[Ret-PvE] The Light and How to Swing It, v1

93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Gone back through and updated a bit. Not much to add, really; cleaned up some text, clarified a couple of notes.

Added Kafa Press and the Holy PvP 4-set as part of the Consumables section, so if you're not familiar with any of that take a look!
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Cleaned up an error in one of the AoE rotations, and added 4pT16 rotation which I had, apparently, forgotten.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
10795


Added Kafa Press and the Holy PvP 4-set as part of the Consumables section, so if you're not familiar with any of that take a look!


You may want to mention that the Kafa Press and Mogu pot share a cooldown
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Good call; added.
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100 Blood Elf Death Knight
15040
Cacabump
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
10795
Bumping this thread because of all the people looking for ret PVE help lately. Hopefully they can glean some information from the wise man's words.

Sidenote: where the hell is that dwarf?!
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100 Draenei Paladin
19360
05/08/2014 09:54 AMPosted by Arte
Bumping this thread because of all the people looking for ret PVE help lately.


The current stickied Raiding as Retribution guide is up to date so there's no need.

05/08/2014 09:54 AMPosted by Arte
Sidenote: where the hell is that dwarf?!


Sadly Grog's time in WoW came to an end, he quit months ago.
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Considering that raiding is once again in full swing, now, in WoD, people are seeking aid with their DPS. With Svayne's stickied guide nearing post-cap, I'm officially repurposing this thread for helping people with their DPS to, hopefully, consolidate help threads. Much like our beloved Open Libram, I'll make new editions as one help thread caps.

Bring on the problems!
Edited by Grôgnárd on 12/10/2014 3:55 PM PST
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100 Tauren Paladin
11920
Hey Grognard, i have been very confused on exactly when to switch to SoR. Some guides say as soon as there are 2 enemies, some say 4-5. I have been switching at 2 and i feel like im doing ok, i am using the mouseover macro for judgement to split it up between the 2 mobs but i still feel like maybe i'm wrong. Please guide me righteous one!
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
12/10/2014 04:11 PMPosted by Vengram
Hey Grognard, i have been very confused on exactly when to switch to SoR. Some guides say as soon as there are 2 enemies, some say 4-5. I have been switching at 2 and i feel like im doing ok, i am using the mouseover macro for judgement to split it up between the 2 mobs but i still feel like maybe i'm wrong. Please guide me righteous one!


I was, in point of fact, literally just trying to address your question here!

Seals for AoE still kinda depend on how long the mobs are going to live. Things that die quickly tend to do so better using SoR; if you can multi-DoT for Censure's full duration, SoT's probably still better to a point. My personal recommendation: If there are two targets that are going to live longer than ~25s, SoT's probably better; if there are three or more targets, and one or more are going to die in less than ~20s, SoR will probably be best. Use own judgement based on your group's DPS.
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100 Human Paladin
8955
Is it sensible to say for example on twin ogres, to 5 stack censure on both targets then switch to SoR, refreshing censure when needed? Or is that just a waste of time?
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Without having done that particular fight (starting a new job and a new guild right when raids are opening sucks! >_<), I can only take a stab and say that it's gonna depend largely on what talents you're using. DP/FV may not allow you the free globals to twist like that, procs depending, and should afford you enough AoE potential to not need to bother; Sera and anything at L75 would probably work okay for twisting like that (the boosted crit and MS chance could likely be quite hilarious with SoR!); and EmpS, of course, you're twisting anyway so sitting in SoR between refreshing Censure stacks wouldn't be a problem.

All in all, again, best judgement. If you feel you can swing the twisting without losing Censure on either target, go for it and laugh as the meters display your great cleavage.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
12730
12/10/2014 05:26 PMPosted by Nonabel
Is it sensible to say for example on twin ogres, to 5 stack censure on both targets then switch to SoR, refreshing censure when needed? Or is that just a waste of time?

Redacted. Censure cleaving is apparently still viable if you can maintain it reliably on 2 targets whose lifespans exceed the duration of Censure. As far as seal twisting between reapplications, I can't remotely imagine the raw seal damage being worth 2 globals every 20 seconds. I'd say that EmpS might be an exception, but why would anyone use EmpS except to gimp themselves?

Take note that the benefit of Censure cleaving may or may not be based on the level of your weapon due to how fickle scaling can be. Should always be viable though.
Edited by Qris on 12/11/2014 10:22 AM PST
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Hate to contradict you, Qris, but Sols says otherwise regarding Censure-cleaving:

Censure multi-dotting is only really viable if both Censures exceed the limit of there duration, twin ogron and brackenspore are the only fights that i can think of that would be applicable.


http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1607924-6-0-PvE-Ret-Paladin-Theorycraft-amp-Discussion?p=31064503#post31064503

And looking at parses on Warcraftlogs.com, some of the top Ret's appear to be Censure-cleaving on Ogron already.
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
12730
Didn't catch that bit. Good to have something new to look at though.
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100 Human Paladin
17170
es eds_4s tv5 how exo_bc tv_aw_exec cs eds_aw_exec j eds tv4 exo tv3

this is in your post under SERA/HA

is this intended to be used in clcret?
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93 Dwarf Paladin
15135
Yes, that's a priority string for CLCret.
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100 Human Paladin
17170
other than seraphim usage what else do i need to remember to keep an eye on to increase performance

this was in default clcret, any idea what it was intended to be used for?

es eds5 tv_dp_4s eds5_fv tv5 ds5 eds_4s how cs j emp_sot_exp emp_sor_exp exo emp_sot_return tv4 tv3

doh, just realized the EMP probably for EMP seal usage.

How do you guys handle managing multiple strings?
Edited by Randymagnum on 12/13/2014 3:12 PM PST
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100 Blood Elf Paladin
12730
12/13/2014 03:08 PMPosted by Randymagnum
other than seraphim usage what else do i need to remember to keep an eye on to increase performance

Off the top of my head: Seraphim CD, amount of Holy Power available within 9 seconds of it coming off CD, the sync between AW and Sera (and HA, if used) not going too off-track, and proper placement of EDS procs.

On 2+ target fights (particularly Twin Ogron, Brakenspore, and Tectus during the first split phase), you also want to be Censure cleaving, which means monitoring two DoTs. Oh, and Double Jeopardy is useful on any fight. Doesn't take much monitoring though; just make a mouseover macro for Judgment so you can rotate its target all day.

12/13/2014 03:08 PMPosted by Randymagnum
this was in default clcret, any idea what it was intended to be used for?

It's just there to be there and get replaced, as far as I'm concerned.

12/13/2014 03:08 PMPosted by Randymagnum
How do you guys handle managing multiple strings?

I only use two specs: Sera+SW and FV+DP, so I have two strings. Those two strings happen to be the ones in the Ret sticky, so I just use it as a reference.
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100 Human Paladin
10470
Is it possible to use clcret for seraphim? I normally play FV and I am trying to learn seraphim but I find myself pulling 1k dps less on the dummy while specced seraphim. I would like to use clcret to learn the priorities for the spec, but I haven't been able to find anyone talking about it.
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