds without ascendance. If you think this is a balanced class, you are literally stupid beyond any reasonable means and probably can't understand that your class needs to be controlled a bit.

Enjoy, and please continue to try to defend your class. Good ele shamans know their class needs a complete reworking, it's unfortunate you people defending ele shamans right now are too stupid to understand that: http://www.twitch.tv/kisztwo/c/2523816 (this is essentially how every single ele team gets a kill at high rating)
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90 Orc Shaman
14210
The only problem is the random factor of elemental's damage
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90 Orc Shaman
HC
16485
So many 1500 rated shamans not having any clue what their class actually does. When someone dies to an ele shaman in real arena games, it involves at most one flame burst cast followed by nothing but instants. An ele shaman does not even need a second dps to do anything at all for most kills.

I know you terrible clueless shaman are saying to just dispel flame shock to cut your damage down, but unfortunately it isn't realistic to use s dispel on cooldown to dispel flame shock (dispel is an 8 second cooldown and flame shock is a 6 second cooldown). So since I don't trust any of you to be smart enough to do that math on your own, I'll do it for you. It is virtually impossible to keep flame shock off of even one target if you used your dispel on cooldown for literally nothing else ever. Even then, you could still die in the 2 second window that flame shock is up, which is how long it takes for someone to die from full health to an ele shaman right now.

What normally happens is an ele shaman gets one cast off, just one. They flame burst followed by procs, which no one can predict or burn huge cooldowns to counter, followed by fulmination. An ele shaman can literally do almost 400k damage in 3 seconds without ascendance. If you think this is a balanced class, you are literally stupid beyond any reasonable means and probably can't understand that your class needs to be controlled a bit.

Enjoy, and please continue to try to defend your class. Good ele shamans know their class needs a complete reworking, it's unfortunate you people defending ele shamans right now are too stupid to understand that: http://www.twitch.tv/kisztwo/c/2523816 (this is essentially how every single ele team gets a kill at high rating)


I don't really see anyone defending Ele, I see them giving advice on ways to improve themselves against elemental. You see my raging friend, this is a forum for discussion not circles of whining.

You may see people telling others of things to do that make it not as bad as defending a class, but that's just narrow sighted. You also insult others as if you're some hot boy who gets all the girls, hate to break it to you but you're not and acting like it doesn't make it so.

It's also funny you can't calculate the damage properly so you resort to inflated numbers or the top 0.1% of a mathematical scenario followed by a method that is not even achieved to get to it.

The only problem is the random factor of elemental's damage


Agree, sadly just how the spec is(Prob the most RNG spec in the game currently) there's no way around it till 6.0 =[.
Edited by Sensations on 7/7/2013 1:25 PM PDT
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90 Human Hunter
14850
When the only defense you have for your class is to say, "Well, all you have to do is focus all of your time, energy, CD's, GCD's and awareness on not getting globaled by us and we are effectively shut down", then you are basically illustrating for us why you need to be nerfed.
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90 Dwarf Warlock
9135
Cuz people are still leveling and gearing them like crazy. Blizz doesnt wanna yank the carrot on this class just yet.

Soon theyll throw the OP carrot infront of some other underplayed class so people will spend their time lvling and gearing that class


Yep, just hop on the FotM merry-go-round. Blizz answer to actually fixing the game to make up for lost subs.
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90 Undead Monk
8065
07/07/2013 01:04 PMPosted by Rainbowstar
unfortunately it isn't realistic to use s dispel on cooldown to dispel flame shock (dispel is an 8 second cooldown and flame shock is a 6 second cooldown).

Not to mention that most of the strong ele comps offer dispel protection for their flameshocks. UA silence + 80K damage or a 4 second VT fear is going to likely result from dispelling them on cooldown.
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90 Undead Mage
10465
You are aware that Lava surge is casted? the proced lava surges are completely RNG, so I am not sure you can 100% compare it to what mages were doing.


I love how you manage to !@#$% about mages and complain about shamans being weak even now, whilst maintaining solid negative win ratios as arguably the most broken spec in the game right now

just learn to play
Edited by Kircheis on 7/7/2013 1:36 PM PDT
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90 Undead Rogue
8685
they should just delete echo, it's a dumb talent anyway
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90 Undead Mage
10465
Like honestly, an ele complaining about lockouts?

Firelocked? Cast lightning bolt. Nature locked as well? Cast ele blast. Locked out of all 3 (how is that even possible?) It's k, lava surge even resets the fire lockout when it procs.

Seriously. Just learn your class and spec.
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90 Human Warlock
21265
So many 1500 rated shamans not having any clue what their class actually does. When someone dies to an ele shaman in real arena games, it involves at most one flame burst cast followed by nothing but instants. An ele shaman does not even need a second dps to do anything at all for most kills.

I know you terrible clueless shaman are saying to just dispel flame shock to cut your damage down, but unfortunately it isn't realistic to use s dispel on cooldown to dispel flame shock (dispel is an 8 second cooldown and flame shock is a 6 second cooldown). So since I don't trust any of you to be smart enough to do that math on your own, I'll do it for you. It is virtually impossible to keep flame shock off of even one target if you used your dispel on cooldown for literally nothing else ever. Even then, you could still die in the 2 second window that flame shock is up, which is how long it takes for someone to die from full health to an ele shaman right now.

What normally happens is an ele shaman gets one cast off, just one. They flame burst followed by procs, which no one can predict or burn huge cooldowns to counter, followed by fulmination. An ele shaman can literally do almost 400k damage in 3 seconds without ascendance. If you think this is a balanced class, you are literally stupid beyond any reasonable means and probably can't understand that your class needs to be controlled a bit.

Enjoy, and please continue to try to defend your class. Good ele shamans know their class needs a complete reworking, it's unfortunate you people defending ele shamans right now are too stupid to understand that: http://www.twitch.tv/kisztwo/c/2523816 (this is essentially how every single ele team gets a kill at high rating)


I don't really see anyone defending Ele, I see them giving advice on ways to improve themselves against elemental. You see my raging friend, this is a forum for discussion not circles of whining.

You may see people telling others of things to do that make it not as bad as defending a class, but that's just narrow sighted. You also insult others as if you're some hot boy who gets all the girls, hate to break it to you but you're not and acting like it doesn't make it so.

It's also funny you can't calculate the damage properly so you resort to inflated numbers or the top 0.1% of a mathematical scenario followed by a method that is not even achieved to get to it.

The only problem is the random factor of elemental's damage


Agree, sadly just how the spec is(Prob the most RNG spec in the game currently) there's no way around it till 6.0 =[.


Please do the math for us all then since you seem to think you know anything at all about your class. I can tell you right now it's going to be really awkward for you when you realize you not only know nothing about your class, but you can't do even basic math. But by all means though, please enlighten everyone on how it is impossible for an ele shaman to do 385k+ in one global if they start with a casted flame burst, because I have a picture of talbadar doing just that waiting to counter anything at all you try to say. It happens all the time, it is not some uncommon thing.
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