Diablo® III

*5* Things The Anti BOA Crowd Don't Seem To Realize:

11/16/2013 11:03 PMPosted by LazyNCrazy
The funny thing is you will be in the same position as now except instead of not finding anything, you will keep finding good stuff but the irony is you will have to discard it.

Nope, I will give it to my alts, give it to my followers. break it down for mats to craft new things. When the point comes I can no longer get decent upgrades, I will run an alt. gear them up. Also im not telling anyone how to play, blizzard is based on feedback and internal discussion about where they think the game should go. The AH/RMAH, 3rd party sites, bots and flippers are a serious issue for them so out they go. The argument keeps coming up that "if you don't want to trade, have self control and don't do it". Problem is people destroyed the market, they didn't have to but they lacked self control and just bought and flipped everything. "if you don't like how the game is, just leave" well how about if you don't like where the game WILL be, leave. All you can do is adapt and play or leave, that's the bottom line for everyone. As ive stated before instead of everyone being so finite in what they say, how about suggest a solution. The game is changing, that's it that's all. So best we can do is find a solution, that would make players happy and still fall within blizzards end game foresight and try to pull them back with a compromise. Otherwise we will go to the extreme side of this because the extreme its at NOW is not working.
I believe they could do a LOT better than they are now, but they will get there. Can we all just cool down, think about where things are and where theyre going and come up with intelligent solutions that MAY be listened to?
Reply Quote
With BoA legendary/set items, self-farming a Zero Zombie Dog Cooldown set would take 13,200 hours of time spent in game grinding monsters.

-- (1/300 chance of finding Visage, SOJ, Skull Grasp, Homunculus, and Mara's with a 1/58 chance on three of those to get the right skill & assuming it takes 15 minutes to find a legendary) --

Something I think you don't seem to realize, Starbird, about BoA is that this will limit build choices to what RNG dictates you can play, not what your own choice says you WANT to play.
Edited by ZzEzZ#1377 on 11/18/2013 12:05 AM PST
Reply Quote
With BoA legendary/set items, self-farming a Zero Zombie Dog Cooldown set would take 13,200 hours of time spent in game grinding monsters.

-- (1/300 chance of finding Visage, SOJ, Skull Grasp, Homunculus, and Mara's with a 1/58 chance on three of those to get the right skill & assuming it takes 15 minutes to find a legendary) --

Something I think you don't seem to realize, Starbird, about BoA is that this will limit build choices to what RNG dictates you can play, not what your own choice says you WANT to play.


+1

By the time you would even find self found a full cain set...you probably would have a few level 60 characters already. Majority of the people who own the full set, had to buy or trade for it. It took me about a year just to get the right SOJ with cold damage, high spirit regen, tempest crit for my monk, even with the auction house. Being unable to trade for that SOJ would make it basically impossible to even find.
Edited by pkthebird#1549 on 11/18/2013 8:54 AM PST
Reply Quote
Posted by Providence
I'm happy with this, BUT I would go a step further and at least say that you can trade with your friends regardless of in game or not.

+1
Trading with people on your friends list. This is a good work-around of bound items. Of course the friend you're trading to would have to have been your friend before you found the item.

This would also fit into the "I want to trade with my brother in Country XYZ halfway across the planet," or "I want to trade with my guildmates in 'Clan XYZ."'


This is exactly the way promote finding items as the main source of upgrading, minimizing or eliminating RMT, AND promoting community.

I would go one step further to limit potential abuses make Legendaries similar to key where you cannot drop them anywhere anytime and restriction your trade window to only operate with individuals on your friend list for 1 month. this would kill third party sites and RMT, while not causing too much "mental bookeeping" for the game (i.e when did this drop vs when I became friends with this individual)
Reply Quote
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
1) Not everything will be BoA.

Just like WoW.
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
2) Rares will still be good.

Just like WoW boe epics. You still have no real interest in them and only the scrubs of the scrubs buy them because it's stupid to buy them when it's so easy to find gear in game.
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
3) You can still trade with your friends in the same game.

Just like WoW.
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
4) Account selling and botting won't become *that* widely spread.

Just like WoW.
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
5) Trading does affect others.

Only in competitive games...like WoW

Fact is. I'll just play WoW if I want a game where it's purely a solo and coop experience. It's got 1000x more content and replayability than D3 will ever have.

D3 is nothing more than mini-wow, going after the wow dropouts and poor people. Although I hope they have fun paying that monthly fee in the form of essentially required DRM which you know has to be coming.
Reply Quote
11/16/2013 08:27 PMPosted by Socs
Then get ready for the end of Diablo, because BOA is NOT Diablo and never will be. ROS will fail worse than anyone can imagine if BOA legendaries goes live. The majority of the current players left and pretty much everyone considering playing ROS will not play with BOA legendaries. BOA is just one more reason to completely give up on Diablo 3. Blizzard might as well kiss all their credentials goodbye with such a blunder. Oh well, at least they still have Starcraft.


The players that will quit, will be the same players that have been complaining about D3 since it came out. The other players that actually love D3 despite a few minor flaws will stay. This player base is actually happy and excited for RoS to come.


There is more people logged into Diablo 2 than there is on Diablo 3. You're MASSIVELY in the minority here. They removed the player count from the menu because from a marketing standpoint, they don't want people to know that there are only ~5000 people logged into Diablo 3.
Edited by Smash#1878 on 11/18/2013 11:00 AM PST
Reply Quote
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
. I am pro-BoA


well then you never played diablo 2
so frankly..your opinion is without weight

please keep wow game play in wow

thank you
Reply Quote
11/16/2013 08:33 AMPosted by Starbird
Trading will give a massive advantage, and thus for anyone wanting to play the game 'right'


Maybe i've missed something here. Exactly what is the "right" way to play and who is DICTATING this method on me?
Reply Quote
Posted by Starbird
Trading will give a massive advantage, and thus for anyone wanting to play the game 'right'


You need to kill stuff in order to get items which enable you to trade... You don't just hop online and start the trading wars... People are so lost, its not even funny.
Reply Quote
[quote="105856861169"]

Thing is, as I've said in another thread...probably the most common 'goal' in D3 is to have a Powerful Character. And in games like this, power is relative. Trading will give a massive advantage, and thus for anyone wanting to play the game 'right'...there would be a serious incentive to trade.

[quote]

First of all, there is one major 'misconception' you and people like you have. Don't give me this "you can trade rares and blues" bullcrap. I won't even discuss blues as some people make it a point that they can be traded. But rares, they will not be any good in late game and no one will want them. Upon release and for a good chunk of time, good rolled rares will have some value, but 6 months to a year from release, they will be worthless and that argument is pathetic. Whoopie, I can trade trash.

But my main point. Who the hell are you to say not trading and playing self found is "the right way"? Is sad how entitled and arrogant these "self found" people are. Apparently they never played D2 competitively or had nothing. Trading is and was a huge part of all games like this. PoE, D2, TL 1/2, etc etc. They ALL have trading. Why does D3 all of a sudden need to be even more like WoW? If you want bound items that you feel you earned by farming for hours, go play world of warcraft, seriously. That's the game for you and people like you. Leave Diablo for us old schoolers
Edited by HaXiR#1854 on 11/18/2013 11:23 AM PST
Reply Quote
11/18/2013 11:03 AMPosted by dewey
. I am pro-BoA


well then you never played diablo 2
so frankly..your opinion is without weight

please keep wow game play in wow

thank you


Nope. Longtime D2 Veteran and Modder. Almost never traded. Never felt the need.

11/18/2013 11:03 AMPosted by QED
Trading will give a massive advantage, and thus for anyone wanting to play the game 'right'


Maybe i've missed something here. Exactly what is the "right" way to play and who is DICTATING this method on me?


The people who make the game?

11/18/2013 11:05 AMPosted by Smash
Posted by Starbird
Trading will give a massive advantage, and thus for anyone wanting to play the game 'right'


You need to kill stuff in order to get items which enable you to trade... You don't just hop online and start the trading wars... People are so lost, its not even funny.


Actually, you can do exactly that since black market sites will rule the roost in any freetrade games. Just hop online, swipe the credit card, buy your ubercharacter and start farming the highest difficulty for the best loot to resell.

*This* is the mindset that has killed trading.
Reply Quote
Loots were a private good and everyone has to farm it hard or buy it to gain it.
From what i see ros, loots are now public goods and everyone is entitled no matter how little they work for it. Just like walking over to some store a few blocks away and taking whatever you want without paying and without working HARD for it. This is what BoA/Self-found are asking for because the drop rates HAS TO BE DRASTICALLY INCREASED to allow for that gameplay. Swiping yo card Vs Beg blizz for GFG drops rates handed to them on a silver platter. I find the latter EXTREMELY REPULSIVE.

Of course there are other sites which im aware of. However "Black Market" does not exist but a derogatory term one you made up yourself.
Black Sheeps are the one that do exist and you are one of them, unfortunately. (There's my "link")
Edited by AvantGarde#6595 on 12/4/2013 5:41 PM PST
Reply Quote
1) Only rares/magic will be tradable, no one is going to show off or spend much effort trading for 2nd class rares. If they are decent in a few slots like they are now it will be next to impossible to find someone willing to trade, third party sites will love it though since they only trade in USD making it significantly easier.

2) Rares better not be best in slot or even decent. All that does is give bots, dupers and third party sites a way back in. Not to mention hugely alienates legit player to player trades as it will be next to impossible to trade when your only working with say pants and rings.

3) Lol yeah that's good but it isn't a plus for boa just one less negative

4) Bots will be as rampant as ever if you make rares and crafting mats worth having. If you make rares worthless remove points 1 & 2 if you make them good remove point 4 as it will be just as bad.

5) AH trade affected everyone as drops needed to be adjusted for the excessive availability, without AH there is no reason we can't have higher drop rates like in D2. Trading would of course be optional, maybe not optimal but for sure optional. There are other better ways to deal with item saturation over binding.
Edited by frothylager#1349 on 12/4/2013 5:51 PM PST
Reply Quote
Loots were a private good and everyone has to farm it hard or buy it to gain it.
From what i see ros, loots are now public goods and everyone is entitled no matter how little they work for it. Just like walking over to some store a few blocks away and taking whatever you want without paying and without working HARD for it. This is what BoA/Self-found are asking for because the drop rates HAS TO BE DRASTICALLY increased to allow for that gameplay. Swiping yo card Vs Beg blizz for GFG drops rates handed to them on a silver platter. I find the latter extremely REPULSIVE.

Of course there are other sites which im aware of. However "Black Market" does not exist but a derogatory term one you made up yourself.
Black Sheeps are the one that do exist and you are one of them, unfortunately. (There's my "link")


...what?

I have no idea what you are saying here.

Are you actually comparing BoA in a video game to robbing a store IRL?

I'm not even sure how to respond to this, lol.

That said, the Black Market exists. Right now it even exists alongside the RMAH. Without the RMAH it will control the upper tiers of the game, much like it did in D2.

Plus, BoA, especially after the recent nerfs, does not mean getting showered with BIS goodies. How many people even *with* trading had legit Zod runes in D2?
Reply Quote
I agree with OP's point on PVP.

Once PVP is introduced, BoA might be the only way to stop Pay2Win.
Edited by Logic#1307 on 12/4/2013 5:49 PM PST
Reply Quote
11/16/2013 08:58 AMPosted by Badfish
I have seen all these arguments and their are counter points made on all them in the various. Forum pages. Its not that we dont understand the points you make, We think these things are wrong for a diablo game. Us anti-BOA people are never going to get on board with this system. Blizzard has really caused a big split on this game. Its gonna be like a divorce. BOAers will keep the house (Diablo iii) and the anti BOAers will proabaly go shack up with something in town (new game) LOL.


I agree here 100%.

I have to echo, its not that we don't get it, it's that it's wrong for Diablo and changes the core gamplay of a franchise many of us have loved for 10+ years. In other words, its a deal breaker whereas the other stuff no online, no runes etc can be dealt with.

And again, good choice of words, its a divorce for many of us.

I too would be all for a compromise BoT or BoE or anything that let Diablo keep an economy where things can rise and fall in value.

BoA makes items 2D (it's FLAT)

trading makes them 3D
Reply Quote
12/04/2013 05:43 PMPosted by Starbird
...what?

I have no idea what you are saying here.

Are you actually comparing BoA in a video game to robbing a store IRL?

I'm not even sure how to respond to this, lol.

That said, the Black Market exists. Right now it even exists alongside the RMAH. Without the RMAH it will control the upper tiers of the game, much like it did in D2.

Plus, BoA, especially after the recent nerfs, does not mean getting showered with BIS goodies. How many people even *with* trading had legit Zod runes in D2?


you are full of fallacy. first thing i never said about robbing a store. pfft (I can click "Next" on you. nn waste time)

Second point, self-found/boa don't give a damn about trade and care about their own progression in their lil' pony world, do they? so now they are bothered with other people trading? hmmm makes a lot of sense... NOT LOL.

Third point. DO YOU EVEN D2? lol. How can you compare d2 drop rates and loot system with the upcoming D3 Ros system? lol. invalidated :)

Avoidance to the questions only proves more guilt.
Edited by AvantGarde#6595 on 12/4/2013 6:08 PM PST
Reply Quote
"Rares will still be good" followed by "Trading does affect people...goal is to have a powerful character"

Do you really not see the contradiction here? Or are you just trying to cleverly tell people that if they want to trade they'll just have to suck it up and figure out how trade items that no one will want once loot 2.0 hits?

To really sum this up... if you want to trade, make the CHOICE to be in game at the same time as your friend that's going to find the item you want/need or when you're going to find the item your friend wants/needs. It's a CHOICE you just have to make it. Never mind school schedules, or work schedules, or family schedules, just make the CHOICE. You can't expect people that have found the "right way to play" to make the CHOICE to play in that 'right way' when the CHOICE not to play in that 'right way' exists.
Reply Quote
Actually the #1 thing everyone fails to realize is that non-boa wasn't lucrative enough. A twelve year old can make a third party website to sell D3 items on if he did enough research on google thus making RMAH obsolete resulting in a very butt-hurt blizzard.
Reply Quote
I don't get the whole BoA support thing..

Doesn't it just come down to the tuning of the drops? If there is BoA and a huge breadth of items then ??? The tuning has to be console level silliness.

Can the drops just be tuned such that without BoA players will find something they want OR something they can trade in a decent timeframe. IE the gap now between what you find in some respectable timeframe and what is a really good item is silly and condones bots and third party trade.

Simply narrow the gap by the right amount, remove BoA and increase play options.
Reply Quote

Please report any Code of Conduct violations, including:

Threats of violence. We take these seriously and will alert the proper authorities.

Posts containing personal information about other players. This includes physical addresses, e-mail addresses, phone numbers, and inappropriate photos and/or videos.

Harassing or discriminatory language. This will not be tolerated.

Forums Code of Conduct

Report Post # written by

Reason
Explain (256 characters max)
Submit Cancel

Reported!

[Close]