Diablo® III

How does BOA help the me as a player?

Posted by ZeroIf I have an awesome ring but find a slight upgrade

BoA actually makes it so that situation that you described actually happens more than once every 1000 hours. You can actually find upgrades because you didn't trade your way into BiS thus eliminating the entire point of the game. Kill monsters, find awesome loot. BoA makes sense. All arguments against it seem to be wholly selfish.


OK this is an acceptable answer, if it really happens. If the loot is going to be so good that not having BOA would lead to quick saturation of 'Godly' items, I could see it being viable. I would hope to continue seeing upgrades after months of play, though.

Someone also mentioned that you could trade with people during the same game. I could see good experiences coming out of that. If someone gets a great drop, but is not really interested in the stats, they might give it to you instead of selling/trading it.

I'm still doubtful, but these are legit reasons why it might be good. I can see the possibility that this design change could lead to a better community. With the current design, you are almost required to be selfish.

Thanks so much for all the responses.


Can we count you among the converted? Or best-case among the 'let's see how it goes' camp? :)
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11/18/2013 02:28 AMPosted by Aristobulous
let's see how it goes' camp?


I think we're all in this 'camp' to a lesser or greater degree tbh.
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11/18/2013 02:25 AMPosted by Wired
You can buy BiS gear in WoW, because you can just buy a whole raid to funnel all drops to you!

This, whilst possible - accounts for an absolute tiny tiny fraction of 1% of all the raid loot that drops in Wow.

I've raided for 7 years and am currently my guild's raid leader. (Burning Steppes EU - Aliens)

I can assure you that Bis means Bis with the heroic SoO raids needing incredibly geared and legendary cloaked whole raid teams that less than 1% of all servers have - let alone the tiny % of those that offer a boost service!

To suggest that this is widespread or even heard of by the overwhelming majority of Wow players - is to demonstrate your utter lack of accurate knowledge of Wow raiding.

The FACT is that 99% of players actually make do with slightly reduced versions of the BiS loot, from doing normal raids or LFR or Flex - there is just no need for the BiS heroic stuff and I am surprised that you try to muddy the BOA debate waters by suggesting there is Darlynn. Very disingenous of you IMO.


I did not say it's widespread. Just that it's possible.

And yeah, since they started to rain gold during about WotLK, gold is nearly usless in WoW anyway. I stopped making it after my 2nd mil there, now I have enough gold for WoW's lifetime and some more.

But to make D3 even more WoWlike, then they need to cut amount of drops by 4, when playing in party of 4.
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I did not say it's widespread. Just that it's possible.

And yeah, since they started to rain gold during about WotLK, gold is nearly usless in WoW anyway. I stopped making it after my 2nd mil there, now I have enough gold for WoW's lifetime and some more.

But to make D3 even more WoWlike, then they need to cut amount of drops by 4, when playing in party of 4.


To make D3 more WoW-like they need to put in some content beyond a clickfest that takes thought to get through, or at least optimize efficiency, such as builds and gear as in D2.

To make D3 more WoW-like they need to add, writing, graphics, cinematics, and music that actually engage the players into a fantasy world.

To make D3 more WoW-like it needs to stop sucking.

Please do continue with your campaign to convince people that they'd prefer to be accountants rather than fantasy characters though. People argue their dreams of a good game and you try to sell them your ego and pennies. It's highly amusing to watch.

Wired I'm running a guild in FFXIV now and we could sell Titan and Coil runs as some guilds do but A) I'm not that way and B) players that buy those just would just hit a wall anyway. What do you do with BiS gear once you've bought it in games with an end game is also funny because the player still hasn't learned to play and fails in the same level of content or the next.

Also, long time no see my friend! XD
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I have posted this question in a couple of BOA threads, but never got any response. Have we received any explanation as to how BOA is good for us as players?

I understand that it screws over botters and 3rd party sites, but why should I care? If I have an awesome ring but find a slight upgrade, what if I want to trade the old ring to my friend? What if I find a godly item, and want to try and trade it for an upgrade for my favorite class?

Do we have any reason to believe that BOA is good for us, or is it just bad for them (botters and 3rd party sites)?


You hit the nail, BoA is no good for regular player who want to play and have fun with friends (I expect most have more than 3 friends in friends list), BoA means you can not help out a friend and friends cannot help you.
But why do we have friends, friends are those who help each other and share, BoA takes this away.

It's rude way to say, go play yourself and forgot friends, cause it does not matter since you cannot share your loot.

Diablo should be fun and social, BoA is the opposite of this.


If you are going to make an statement about something first make sure you have your facts straight. It has been stated that BoA will not take effect until 2 hours or so after the items drops (this time could change however) and that they are thinking about making the item tradable outside of the game it dropped in for a limited time. So the question is how does this make Diablo less social? you should always want to play with friends because of this! that way when an item drops that they need you can just trade it to them.
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If you are going to make an statement about something first make sure you have your facts straight. It has been stated that BoA will not take effect until 2 hours or so after the items drops (this time could change however) and that they are thinking about making the item tradable outside of the game it dropped in for a limited time. So the question is how does this make Diablo less social? you should always want to play with friends because of this! that way when an item drops that they need you can just trade it to them.

Because your friends are always on when you are, amirite?!
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Answer: it makes it possible for you to find good gear yourself. To gear yourself without spending real money or getting lucky with a 1 in a billion drop.
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BOA does this:

1.) It kills the black market and third party trading sites for legendary set items (BTW thank you Blizzard!).

2.) It drastically reduces the incentive for scammers, spam bots, and just annoying traders from joining games just for the sole purpose to sell items. Traders destroy public games because they increase the difficulty of a game but never contribute to killing mobs.

3.) It adds value to actually playing the game and not sitting in lobby's or Tristam swapping trade windows with other players.

Note: I personally was not happy with the removal of the RMAH and GAH, but I am glad that Blizzard was smart enough to go to a BOA rule set and reduce the downsides of removing the auction houses. What's hilarious is the same whiners who pushed Blizzard into removing the auction houses are now the same whiners who are complaining about BOA.
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If you are going to make an statement about something first make sure you have your facts straight. It has been stated that BoA will not take effect until 2 hours or so after the items drops (this time could change however) and that they are thinking about making the item tradable outside of the game it dropped in for a limited time. So the question is how does this make Diablo less social? you should always want to play with friends because of this! that way when an item drops that they need you can just trade it to them.

Because your friends are always on when you are, amirite?!


Well if they are not then that's just too bad, run with them when they are on. If only it wasn't such a huge massive drawback for you. I guess you should only play the game when you can organize your friends and have them all on at the same time...
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BOA helps me by saving me money

because there is nooooo way im paying for that crap lol
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It doesn't, but it does help the devs. Instead of designing a full rich character and itemization system that encourages thought, build diversity, and challenge they can slap a boa band aid on it and make some money.

The Wilson team screwed the pooch on d3, the fixes it needs require core systems to be reworked. They aren't going to do that. Hence, boa. Expect numerous half hearted seemingly direction less changes over the coming months.
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OP: BoA harms everyone, but it harms AH tycoons slightly more.

The pay-2-win problem can still be mitigated greatly using BTMK though, check it out!

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/10497750349
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BOA helps me by saving me money

because there is nooooo way im paying for that crap lol


This is a huge issue for me, free trade is one of those key elements that added to that feel of total freedom that was omnipresent in d2. If i buy this game i signal the devs that i endorse their design philosophies and i don't agree with them at all. If anything i feel they ruined the diablo name and severely damaged blizzards reputation.
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I'm sure you've gotten several responses already, but just keep ignoring them and asking the same question. There's been a lot of that lately!

BoA takes Diablo III from pay-to-win to play-to-win.

BoA helps the more "innocent" players by removing the advantage from others who are able to consolidate the resources of multiple accounts into one. Now at least a player has a chance of being somewhat competitive, rather than going up against someone who's paid for gear that's taken the equivalent of 100,000 hours to get.

People will still buy accounts, but they can only buy the effort of *one* account, the most lucky account out of all the ones that the botter was running.
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there hasn't been a single argument for boa that can't be argued against.

but they can't tell us why they have to ruin the game for us when they can play the way they want to play regardless of the way we play

they dodge and say other things "it'll kill 3rd party sites" (btw it won't they'll just go onto your account with a botand level it for you)
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there hasn't been a single argument for boa that can't be argued against.

but they can't tell us why they have to ruin the game for us when they can play the way they want to play regardless of the way we play


BoA prevents you from short circuiting progression by skipping over large chunks of it in huge leaps with trading instead of smaller steps from actually playing the game. You might think this is bad, but that's the same as a small child thinking its bad not having chocolate cake for breakfast even when its obviously not a good idea.

Its not about ruining the game for you. It's about preserving the spirit and intent of the game for everyone and keeping it fun for as long as possible. Unless you'd rather be geared out in 3 months with no desire to play any of the new content since all drops suck and you already have all 6 characters clearing torment 5 and start complaining how blizzard keeps making the game too easy?(is this what pro traders really want? A massive pointless E-peen gear competition?)
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there hasn't been a single argument for boa that can't be argued against.

but they can't tell us why they have to ruin the game for us when they can play the way they want to play regardless of the way we play


BoA prevents you from short circuiting progression by skipping over large chunks of it in huge leaps with trading instead of smaller steps from actually playing the game. You might think this is bad, but that's the same as a small child thinking its bad not having chocolate cake for breakfast even when its obviously not a good idea.

Its not about ruining the game for you. It's about preserving the spirit and intent of the game for everyone and keeping it fun for as long as possible. Unless you'd rather be geared out in 3 months with no desire to play any of the new content since all drops suck and you already have all 6 characters clearing torment 5 and start complaining how blizzard keeps making the game too easy?(is this what pro traders really want? A massive pointless E-peen gear competition?)


so your argument is that you know better than us and that trading, which has been in diablo since day 1 so go away because you say so. (that I can't have chocolate cake for breakfast?)

face it. you can play without trading just fine. your just want all of us to be forced to play the same way as you.

what we do is our own business, if the drops are balanced around a self found player (loot 2.0 claims this), then what we do won't affect you.
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BoA prevents you from short circuiting progression by skipping over large chunks of it in huge leaps with trading instead of smaller steps from actually playing the game. You might think this is bad, but that's the same as a small child thinking its bad not having chocolate cake for breakfast even when its obviously not a good idea.

Its not about ruining the game for you. It's about preserving the spirit and intent of the game for everyone and keeping it fun for as long as possible. Unless you'd rather be geared out in 3 months with no desire to play any of the new content since all drops suck and you already have all 6 characters clearing torment 5 and start complaining how blizzard keeps making the game too easy?(is this what pro traders really want? A massive pointless E-peen gear competition?)


so your argument is that you know better than us and that trading, which has been in diablo since day 1 so go away because you say so. (that I can't have chocolate cake for breakfast?)

face it. you can play without trading just fine. your just want all of us to be forced to play the same way as you.

what we do is our own business, if the drops are balanced around a self found player (loot 2.0 claims this), then what we do won't affect you.


Your argument is flawed based on the simple fact that they are NOT REMOVING TRADING! You can still trade rares and other items. You just can't trade Legendary and Set items that have dropped in game that have been removed from that game (or perhaps there is a 2 hour window of time which actually ruins your argument even more) and you are also stating that YOU and the anti BOA crowd know what is best for the game.
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BoA prevents you from short circuiting progression by skipping over large chunks of it in huge leaps with trading instead of smaller steps from actually playing the game. You might think this is bad, but that's the same as a small child thinking its bad not having chocolate cake for breakfast even when its obviously not a good idea.

Its not about ruining the game for you. It's about preserving the spirit and intent of the game for everyone and keeping it fun for as long as possible. Unless you'd rather be geared out in 3 months with no desire to play any of the new content since all drops suck and you already have all 6 characters clearing torment 5 and start complaining how blizzard keeps making the game too easy?(is this what pro traders really want? A massive pointless E-peen gear competition?)


so your argument is that you know better than us and that trading, which has been in diablo since day 1 so go away because you say so. (that I can't have chocolate cake for breakfast?)

face it. you can play without trading just fine. your just want all of us to be forced to play the same way as you.

what we do is our own business, if the drops are balanced around a self found player (loot 2.0 claims this), then what we do won't affect you.


If trading for the best items in the game is the best or easiest way to get them, then everyone who traded would be getting those items the fastest compared to everyone else. I think we can agree that as fact. Now all of these players would have a distinct advantage over all other players in terms of farming gear, gaining paragon levels, progressing in general since they had the fastest way to get the best loot. Would you agree that this is factual?

These players would likely base their online interactions on the qualities that upper tier of loot provides. Looking for torment 5 groups, doing speed runs, 500k+ Dps only groups, capped MF only groups, looking only for max rolled legendaries in game etc. Any player who could not meet these requirements would be negatively affecting their efficacy so they would likely be generally avoided. Essentially, if you didn't trade if you were able, you would not only be at a distinct disadvantage in terms of progression, you would likely not have as positive an online experience with other players overall.

So now add into this situation the botters and 3rd party sellers. Suddenly all players are faced with the prospect that the best and most efficient way to play is to buy your gear, lest you fall behind and online play becomes less enjoyable. So we are back to the pay-2-win gameplay that we have at the moment. Its at this point where pay to win trumps the actual fun of the game, and indeed lessens the games life span.

Sure you could just ignore all of this, but then you are segregated into this "self found" category, you have less fun as a result unless you stick to playing with other self founders. And for what? So pro-traders have more fun? At the cost of the overall enjoyment of the game for themselves included? In one years time how many will have gotten bored and quit? Are you saying that a smaller population in-game will not effect me in the slightest? What about if/when PvP is finally released? What if the game becomes so easy they boost the difficulty or adjust other systems to please the trading population? The player base becomes even more divided, the traders and the "self founders" each playing on separate levels from each other, each group not able to interact with the other as well. Even among the traders those who pay for items would be on yet another level.

Naturally this segregation will all happen on its own eventually without trading, but the time required would be so much higher with BoA. The game would last longer, years even. For everyone. But once you get to the "everyone has an enigma" state of the game, its kinda pointless to farm. Its kinda pointless to play unless you ignore the entire community and play it solo or you join in on the "fun" and get the duped enigmas(in this case, traded or bought BiS legendaries) and go back to ignoring the whole reason to play. Kill monsters, get awesome loot.

There are many things that can be said in support of BoA. The only argument against it I hear is that you shouldn't be forced to play the way I do. But why should I be forced to play the way you want? Saying that I can ignore trading if I want to is ignoring the fact that it will affect my game negatively in one way or another. Currently anyone can simply ignore the AH, yet it exists and it was a large factor in the overall failure of vanilla D3, so much so that when it was announced that it was being removed the vast majority praised the decision. And simply arguing that trading has just always been there in it's defense is pretty weak. We used to just always live in caves banging rocks together and hunting with sticks, so why did we change? It made things better. BoA will make things better. Not because I say so, because its the truth even if many don't know it.
Edited by Qwanderer#1768 on 11/18/2013 7:15 PM PST
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