Resto druids

90 Night Elf Druid
13360
Only a few times I've ever hard casted a HT were on the 4th HoF boss on heroic for that strike mechanic.
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90 Night Elf Druid
10435
Just did some testing...the difference between NS+HT and NS+RG was around 5k and the winner went to RG, BUT, i would take that 5k in exchange for occasionally getting 300k-350k for HT and imo so should everyone else, but thats my opinion. Its all personal preference and based on gear...
FOr me, since im using the 12% haste cap instead of the 21%. i have reforged out of haste because on my gear alone it doesnt get me to the 21%, i have anywhere from 500-800 crit on half of my gear, SO, i tend to crit more often that those who go for the haste cap and reforge out of crit rather than haste.

(i like how i made this topic about some thinking you use HT to top people off, and it became a debate about NS and HT vs RG)

Edit: also I didnt have any buffs on at all (no motw, jade spirit, flask yada yada)
Edited by Moonrayna on 7/12/2013 6:49 PM PDT
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90 Worgen Druid
10660
Regrowth: 178k + NS
Healing touch: 173k (Non crit) / 351k crit

While I do typically use NS with Healing Touch, it's usually if, and only if one of the tanks drop below 25% health on a hard hitting boss. If it doesn't crit they get smacked dead (or close to it with no CD on them and assuming they don't mitigate the damage). 5k difference won't make a difference if the tanks are getting rocked for 300-400k health on melee swings or abilities. However if HT does crit, it has the potential to save the tank's life (or any other low health raid member in danger of significant damage really).

I will however occasionally use NS with Regrowth to top off a party member soaking something, or to snipe if there isn't much damage going out. It also has the potential to save a life but I'll be honest, on fights like H Dark Animus and other tank melter bosses 178k (210k maybe with raid buffs) won't put a dent in a 800k+ tank's health pool. I'd rather hit for 5-10k lower with the potential to heal for 200k more.

Using NS for either spell is viable, I just typically lean towards HT due to the potential it has. Perhaps once they fix (if they ever do) LS to proc off any damage taken I would switch my spell usage up more based on the situation.
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90 Night Elf Druid
10370
As an emergency heal, regrowth is fine. sure NS gives it 50% increased effectiveness but you save way less time NS'ing a RG than a HT. from my meters after fights I find that HT does less than 5% overhealing, and I ONLY use NS for HT.
While its healing is a very low % of my overall output, the argument that a NS+HT will not be effective vs a NS+RG because a non crit is less healing because any crit on a NS HT will be overhealing is ridiculous. almost the only time I use HT is with NS, and i almost NEVER do more than 5% overhealing with it.
Besides, factoring out the Living Seed, the Regrowth only does about 6k more healing than HT, which is not worth the time saved vs NSing a HT.
regrowth without NS will go off in about a GCD if you are at the second haste brakpoint of 21.43% raid buffed haste (6665 haste rating before racials), which is not worth the time saved VS casting NS HT which is two GCD's saved, with the (raid buffed) approximately 20% chance that the HT will crit.
In non progression fights the only people likely to need a NS'ed anything are tanks, and by the time they need a NS to save their life, a HT crit will not be over heal due to the HP inflation of tanks nowadays. Our tanks are at 800k health or above, and a NS+HT crit will be between 360k-400k, maybe half their health pool.

for anyone wondering I factor out living seed because even though I almost exclusively use OOC to RG the tank, it rarely does more than 90k healing over an entire fight.
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90 Night Elf Druid
4060
Yeah NS+HT non-crits for around the same that NS+RG crits for. Don't know what you guys are smoking. NS+RG=a bad way to use NS.

That's like NS-rooting.

Think about it like this:

If my NS+RG crit is getting me maybe 30-40K more in healing than a NON-crit NS-HT, why would I ever choose NS-HT? Simple: If you're forced to NS, would you rather always bring your partners up to 40-50% range from pretty-much-dead, or would you like to always bring them up to 40-50% range with an ADDED BONUS CHANCE TO TOP THEM FULL.

No-brainer.

That extra little bit of healing you might see between NS-RG crit and NS-HT non crit is not enough to make it a better option. I think my NS-HT non-crits for like 140-170ish right now?
My regrowths are hitting for 110 critting, so even if I used NS, it is POTENTIALLY NOT EVEN AN HPS GAIN to do so, whereas using Healing Touch could have me topping someone to full HP. RG will never do that.
Edited by Anoru on 7/15/2013 5:55 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Druid
10370
exactly, and if you need an emergency heal and NS is on cooldown, then RG is perfect, because it goes off in less than a second longer than a NS-ed one, which is only enough time to kill someone if they're standing in bad, and then if they die its their fault for being dumb. Tanks excepted, but if you're about to/are taking heavy damage you need to pop some sort of mitigation and/or ask for externals (ironbark!) (or stop standing in bad ive seen tanks do this too)

But if NS is off cooldown, HT is always the better option because like i said before-by the time somebody is in enough danger than I would consider NS, a crit will be very little overhealing.

Regardless, I welcome overhealing with NS because it means I've topped them off (and in the case of NS, for no mana cost at all, and the only reason overhealing is *bad* is because it translates to wasted mana, but if it didn't cost mana then it's a non issue) instead of bringing them them to 50%-60% which is still in danger of dying to ongoing damage.

I would rather have that 20% chance to top them off than to never have it. There is no downside to casting HT with NS because the only loss is that in the case of a non crit, there's no LS, which I've already addressed as a non issue because it constitutes less than 0.1% of our output anyway in my experience.

Which brings me to my tangent about the fricking 4piece next tier. Why are they doing it without changing the way LS procs? MAYBE if it proc'ed on any type of damage not just physical we could talk but until that happens the 4 piece is worthless because LS is worthless on anyone but a tank in PvE environment. If they keep mechanics the way they are with how it procs, LS will continue to only be useful in PvP against melee classes.
Edited by Miers on 7/16/2013 9:11 AM PDT
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90 Troll Druid
11860
07/16/2013 09:07 AMPosted by Miers
Which brings me to my tangent about the fricking 4piece next tier. Why are they doing it without changing the way LS procs? MAYBE if it proc'ed on any type of damage not just physical we could talk but until that happens


Hate to bring good news on this point but it IS proc'ing off physical AND magical damage already on the PTR.
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90 Night Elf Druid
9635
I barely touch HT. In fact, I leveled another Resto Druid to see the changes, and I don't even think you get HT, until BC?
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90 Night Elf Druid
17955
Regrowth > Healing Touch hands down!

Only time I Healing Touch is with Nature's Swiftness.
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90 Night Elf Druid
7680
NS/HT is strictly an emergency heal and almost always on the tank, sometimes a healer, never a DPS. Glyphed RG is my main go to when I need to pump it out. I'm liberal using Ironbark on whichever tank has aggro and as I learn the mechanics better, my timing gets better. I'm an active healer and always casting something every GCD.
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90 Tauren Druid
18820
07/16/2013 03:18 PMPosted by Trollmendous
Which brings me to my tangent about the fricking 4piece next tier. Why are they doing it without changing the way LS procs? MAYBE if it proc'ed on any type of damage not just physical we could talk but until that happens


Hate to bring good news on this point but it IS proc'ing off physical AND magical damage already on the PTR.

It is?

*Happy Dance*
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90 Troll Druid
4635
NS+RG = Better.. No time to get lucky on RNG for a HT crit when my RG always heals for crazy amounts.
Edited by Volbeatx on 7/20/2013 2:26 PM PDT
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NS+RG = Better.. No time to get lucky on RNG for a HT crit when my RG always heals for crazy amounts.


NS + RG (auto crit) ~= NS + HT (no crit). NS + RG (auto crit) << NS + HT (crit). What's the downside to using NS + HT? None.

/boggle
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90 Night Elf Druid
4060
Healing touch with NS non-crits for around the same as NS-regrowth, if not more. They are on par, (ie: the same,) except when NS+HT does crit, it hits for twice as much as RG. The only difference is with RG you always get bigger green numbers on your screen.

Bigger numbers feel better.
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90 Worgen Druid
7090
I sometimes spam Healing touch on a tank who I know will be taking massive damage spikes but hasn't yet. The reason being is that regrowth casts faster for similar mana and is thus much less efficient on mana in such situations. You're just waiting for the first spike hit and your healing touch to recover some of it and then you regrowth, swiftmend, or do whatever else is necessary. When you are casting on tanks at full health you don't want to be wasting mana precasting regrowths. Of course I'll use regrowth exclusively in almost every other situation. I think heroic dark animus and heroic primordias are the only ones that I bother doing this on.

If I have to spam a tank for a long time in a chain I will try to use a lot of healing touches cause otherwise pure regrowth will tank my mana if I don't get a lot of free ones. I'm talking a lot of back to back heals. Normally you don't need to chain large heals for so long and it's more of the occasional regrowth.

I rarely cast nourish at tanks at full health on non-spiky bosses to see if I can snipe a little healing with it but usually I just let the hots tick and throw out a regrowth/swiftmend whether it's for the sake of my sanity or because there is more important things (aka rejuv) to do then precast nourishes on a tanks. While healing touch can find occasional use due to mana efficiency, nourish is pretty useless. So far in phase one of heroic lei shen I try to throw out healing touches on the tank when there is downtime but my rejuv and lifebloom along with disc priests atonement is usually sufficient (of course if there is a decent health deficit I will regrowth instead).
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90 Worgen Druid
7090
07/20/2013 06:45 PMPosted by Pymp
NS+RG = Better.. No time to get lucky on RNG for a HT crit when my RG always heals for crazy amounts.


NS + RG (auto crit) ~= NS + HT (no crit). NS + RG (auto crit) << NS + HT (crit). What's the downside to using NS + HT? None.

/boggle

For tank healing I've considered using nature's swiftness with regrowth BECAUSE the living seed heal could potentially provide additional healing while the heatling touch crit is rather rng and rest druids don't usually carry that much crit on them (I think we are all like 20 - 22% with raid buff). For now I just use healing touch with it cause the living seed probably won't matter and I'm just used to using healing touch with it. It definitely pays off a lot more when you do get that healing touch crit on a large spike of damage along with an even larger living seed so I suppose that is enough justification.
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1 Night Elf Priest
0
Unless HT crits with NS, Regrowth is way better. (GLYPHED)

Remember, glyphed regrowth also adds living seed. Overall, Regrowth ( glyphed = living seed) heals for WAY more if HT doesnt crit with NS, and HT critting is not very often obviously.

Also consider the situations where your using NS.
For me, Its generally when the tank is taking excessive dmg. The living seed on a target continuously taking dmg isnt going to go to waste. 5.4 living seed is buffed so Id HONESTLY consider getting into the habit of using glyphed RG with NS rather than HT.
Edited by Poshy on 7/21/2013 12:38 AM PDT
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90 Night Elf Druid
7050

In a 10m raid the people taking the most serious damage (on avg) will be the tanks. I don't need to "hope" for my NS+RG. It does exactly what it needs to.


Which is marginally greater than HT....
I will automatically factor in Living seed, since that is what you wish.
NS+RG = 253k
NS+HT = 190k
NS+HT crit = 493k

(these numbers are done with no raid buffs, only Harmony and motw)

Let's say it's used 5 times on 1 encounter;
NS+RG, If you factor in living seed's, and assume they all actually proc and don't overheal (rare) it will do 1.26million healing
NS+HT will do 920k

NS+HT with just ONE crit = 1.37million. Just one crit.

All it takes is one single crit for HT to pull ahead. (Alot of it has to do with the nature of LS, it's poop.)

So, by running NS+RG, you're essentially assuming you will NEVER crit on NS+HT. With 20%~ crit on most druids in a raid environment this tier, and likely higher next tier, due to possible increased value of the crit stat, a Crit of NS+HT is not all that unlikely if you're using NS often.


I just hit a 1.2 million Healing Touch.
So I google searched it to see how that was even possible. and I found this post.

Just so everyone knows, Tonydanza is 100% right. I just did this 10 minutes ago and my jaw hit the desk. Resto druids are the best heals in the game; since we can hit 1.2 MILLION HT/RG.

Thank you blizzard.
Edited by Fti on 10/17/2013 11:12 AM PDT
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90 Tauren Druid
11310
RG as a flash heal. HT for a large precast heal. HT has the potential to crit for twice as much as RG and leave a bigger Living Seed. Chance for HT to crit is low though. Use RG for the most part, but HT when you can afford it. Don't even think about touching Nourish.

EDIT: Wait, this is a huge necro. Y u do this, Fti?
Edited by Moggsy on 10/17/2013 12:33 PM PDT
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90 Night Elf Druid
12350
I would take Healing Touch off my bars completely if I not for the T16 2 piece. Not that I have that yet -____-

EDIT: Wait, this is a huge necro. Y u do this, Fti?


3 months really isn't "huge," if the topic is still relevant.
Edited by Cinnabuns on 10/17/2013 1:01 PM PDT
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