Diablo® III

KEY drops should NOT

Also, what exactly is the point you're trying to make Axe?
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I don't understand this attitude. Drop rates would be fine if max was 20% but since max is 100% but you might only be able to play at 10% or 20%, then it's unfair? What do I care if someone gets the ring in 1/10 the time I do?


I for my part don't care either. The only thing I hate about all this uber stuff is, keys drop with a CHANCE and require 5 stacks, organs drop with a CHANCE and then there are 4 random properties on that damn ring. That means I will have a chance to get a chance to craft a ring with a small chance not to be total crap.
I don't mind randomness in a game like Diablo because this game has always been about randomness, but the only randomness you find in this game is in random properties on legendaries instead of environment (outdoor always looks the same) or events like promised.
The ring in a whole is just way too random and considering the 4 random properties, the keys should drop at a fixed (not 100%) droprate on all MP levels and independent from NV, organs should drop for 100%, but let the ubers drop other stuff aswell so that mf bonus from higher monster power levels has an effect, and let them a LOT of items, not just like any other ordinary boss or pack.


I agree it could be frustrating to farm. I don't intend to farm it. I intend to farm the Acts where the keys can be found and kill the keywardens every fun. Once I get enough to make a machine, I'll go do that and rinse/repeat. I don't know how long it will take, but I'm going to make it a supplement to my farming... not the focus.
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Are you saying that unless you have five stacks of NV keywardens will not ever drop keys?


Yup. (Or, at least that's how it's designed to work. If players are getting keys without the five stack, then that's likely a bug.)


"WC: You can get item level 63 stuff in all acts of Inferno when Monster Power is on. The moment you go into Inferno with any kind of Monster Power, all monsters become level 63, and they can now all drop item level 63 stuff the same way that Act III and Act IV Inferno do now. However, cranking up Monster Power beyond MP1 does not further increase your chance of getting 63 stuff."

What is this then? Why do I have to be super geared to get drops? I don't want to waste 10 times as much time because I have to do everything on monster power 1.
Edited by Demo#1341 on 9/26/2012 2:17 PM PDT
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Yup. (Or, at least that's how it's designed to work. If players are getting keys without the five stack, then that's likely a bug.)


"WC: You can get item level 63 stuff in all acts of Inferno when Monster Power is on. The moment you go into Inferno with any kind of Monster Power, all monsters become level 63, and they can now all drop item level 63 stuff the same way that Act III and Act IV Inferno do now. However, cranking up Monster Power beyond MP1 does not further increase your chance of getting 63 stuff."

You guys are getting really good at lying.


He's talking about the distribution of your drops that are ilvl63. If 20% of drops are 63 at MP1, 20% will be 63 at MP10.
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if someone kill the act3 warden on mp10, he deserves a 100% key drop. that guy is like the hardest of all. i roflstomped through act3 and he managed to kill me :D but it was fun, i liked that.
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going by most people in this thread's suggested changes, we will all have a hellfire ring within a week of the patch dropping.

Make the organs 100% drop, take away the mp scaling of difficulty for the uber bosses and then make them REALLY HARD.


Ahem, I got mine in an hour and a half, running with 4 people. MP7 for the keys, and MP10 for the organs. The hardest part? Keeping our NV stack during SK and Mahgda, which took us literally 22 minutes.

We need difficulty in the way of mechanics, not pumped up damage and health.

Do things that counter current builds to make it interesting.
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09/26/2012 02:13 PMPosted by ShadowStarr5
Also, what exactly is the point you're trying to make Axe?


Seriously, you can NOT read? ok ill make it real simple

1)Keys should NEVER be 100% droprate for ANYONE
2)Keys should be tradeable
3)Organs should ALWAYS be 100% droprate
4)Organs should be tradeable
5)Ring reward SHOULD be tradeable, and personally received UNID

does that help you SIR?
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"WC: You can get item level 63 stuff in all acts of Inferno when Monster Power is on. The moment you go into Inferno with any kind of Monster Power, all monsters become level 63, and they can now all drop item level 63 stuff the same way that Act III and Act IV Inferno do now. However, cranking up Monster Power beyond MP1 does not further increase your chance of getting 63 stuff."

You guys are getting really good at lying.


He's talking about the distribution of your drops that are ilvl63. If 20% of drops are 63 at MP1, 20% will be 63 at MP10.


I have one question for you then, what ilvl are the keys? Last time I checked, they are ilvl 63. If MP doesn't affect the chance of ilvl 63 dropping, then why does it affect organs and keys?

Checked, they are ilvl63.

Checkmate.
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09/26/2012 12:40 PMPosted by Lylirra
Are you saying that unless you have five stacks of NV keywardens will not ever drop keys?


Yup. (Or, at least that's how it's designed to work. If players are getting keys without the five stack, then that's likely a bug.)


Earlier this afternoon, I had a key drop from the Act III Warden while running the very beginning of Act III (Siege of Bastion's keep/Turning the Tide) before I had built 5 stacks. I could accept that this is a bug BUT . . based on where I found him in the Act, there is a zero percent chance that I could've built 5 stacks -- there is just no chance for that many elite packs to be placed based on where he was so early in the Act clear.

So . . . I'm allright with it taking 5 stacks but we better be very thoughtful about potential spawn locations of Wardens if that is going to be a requirement. They need to be placed later in the Acts where you have a chance to kill 5 packs before you see them.

EDIT: I am aware if you loaded a later quest and played that Act out of order, you obviously could get 5 stacks -- that just seems counter-intuitive and against playing the Act sequentially.
Edited by Emberos#1608 on 9/26/2012 3:01 PM PDT
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Furthermore, none of the implemented randomness contributes to motivation in any way. Motivation can be broken down to:

Motivation = Chance of success * Value of the reward

But the only thing the lower chance of key AND organ drops is doing, is lowering the first parameter of this formula, leading to a lower motivation (which is already low because of the 4 random properties which makes it impossible to have high hopes while crafting the ring) for players being forced to play on lower MP levels. In contrary to that, better equipped players tend to be more motivated in comparison since the chance of success is higher.
This then is in conflict with Blizzards idea to make MP totally optional since it is a mandatory part of motivation.


I have one question for you then, what ilvl are the keys? Last time I checked, they are ilvl 63. If MP doesn't affect the chance of ilvl 63 dropping, then why does it affect organs and keys?

Checked, they are ilvl63.

Checkmate.


You don't understand this. Special items like keys or organs seem to have other loot rules. Compare this to, for example, the gibbering gemstone, which also drops at a fixed rate and as I experienced, independent from ilvl 63/62/61 distribution in act 3.
Edited by Efrye#2102 on 9/26/2012 2:33 PM PDT
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We need difficulty in the way of mechanics, not pumped up damage and health.

Do things that counter current builds to make it interesting.


09/26/2012 02:22 PMPosted by Demo
We need difficulty in the way of mechanics, not pumped up damage and health.


You sir deserve 10 Internets

*Hands Demo 10 Internets*
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09/26/2012 12:02 PMPosted by Lylirra
Did know ML affected this. Source?


Currently, both the keys and the demonic organ pieces (Vengeful Eye, Devil's Fang, and Writhing Spine) have higher chances to drop in higher MP levels, all the way up to 100% in MP10.

I don't want to weigh in on the current argument of whether or not drop chances should be affected by Monster Power level just yet. Obviously, we think it's a good idea and worth trying out, but if you feel differently, then I'd definitely like for you to continue discussing your thoughts on that topic. If you don't like it, tell us why. (Or, if you DO like it, be sure to weigh in too.)

09/25/2012 02:38 PMPosted by Horus
I killed the act 3 keywarden on MP 10 once and the key didn't drop. (didn't have any NV stack though)


You'll need five stacks of NV in order for the keys and the demonic organ pieces to drop.

We felt this was a reasonable requirement, otherwise players could simply farm the keys in a lower MP, then set their game to MP10 and farm bosses for guaranteed drops. With the five stack, players will at least need to be able to kill monsters in that MP level in order to benefit from the increased organ drop chance.


I think what you meant to say was it's designed to be a nice little thank you to the people who pumped you full of RMAH transaction fee profits as they bought themselves into a 300,000,000g item set.

But hey, this will be nothing compared to when the PvP patch hits, then the RMAH will really help put the favour into those who use it.
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09/26/2012 02:23 PMPosted by Axe
Also, what exactly is the point you're trying to make Axe?


Seriously, you can NOT read? ok ill make it real simple

1)Keys should NEVER be 100% droprate for ANYONE
2)Keys should be tradeable
3)Organs should ALWAYS be 100% droprate
4)Organs should be tradeable
5)Ring reward SHOULD be tradeable, and personally received UNID

does that help you SIR?


*Puts down smoke pipe*

You, sirrah, need to learn manners. I ask a simple question and you insult me. Downright rude you people are. =.=*

I agree with #s 1 & 3.
I do not assent to #s 2, 4, and 5

My ideals still align with Demo,MasterJay, and Ztking

*Picks pipe back up*

~Regards
A Rampant AI~
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Also, if you want to make it so it's not guaranteed at lower MP, give us something else that makes us even want to do it, no one wants to run something 3 times and not get a key....

Perhaps key "Shards" will drop at lower levels, still having a chance to get a key and you can combine "Shards" into keys, 5 shards being a key.

1 - 1 Shard - 10% Chance at a key.
2 - 1 Shard - 20% Chance at a key.
3 - 2 Shards - 30% Chance at a key.
4 - 2 Shards - 40% Chance at a key.
5 - 3 Shards - 50% Chance at a key.
6 - 3 Shards - 60% Chance at a key.
7 - 4 Shards - 70% Chance at a key.
8 - 4 Shards - 80% Chance at a key.
9 - 4 Shards - 90% Chance at a key.
10 - 0 Shards - 100% Chance for a key.
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I honestly think the keys should not even drop on anything lower than 8, and I think think sharing drop tables on mp1 is a bit to easy.. mp4-5 should begin to share the drop table imo.

either that or mp1-5 ilvl63 items should never roll more than the minimum possible affixs(ie3-4) majority of the time.
Edited by BelowZero#1346 on 9/26/2012 2:43 PM PDT
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You don't understand this. Special items like keys or organs seem to have other loot rules. Compare this to, for example, the gibbering gemstone, which also drops at a fixed rate and as I experienced, independent from ilvl 63/62/61 distribution in act 3.


One drops at a fixed rate... the other is dependent on MP. What is your argument again?
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Actually, I had an idea.

Perhaps in the next patch or so( 1.0.6 or later) the Devs could add new mechanics per Monster Level.

Say, around MP 3 or MP 5 monsters begin to have new types of affixes or even just more affixes, and Mobs from different Acts can spawn in.
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You don't understand this. Special items like keys or organs seem to have other loot rules. Compare this to, for example, the gibbering gemstone, which also drops at a fixed rate and as I experienced, independent from ilvl 63/62/61 distribution in act 3.


One drops at a fixed rate... the other is dependent on MP. What is your argument again?


It still is a fixed rate, one for each MP level. But the drop rate has NOTHING to do with its ilvl, like you suggested.
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Because mp 10 going to be farmed all day long on HC lol.

Always the way, lets balance the game around sc.
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