Diablo® III

I still think Zoltun Kulle was good.

100 Blood Elf Paladin
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Posts: 14,745
Lawful-Evil in the DnD scheme of things. "Lawful" is about goal setting... his goals are for order and security. Peace if you will. "Evil" is about action. He disregards the welfare of those he's trying to protect and wants to master over them.


I'm not an expert on DnD, but wouldn't he be Chaotic Good? My understanding of it is Lawful evil = Evil motives through lawful means. Chaotic Good = Good motives by any means necessary.


He really seemed more of a chaotic neutral. Doing whatever he wanted to do purely for himself.

He wanted the power he could take from the angel and demons, but he didn't want to use that power against the humans. Or at least he said he didn't...
Edited by Ehcks#1375 on 8/29/2012 3:05 PM PDT
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Khule was the only heroic NPC in the game. Even Tyrial didn't come off as heroic. Only Khule cared for humanity.
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None of you clearly got the Napoleon complex he had then? No? The fact he is clearly accused of wanting the power to rule?
Christ if Zoltun was a good guy then so was Ghengis Khan.
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100 Human Paladin
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08/29/2012 02:48 PMPosted by Vaeflare
I think that he, like most characters, would believe that he was the hero of his own story. Whether others view his actions and motivations as good, evil, or somewhere in-between depends entirely on their perspective.


Blues referencing David Copperfield? There might be hope for this company yet...
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90 Night Elf Priest
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08/29/2012 02:48 PMPosted by Vaeflare
I think that he, like most characters, would believe that he was the hero of his own story. Whether others view his actions and motivations as good, evil, or somewhere in-between depends entirely on their perspective.


He had good motives, but got power hungry and had a God complex. But, I liked him. There was something that was built into his personality and the way the actor talked, that made him quite likable and he did tell everyone the truth. You gotta respect that, even if he did be truthful sometimes to meet his own ends.

BTW I really enjoyed the voice actors, Cydea being among the best. Now I can believe she was a madam and lady of the night. Really hoping you continue and finish the story. Adria is still alive and Leah has a strong soul. I know you won't but Cain, needs to come back too.

How about bringing his soul back like you did Zoltun's in a younger body? He was special through out all the Diablo games.
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08/29/2012 03:03 PMPosted by Ehcks


I'm not an expert on DnD, but wouldn't he be Chaotic Good? My understanding of it is Lawful evil = Evil motives through lawful means. Chaotic Good = Good motives by any means necessary.


He really seemed more of a chaotic neutral. Doing whatever he wanted to do purely for himself.

He wanted the power he could take from the angel and demons, but he didn't want to use that power against the humans. Or at least he said he didn't...


ZK is many things, but he is not a lier! Which this story have proven, chaotic good without a doubt.
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Kulle sought to free men from the slavery of angels and demons. He made the hard choice that no one was willing to make.

Now, I doubt his motivations were pure (I'm sure he wanted to take over the reigns), but that's a problem that could have been dealt with at a later point.
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Kulle was by far the most interesting character. What earned him his 'evil' title was the means he went about creating the soulstone. He tortured, murdered, and sacrificed all manner of things to reach his goal. If you take a look around his ruins you can see some of the evidence of it hanging off the sides of the ledges. He simply became obsessed with his creation and chose any means to further his own desires. He also somehow managed to extract all of his blood to power his research and become immortal, which further indicates his mindset and possible descent into madness.

Considering the point that the nephalem were already returning, the motivation for killing Kulle may have been to keep an artifact of immense power out of his corrupt hands. There is no telling what he actually would have done with the stone. He also saw the player character as a threat to his success, so eventually there had to be a conflict of interests.

What is really interesting about the character is how much information you can extrapolate from a few dialogues. There really weren't any other characters in Diablo 3 that were as well developed. Tyrael was probably intended to be the most dynamic character in the story, but his plight in the Fourth Act was poorly realized. In the end, after all his appearances in the cutscenes, Tyrael was still just Tyrael, minus a set of wings. Maghda was also probably intended to have more backstory and display more emotion when she realized she was being betrayed by Belial, but the entire series of events was very cliche.
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08/29/2012 02:48 PMPosted by Vaeflare
I think that he, like most characters, would believe that he was the hero of his own story. Whether others view his actions and motivations as good, evil, or somewhere in-between depends entirely on their perspective.


He was a victim of scripted "HULK SMASH!" on Blizzard's part. If the PC had waited 10 seconds Kulle would have outted Adria and saved the world.
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None of you clearly got the Napoleon complex he had then? No? The fact he is clearly accused of wanting the power to rule?
Christ if Zoltun was a good guy then so was Ghengis Khan.


Zoltun Kulle wasn't short?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napoleon_complex
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08/28/2012 10:07 AMPosted by FalconGK81
I want a bumper sticker that says "Don't blame me, I voted for Kulle"


Kulle idea. I design and print stickers, so I could do that if it isn't against any rules or copyright infringement. Maybe I'll design a prototype and send it to Bliz for approval? It would be great, an inside joke for all D3 players.
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85 Night Elf Warrior
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Posts: 54
Kulle is that moral grey area we call "realistic". That and the wit made him quite entertaining. In my opinion, he was the best character the D3 team created in their story and the only part of the whole plot I actually enjoyed.

(Not to say there weren't a lot of good concepts and ideas, but most were executed...poorly)
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08/29/2012 02:48 PMPosted by Vaeflare
I think that he, like most characters, would believe that he was the hero of his own story. Whether others view his actions and motivations as good, evil, or somewhere in-between depends entirely on their perspective.


He was the hero. He would have ended this entire series and threats of demons by making all mankind naphalem. Our hero was stupid to confront him, he would have trapped Azmodan and Belial within the soulstone and NOT raise Diablo again so that humans would > demons and angels for that matter.

Our hero makes the grand assumption based on nothing whatsoever that he would enslave all of mankind when he specifically said he could have helped humanity rise above demons and angels instead of being pawns in their war. Stupid move by our hero who doesn't even know any Diablo history whatsoever. .

He is pretty much the Robin Hood of Diablo series.
Edited by MasterJay#1651 on 8/29/2012 4:08 PM PDT
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Kulle was obsessed with Power, but so am i leveling up... it's a shame i'm forced to be a paragon of righteousness and can't choose to go renegade with Kulle and defeat heaven & hell a different way.
Edited by SKORPIQN#6911 on 8/29/2012 4:07 PM PDT
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I do hope we will get to see him more in future. I mean dying in Blizzard's dictionary means you are out of the action for like a few years max, only to return with greater power.
Edited by Millennium#2563 on 8/29/2012 4:08 PM PDT
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I don't mind ruling th world with him. So, I can own all the legendaries from the game.
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Killing Kulle 10s after resuscitating him was by far most disappointing part of the story.
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08/29/2012 04:22 PMPosted by regenwurm
Killing Kulle 10s after resuscitating him was by far most disappointing part of the story.

That, and not getting to side with him.
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08/29/2012 02:48 PMPosted by Vaeflare
I think that he, like most characters, would believe that he was the hero of his own story. Whether others view his actions and motivations as good, evil, or somewhere in-between depends entirely on their perspective.


He should have never been killed. It made no sense, and there was no sense of betrayal. Its not even like he kept the stone or anything. If he would have ran off with it or something and you had to chase him down that's one thing, but you rez him then kill him. What a waste of a good character.
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08/29/2012 02:48 PMPosted by Vaeflare
I think that he, like most characters, would believe that he was the hero of his own story. Whether others view his actions and motivations as good, evil, or somewhere in-between depends entirely on their perspective.


Except it is never explained what his actions were. We cannot view "his actions" as anything but how our character interprets them, which is apparently bad but there is absolutely no explanation given for why they are bad.

"Betrayer of Horadrim" yet there isn't a single hint in the entire game as to how exactly he betrayed the Horadrim. He never killed any Horadrim, as far as I know, he simply had different views than them. If that makes him a Betrayer then it raises the question of how well these labels are applied.

It doesn't depend on the perspective, either. The perspective is given by the story telling. If some people think that your character saying "You must be stopped!" makes the character evil then they're simply believing whatever they initially think they should believe regardless of the facts that would back up that belief.

But then someone like myself thinks, "Well, he actually hasn't done anything evil that I can see" is not viewing it in a different perspective, its just looking at the facts that would support my belief. I'm not saying he's good or bad, but from what is presented to us throughout the game there is no way to tell whether he is good or bad, but then he is dismissed as an "evil" character (which is just bad story telling).

It should be evident that the character is evil, we shouldn't have to simply assume he is because he has a raspy voice and laughs a lot... that just supports poorly constructed prejudices. Why isn't the Demon Hunter evil? He certainly sounds evil. From what we know, he's just as evil as Zoltun Kulle.

Bad story telling is bad story telling. It has nothing to do with "perspective".
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