Dead but not really, a set back perhaps

85 Human Mage
1900
Having Onyxia stitched back together, have experiments performed on her dead corpse, and being made into Frankenstein is a tired cliche? When has that ever happened in Warcraft lore? When has a dragon's brother stitched her back together and turned her into Frankenstein?
Who's that one scientist guy in ICC who made Festergut and Rotface again?
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90 Human Paladin
8185
Having Onyxia stitched back together, have experiments performed on her dead corpse, and being made into Frankenstein is a tired cliche? When has that ever happened in Warcraft lore? When has a dragon's brother stitched her back together and turned her into Frankenstein?

When have we seen in-game us beat up a character, take his stuff in a raid, have him show up in the major city to pronounce his revenge, and then make a pact with 2nd strongest member of the Burning Legion.

There hundreds and thousands of characters that have died and not come back. You're ignoring all the bosses we've killed just because a handful have returned for legitimate reasons.


Uh... have you seen the raid? She's not some Frankenstein. It's her, with a few bones showing here and there. And yes, it's been done a million times. We've fought plenty of undead dragons. The manner is which they are brought back was not important. We have the same villains we keep fighting long after we've "killed" them.
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98 Human Paladin
17040
Who's that one scientist guy in ICC who made Festergut and Rotface again?


Professor Putricide.
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85 Human Mage
1900
[quote]Having Onyxia stitched back together, have experiments performed on her dead corpse, and being made into Frankenstein is a tired cliche? When has that ever happened in Warcraft lore? When has a dragon's brother stitched her back together and turned her into Frankenstein?
When have we seen in-game us beat up a character, take his stuff in a raid, have him show up in the major city to pronounce his revenge, and then make a pact with 2nd strongest member of the Burning Legion.
There hundreds and thousands of characters that have died and not come back. You're ignoring all the bosses we've killed just because a handful have returned for legitimate reasons.

Uh... have you seen the raid? She's not some Frankenstein. It's her, with a few bones showing here and there. And yes, it's been done a million times. We've fought plenty of undead dragons. The manner is which they are brought back was not important. We have the same villains we keep fighting long after we've "killed" them.
Don't you think that bosses get tired of killing us over and over again just to come back with better gear each time?
Hogger: I thought I killed you years ago!
Lich King: I know man! I mean, I kill them, and they come back within a week! And they are better than they were before!
Kil'Jaedan: I know, it sucks man.
Marrowgar: te n00bz jst keep comin, itz 2 hard 2 stp them.
Edited by Andianton on 11/5/2010 11:33 AM PDT
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85 Human Mage
1900
Who's that one scientist guy in ICC who made Festergut and Rotface again?


Professor Putricide.
He has always been WoW's Frankenstein imo.
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80 Night Elf Priest
6270
Having Onyxia stitched back together, have experiments performed on her dead corpse, and being made into Frankenstein is a tired cliche? When has that ever happened in Warcraft lore? When has a dragon's brother stitched her back together and turned her into Frankenstein?
When have we seen in-game us beat up a character, take his stuff in a raid, have him show up in the major city to pronounce his revenge, and then make a pact with 2nd strongest member of the Burning Legion.
There hundreds and thousands of characters that have died and not come back. You're ignoring all the bosses we've killed just because a handful have returned for legitimate reasons.

Uh... have you seen the raid? She's not some Frankenstein. It's her, with a few bones showing here and there. And yes, it's been done a million times. We've fought plenty of undead dragons. The manner is which they are brought back was not important. We have the same villains we keep fighting long after we've "killed" them.

You obviously haven't seen the raid or the model. You can see the stitches on her neck. She has electrodes coming out of her body. You can see the electrodes and limbs stitched back together. Before the fight even starts she's still dead. Right before it starts you see Nefarian do the Frankenstein stuff and bring her to life. You see her get raised out of the lava, still a corpse. You're literally ignoring details just because you want a reason to complain. It's the details that make them different. Unless you can find another dragon raised by her brother, Frankenstein style, then this has never been done before.

http://www.wowhead.com/blog=167076#modelviewer:1:32569:0

On 2nd look of the model, her limbs were made from regular black dragons because they couldn't find her original limbs. You can clearly see the difference.
Edited by Mystero on 11/5/2010 11:36 AM PDT
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85 Human Mage
1900
Having Onyxia stitched back together, have experiments performed on her dead corpse, and being made into Frankenstein is a tired cliche? When has that ever happened in Warcraft lore? When has a dragon's brother stitched her back together and turned her into Frankenstein?
When have we seen in-game us beat up a character, take his stuff in a raid, have him show up in the major city to pronounce his revenge, and then make a pact with 2nd strongest member of the Burning Legion.
There hundreds and thousands of characters that have died and not come back. You're ignoring all the bosses we've killed just because a handful have returned for legitimate reasons.

Uh... have you seen the raid? She's not some Frankenstein. It's her, with a few bones showing here and there. And yes, it's been done a million times. We've fought plenty of undead dragons. The manner is which they are brought back was not important. We have the same villains we keep fighting long after we've "killed" them.

You obviously haven't seen the raid or the model. You can see the stitches on her neck. She has electrodes coming out of her body. You can see the electrodes and limbs stitched back together. Before the fight even starts she's still dead. Right before it starts you see Nefarian do the Frankenstein stuff and bring her to life. You see her get raised out of the lava, still a corpse. You're literally ignoring details just because you want a reason to complain. It's the details that make them different. Unless you can find another dragon raised by her brother, Frankenstein style, then this has never been done before.

http://www.wowhead.com/blog=167076#modelviewer:1:32569:0

On 2nd look of the model, her limbs were made from regular black dragons because they couldn't find her original limbs. You can clearly see the difference.
I now vote Nefarian as WoW's Frankenstein.

Wait, would Onyxia be scared of fire then?

That would get awkward. o.O
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85 Orc Shaman
0
Id like to see various spirits my self contact and advise at times, like grom talking to his son by way of shaman 3 way comunication
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90 Human Paladin
8185
Having Onyxia stitched back together, have experiments performed on her dead corpse, and being made into Frankenstein is a tired cliche? When has that ever happened in Warcraft lore? When has a dragon's brother stitched her back together and turned her into Frankenstein?
When have we seen in-game us beat up a character, take his stuff in a raid, have him show up in the major city to pronounce his revenge, and then make a pact with 2nd strongest member of the Burning Legion.
There hundreds and thousands of characters that have died and not come back. You're ignoring all the bosses we've killed just because a handful have returned for legitimate reasons.

Uh... have you seen the raid? She's not some Frankenstein. It's her, with a few bones showing here and there. And yes, it's been done a million times. We've fought plenty of undead dragons. The manner is which they are brought back was not important. We have the same villains we keep fighting long after we've "killed" them.

You obviously haven't seen the raid or the model. You can see the stitches on her neck. She has electrodes coming out of her body. You can see the electrodes and limbs stitched back together. Before the fight even starts she's still dead. Right before it starts you see Nefarian do the Frankenstein stuff and bring her to life. You see her get raised out of the lava, still a corpse. You're literally ignoring details just because you want a reason to complain. It's the details that make them different. Unless you can find another dragon raised by her brother, Frankenstein style, then this has never been done before.

http://www.wowhead.com/blog=167076#modelviewer:1:32569:0

On 2nd look of the model, her limbs were made from regular black dragons because they couldn't find her original limbs. You can clearly see the difference.


Sigh....

another guy who just can't grasp a simple concept...

Bringing people back from the dead who we've killed already is lame. It's lame because it's something that has been done too often. If it was a unique case where it happened once or twice, great. I'm almost expecting to fight Arthas and Illidan again at this point. And Kael a third time. Even Archimonde will probably make a comeback.
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90 Orc Hunter
7820
Spoilers (maybe)

I think Magni could come back. He's turned into stone now, but is there any way to tell if he's actually dead?
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80 Human Mage
3270
Even Archimonde will probably make a comeback.


There is nothing left of Archimonde to come back, but I digress.

I agree it can get really old seeing the same characters over and over.

One thing that bothers me even more than that, is them putting lore characters in game to be killed that cannot possibly be killed by players. Characters like...Deathwing. When last he fought, it took all four of the other aspects to BARELY defeat him. Now that Malygos is dead, anything short of a Titan will be too little to stop him.
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85 Orc Shaman
0
Even Archimonde will probably make a comeback.


There is nothing left of Archimonde to come back, but I digress.

I agree it can get really old seeing the same characters over and over.

One thing that bothers me even more than that, is them putting lore characters in game to be killed that cannot possibly be killed by players. Characters like...Deathwing. When last he fought, it took all four of the other aspects to BARELY defeat him. Now that Malygos is dead, anything short of a Titan will be too little to stop him.


We all know thrall will one shot him, due to his Super shaman form bestowed uponed him by our lord god Metzen
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91 Night Elf Druid
8860
Kel'Thuzad makes a comeback and harasses some schoolkids. Oh wait...
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85 Blood Elf Rogue
5625
Even Archimonde will probably make a comeback.


There is nothing left of Archimonde to come back, but I digress.

I agree it can get really old seeing the same characters over and over.

One thing that bothers me even more than that, is them putting lore characters in game to be killed that cannot possibly be killed by players. Characters like...Deathwing. When last he fought, it took all four of the other aspects to BARELY defeat him. Now that Malygos is dead, anything short of a Titan will be too little to stop him.


At this point we don't even know if we get to kill Deathwing or just banish him / trap him somewhere / something else. Seeing as it took the help of Alexstrasza and her dragons to kill Malygos, it's really doubtful we'll be able to simply charge in and roflstomp the Aspect of Death just like that.
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91 Night Elf Druid
8860
Even Archimonde will probably make a comeback.


There is nothing left of Archimonde to come back, but I digress.

I agree it can get really old seeing the same characters over and over.

One thing that bothers me even more than that, is them putting lore characters in game to be killed that cannot possibly be killed by players. Characters like...Deathwing. When last he fought, it took all four of the other aspects to BARELY defeat him. Now that Malygos is dead, anything short of a Titan will be too little to stop him.


At this point we don't even know if we get to kill Deathwing or just banish him / trap him somewhere / something else. Seeing as it took the help of Alexstrasza and her dragons to kill Malygos, it's really doubtful we'll be able to simply charge in and roflstomp the Aspect of Death just like that.


Once Cataclysm starts, Bubba the human hunter will kill Deathwing. Nothing gets in the way of Bubba.
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90 Blood Elf Paladin
5505

Dreadlords
"Defeating a dreadlord in the mortal plane only sends it back to the Twisting Nether." - Eligor Dawnbringer

Balnazzar and Mal'Ganis have already demonstrated this. Other notable dreadlords (like Detheroc, Varimathras, Anetheron and Tichondrius) are also liable to return eventually.


Just to point out - there's a very good chance Tichondrius is dead for good. He was killed by Illidan after he consumed the Skull of Gul'dan and gained his demonic metamorphosis - by gameplay mechanics, he couldn't be harmed by anyone apart from demon-form Illidan. Considering he was one of the most powerful Dreadlords and we haven't heard anything from him since the end of vanilla WC3, I think it's safe to say he's gone.

Ontopic: I sort of agree that they've overused the idea of ressurecting dead characters. There's nothing wrong with bringing back some characters once in a while, and there will always be an in-universe explanation, but it's cheap writing. Death should mean something. It should be something that's not taken lightly and nullified by 'a wizard did it!'

There are some situations where a ressurection or 'non-death' is valid. If a return from death is setup beforehand (i.e. Kel'thuzad with his phlactery, or even Kael'thas - who as someone pointed out, technically never died), there's nothing wrong with it. It's only if the writers bring back someone with no foreshadowing that it feels cheap.

Basically, the fear of death needs to be more valid. Obviously there are a lot of possibilities to cheat death in a universe like WoW, with magic like necromancy and the in-universe concept of dead spirits and what not, but a line has to be drawn if it starts to feel like it cheapens the concept and power behind a character dying. Otherwise people will just go 'oh that character is dead, guess we'll be seeing them get ressurected in three expansions' time!'
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85 Troll Priest
5800
Many of the elemental bosses could easily come back in Cata. Its sort of the deal with elementals. You can destroy them which basicly cleanses them but if you have the thing that caused their corruption still around your just buying time till a replacement corrupted Elemental Lord turns up.

I do agree that they should be careful about what villians they bring back. In some ways it made sense with the scourge cause the problem with undead is they generally dont stay dead. Villians coming back in Wrath made sense. Dreadlords also cause those guys you just cant kill.

It didnt happen too much in BC from memory. Keal was the only real example though I found myself facepalming at the thought that this brave force of adventurers had downed him and no one had bothered to check to make sure he was actually dead. I mean it wouldnt exactly be hard. First time I saw the dialog in Shat after someone had down him I had a funny image of a group of very embarassed heroes standing around going 'ahh.... Opps?"

Anyway, I think bringing back Villians can work as long as it isnt done too much. It loses its dramatic effect if it happens repeatedly.
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We all know thrall will one shot him, due to his Super shaman form bestowed uponed him by our lord god Metzen


Knaak will write a book about it; there will be raptors.
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98 Human Paladin
17040
Just to point out - there's a very good chance Tichondrius is dead for good. He was killed by Illidan after he consumed the Skull of Gul'dan and gained his demonic metamorphosis - by gameplay mechanics, he couldn't be harmed by anyone apart from demon-form Illidan. Considering he was one of the most powerful Dreadlords and we haven't heard anything from him since the end of vanilla WC3, I think it's safe to say he's gone.


Frostmourne also dealt Chaos Damage in Warcraft III (as it was a demonic artifact), but that wasn't enough to keep Mal'Ganis down.

Tichondrius may just be laying low for the time being.
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