frost mage mastery in 5.4 main stat?

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96 Goblin Mage
5845
now our main stat apart from intelligence is haste.

will mastery be our main stat in 5.fo-er?
Edited by Footfunk on 8/29/2013 12:21 AM PDT
100 Gnome Mage
8665
No.
96 Goblin Mage
5845
thanks sweety :)
91 Undead Mage
12240
I believe Haste will still be the most viable secondary stat, but people will be less reluctant to reforge out of Mastery so quickly to something like Crit.
100 Gnome Mage
8665
^People reforge out of Crit to Mastery/Haste as Frost as it is, because hitting the soft crit cap is very easy.
100 Worgen Mage
13255
Any idea what the stat weights will be in 5.4?

I vaguely recall reading Lhivera posting that mastery would be stronger for PVE in 5.4 than it is on live. And I think since then, Blizzard nerfed frostbolt and buffed mastery even more.

Also the nerf to RPPM will reduce the effectiveness of haste. Is it still going to better than mastery?

Should frost mages in 5.4 continue to stack all haste or go for mastery instead? or perhaps half and half? Should we act like elemental shamans and gem int?
Edited by Mistwynd on 8/30/2013 2:04 PM PDT
96 Goblin Mage
5845
that's what I wanna know. anyone been testing this out on PTR server?
MVP
90 Human Mage
10015
Nobody's really put any time into building T16 profiles. Nathyiel has been doing a lot of work on the action priority lists, but the gear hasn't really been touched. I hope to get something pushed to the repository today, but it will basically be a skeletal beginning with very little optimization.

Anyone who cares to help with this, please feel free to pull from the repo and do what you can.
________________________________________________
Find answers to questions about Mage mechanics in
Lhivera’s Compendium • http://lhiveras-library.com/compendium

“I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.”
– George Bernard Shaw
90 Troll Mage
4060
I have been playing around on the PTR with the new 516 tier gear. The really frustrating thing is i do not believe that the tier gear will be BIS for frost. It is ALL stacked with crit and therefore other gear might be better unless the value of crit has came on par with haste. Currently i am running with 32% mastery, 42.5% haste and about 25% crit which is the soft cap if you are not raiding currently. I am using the different trinkets and i think that the multistrike trinket and the haste trinket are going to be best for frost. The problem is at 543 item level on the ptr i was only able to sustain about 200-220k dps on the target dummy over a period of 5 minutes. We really are not going to be able to really know what our stat weights should be until someone does a whole serious of simcraft testing and what not. The good news is that it wont be too difficult to get gear between 528 lfr and 548 flex raid. At 530 on my live frost mage i am hoping that i can reach 545 relatively soon as 200k dps should keep me in the top 5 of my 25 man raid group
90 Worgen Mage
11190
it will remain crit as low as we can, Haste > mastery
90 Worgen Mage
11190
I have been playing around on the PTR with the new 516 tier gear. The really frustrating thing is i do not believe that the tier gear will be BIS for frost. It is ALL stacked with crit and therefore other gear might be better unless the value of crit has came on par with haste. Currently i am running with 32% mastery, 42.5% haste and about 25% crit which is the soft cap if you are not raiding currently. I am using the different trinkets and i think that the multistrike trinket and the haste trinket are going to be best for frost. The problem is at 543 item level on the ptr i was only able to sustain about 200-220k dps on the target dummy over a period of 5 minutes. We really are not going to be able to really know what our stat weights should be until someone does a whole serious of simcraft testing and what not. The good news is that it wont be too difficult to get gear between 528 lfr and 548 flex raid. At 530 on my live frost mage i am hoping that i can reach 545 relatively soon as 200k dps should keep me in the top 5 of my 25 man raid group


Mage sims are never correct. Using them to the degree that Lhivera does is a complete waste of time.

I find it funny that the people who work on this game can't even finish the job or get even close to figuring out why we're broken.
90 Troll Mage
4060
The other thing to consider as well is that i think that they somewhat nerfed a majority of the classes anywhere from 5-10% of live. If everyone's numbers are scaled down by that much than fire and frost should still remain competitive. We just have to determine what our best stats are going to be and where the balance between haste and intellect is going to lie.
90 Worgen Mage
11190
The other thing to consider as well is that i think that they somewhat nerfed a majority of the classes anywhere from 5-10% of live. If everyone's numbers are scaled down by that much than fire and frost should still remain competitive. We just have to determine what our best stats are going to be and where the balance between haste and intellect is going to lie.


Fire will remain competitive because of how it scales with more stats. Frost has the exact opposite problem. Most of us competitive frost mages are going into the tier already stat capped (in crit AND haste). This spells trouble bc all we're going to be doing is gaining more stats. Until the scaling issue is fixed then we will continue to not be near fire or arcane in 5.4.

Again, as of now our stat priority has not and should not change. Even with the change they made to RPPM.
09/01/2013 01:02 PMPosted by Mastamagee
Fire will remain competitive because of how it scales with more stats. Frost has the exact opposite problem. Most of us competitive frost mages are going into the tier already stat capped (in crit AND haste). This spells trouble bc all we're going to be doing is gaining more stats. Until the scaling issue is fixed then we will continue to not be near fire or arcane in 5.4.
Our new mastery allows us to stop being stat capped, except on haste. For the reasons that 1. The more damage we do with Frostbolt in between FoF and BF the stronger Icicles we get, and 2. Critical strike rating is no longer limited solely for FoF and BF procs and how will be much better for our other spells like Frostbolt, Mage Bomb, and Frozen Orb.

Mastery might step itself up higher than crit, keeping crit at softcap, but we wont still suffer from more stats. We'll grow just the same.
90 Worgen Mage
11190
[quote="97912797125"]Mastery might step itself up higher than crit, keeping crit at softcap, but we wont still suffer from more stats. We'll grow just the same.


Mastery is already > crit this tier and will continue to be so in 5.4. We will still suffer from being stat capped, namely haste. We will never be Mastery capped. With the amount of crit on T16 gear, I view it as being an issue.
MVP
90 Human Mage
10015
I put some time into the Frost profile today. It's not fully optimized yet, but it's within a couple of percent. The weights so far are running about:

7.90 Intellect
4.14 Haste
4.12 Mastery
3.69 Crit

That's with hit at 14.99%, crit at 25.94% (more than 2% under cap), mastery at 56.04% and haste at 45.15% (nearly 5% under cap). 4x T16N, with off-set pants.

By comparison, the T15H stat weights were:

6.72 Intellect
2.94 Haste
2.81 Mastery
2.56 Crit

...with 15.02% hit, 24.42% crit, 47.98% mastery and 54.67% haste.

The major difference here is that Mastery has caught up to Haste before Haste is capped, whereas previously Haste maintained a lead even well after being capped. Note that Mastery's value will also increase if there is a cleave target available.
________________________________________________
Find answers to questions about Mage mechanics in
Lhivera’s Compendium • http://lhiveras-library.com/compendium

“I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.”
– George Bernard Shaw
Edited by Lhivera on 9/1/2013 5:31 PM PDT
100 Gnome Mage
8665
I put some time into the Frost profile today. It's not fully optimized yet, but it's within a couple of percent. The weights so far are running about:

7.90 Intellect
4.14 Haste
4.12 Mastery
3.69 Crit

That's with hit at 14.99%, crit at 25.94% (more than 2% under cap), mastery at 56.04% and haste at 45.15% (nearly 5% under cap). 4x T16N, with off-set pants.

By comparison, the T15H stat weights were:

6.72 Intellect
2.94 Haste
2.81 Mastery
2.56 Crit

...with 15.02% hit, 24.42% crit, 47.98% mastery and 54.67% haste.

The major difference here is that Mastery has caught up to Haste before Haste is capped, whereas previously Haste maintained a lead even well after being capped. Note that Mastery's value will also increase if there is a cleave target available.
________________________________________________
Find answers to questions about Mage mechanics in
Lhivera’s Compendium • http://lhiveras-library.com/compendium

“I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.”
– George Bernard Shaw

This is awesome. Lets us freely switch between Arcane & Frost. Arcane will probably win on multi DoT fights and Frost easily wins on cleave.
Edited by Breaktheice on 9/1/2013 10:07 PM PDT
90 Troll Mage
4060
Lhivera, how are you able to achieve such high mastery. My mage at 543 on the ptr is running the same crit, about 43% haste without raid buff, and about i think 36% mastery without the raid buff.
MVP
90 Human Mage
10015
That's in 553 gear, buffed.

ETA: Sorry, 553 gear plus the legendary cloak, which is supposed to be completable pretty quickly after 5.4 hits for those people doing the chain.
________________________________________________
Find answers to questions about Mage mechanics in
Lhivera’s Compendium • http://lhiveras-library.com/compendium

“I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it.”
– George Bernard Shaw
Edited by Lhivera on 9/2/2013 5:51 AM PDT
90 Undead Rogue
11050
thats weird i just watched a vid on youtube of a guy testing it and he said his highest dmg was
mastery-crit haste
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