Cataclysm Holy Basics Guide (4.3)

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90 Dwarf Paladin
4260
I'm interested in keeping reasoned debate alive. Also pie. I freaking love pie.

(Seriously, I just read this thread to check out the new forums. My beef is with cognitive dissonance, not the style of your guide.)


^ <3 PIE FTW
85 Blood Elf Priest
11965
I've yet to see a post that says, "your guide is good, but it's worded stupid". Which is basically what you just did.

This is pretty disingenuous. Dominish made a well reasoned and respectful critique of the OP. Even if you generally like the style of the guide, are you really going to claim that it cannot be improved upon? Furthermore, I find both the assertion that this is a basic guide and therefor recused from any depth of explanation and that past praise equates to current laudability flawed.
You can't claim you're keeping a description on GHeal in because it's for beginners and then include a discussion on the effects of haste (it has MATHS, it's hard!), or regemming for LK (andI kind of hope anyone that's in the LK fight at all has managed to at least read their tooltips by now).
While I'm sure this guide has helped many people in the past who have been quite thankful, that is, again, not a valid reason to say "it's fine; leave it alone". If your interest is truly in providing an excellent guide, then you should welcome constructive criticism. It's what allows you to improve not only the quality of the content you provide, but the manner in which it was presented.

Her goal was to provide the reader a sense of what each spell does. Honestly, I think she succeeded pretty well in that. She tells you exactly what it does, tells you about how much it heals for, and often gives you a basic idea of when to use it. A couple of the descriptions should probably be edited, but I haven't gone through it with a comb to find them all (greater heal and prayer of healing are two).
Haste isn't something you can explain without math. While you don't need to know the coefficients and multipliers to know that greater heal hits for a lot, most people want to know how much haste you need. A simple- "Haste makes your spells cast faster, lowers your global cooldown, makes your HoTs and channeled spells tick faster and sometimes tick more" won't really do it. Even the most inexperienced priest is going to at least want to know how much they need (which varies).
Aliena also isn't complaining about criticism.

Ohai! Long time no see. (Like a few days. Lol.)


Did you miss me Erebos?
Edited by Maladi on 11/6/2010 6:38 PM PDT
80 Human Mage
8480
I reject the premise that someone who would be satisfied with "GHeal heals for about 10000" would somehow have a problem with "haste makes you cast faster". Even if that were the case, why not say something like "here are some target hastes you may want depending on your goals"? I provide this not as a suggestion to change the guide, but as proof that haste is not irreducibly complex. If you want to have a simple guide for beginners, that's fine. If you want to provide depth where you think it is warranted, that is also fine. You cannot claim both simultaneously however.
90 Blood Elf Priest
11570
"Depth where you think it is warranted". Exactly. I rest my case. =P I have no qualms with someone writing a better piece and getting it stickied at all, I had guides written for another site and put them up here since it fit a sticky-hole at the time.

I appreciate constructive criticism like the comment by the original critic, but this is just going off into a nit-picking personal preference tangent.
85 Blood Elf Priest
11965
I reject the premise that someone who would be satisfied with "GHeal heals for about 10000" would somehow have a problem with "haste makes you cast faster". Even if that were the case, why not say something like "here are some target hastes you may want depending on your goals"? I provide this not as a suggestion to change the guide, but as proof that haste is not irreducibly complex. If you want to have a simple guide for beginners, that's fine. If you want to provide depth where you think it is warranted, that is also fine. You cannot claim both simultaneously however.


It wasn't really a premise, just an opinion. I also wasn't the one claiming she wrote it only for beginners. That said, I agree that "depth where warranted" is a good explanation.
80 Human Mage
8480
It appears I have not properly articulated my point. Allow me to attempt to clarify: a poster asked for more depth (among other things) on a particular topic, which several other posters rejected on the grounds that the guide was not to cover advanced topics. At the same time, when it was pointed out some of your topics seemed unusually technical given the previously expressed purpose of the guide, the response was that depth is acceptable in some situations. Assuming you do not believe yourself to have a monopoly on deciding what is pertinent information, the second assertion exists in direct opposition to the first.

I believe I've made it quite clear this has nothing to do with my personal preference and everything to do with intellectual honesty. I'm sorry if you feel this is nitpicking, but I believe such a dismissal will only lead to greater obstacles in the future.
80 Night Elf Priest
2590
Ohai! Long time no see. (Like a few days. Lol.)


Did you miss me Erebos?


I did. I cried myself to sleep for days. :[
85 Blood Elf Priest
11965
It appears I have not properly articulated my point. Allow me to attempt to clarify: a poster asked for more depth (among other things) on a particular topic, which several other posters rejected on the grounds that the guide was not to cover advanced topics. At the same time, when it was pointed out some of your topics seemed unusually technical given the previously expressed purpose of the guide, the response was that depth is acceptable in some situations. Assuming you do not believe yourself to have a monopoly on deciding what is pertinent information, the second assertion exists in direct opposition to the first.
I believe I've made it quite clear this has nothing to do with my personal preference and everything to do with intellectual honesty. I'm sorry if you feel this is nitpicking, but I believe such a dismissal will only lead to greater obstacles in the future.

It's just that, when writing this guide, she had three* choices. She could write a quick and simple explanation of the haste changes (and stay consistent) or copy my explanation, or write her own complicated one. Considering this guide was only ever intended to be relevant for a very short period of time, I think this updated guide is commendable. Everyone's goal, especially Aliena's, is to help people, so I'm sure she appreciates the feedback. It's just not reasonable for her to have to rewrite the entire guide just for 4.0.
Ohai! Long time no see. (Like a few days. Lol.)

Did you miss me Erebos?

I did. I cried myself to sleep for days. :[

I'm sorry :(
My account expires tomarrow, so I'll be gone for a bit.
Edited by Maladi on 11/6/2010 8:14 PM PDT
80 Night Elf Priest
2590
Ohai! Long time no see. (Like a few days. Lol.)

Did you miss me Erebos?

I did. I cried myself to sleep for days. :[

I'm sorry :(
My account expires tomarrow, so I'll be gone for a bit.

Nooo!!! Now who will I...umm...say hello to. Yeah, that's it. >.>
Edited by Erebös on 11/6/2010 8:00 PM PDT
omg, the tankspot crew actually uses the forums lol. Good Guide anyways Aliena I'm sure it will come in handy when my priest hits max level, Liked.
85 Blood Elf Priest
2685
I have been leveling my priest and I am almost 80 :) I love healing! and I find it so much different than DPS in so many ways. I wanted to try something different for a change. I have followed her guide and it has helped so much!

ty Aliena for taking the time and writing up this beautiful guide for beginner healers like me to understand healing and the spells much easier :D
85 Human Priest
10465
There's no reason why a starting guide shouldn't provide tips on when to use each spell, rather than simply explaining what the heal does.
I mean, this guide doesn't seem directed as you say, because statements go from tooltip level info ("Prayer of Mending has 5 charges and will bounce until either its charges run out or the current target does not take damage within thirty seconds") through to more advanced theory like:
(" The formula for calculating the number of additional ticks you will have is (2k-1)/2m (credit to Elimbras in the elitist jerks thread). K is the number of additional ticks, and m is the original number of ticks. If your haste is larger than this number, then you will get k additional ticks. Therefore, for renew, divine hymn, and hymn of hope, the amount of haste needed for one additional tick is 12.5% and 37.5% haste for 6. 32.79 haste rating is equal to 1% haste.

I think a 'raiding basics' guide should stay somewhere in between, with statements like this one being about right: "Renew is a filler spell that is most useful on high raid damage fights. When everybody is constantly taking damage, you'll get a lot of healing out of keeping renew ticking on as many targets as you can while using your high priority spells like Circle of Healing and Prayer of Mending on cooldown."
And then possibly finishing up with a sort of 'appendix' of sorts, with tables for things like HP/Mana, HP/sec, scaling, etc so that somebody getting their head around new spells can compare these aspects side by side.


Dominish, please by all means if you want a guide like this write one for the community. I would read it for sure. :)

The great thing about holy imo is that we're not one trick ponys like some of the other healing classes. We can have different playing styles and still be effective at our job. ;)
Edited by Gweneth on 11/8/2010 5:17 AM PST
85 Human Priest
8465
Is this the aliena from tankspot?
80 Troll Priest
6820
Is this the aliena from tankspot?


Yes.
85 Goblin Priest
4085
Is this the aliena from tankspot?


The who from where?! o.O
90 Human Priest
9255
Great guide; but after going "OOM" ALOt of times after this new patch i decided to go DISC, and now i have no problems with mana :) so goodbye holy and hello bubbles :P
85 Human Priest
8465
I guess "tankspot priest guide" should have tipped me off.

Aliena ftw!
85 Night Elf Priest
9975
Nice post! Thank you a lot.
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