Diablo® III

AH/RMAH is a good thing

Posts: 12
So many people bash the RMAH and Gold AH. Personally, I think its one of the best ideas blizzard had for D3.

Think about back in D2. How did you go about getting the best gear then? You either went to sites like D2JSP.org or any other numerous retail sites where your paid REAL MONEY for the items you wanted. Only difference is back then it was risky and you could EASILY get scammed
of your money. Blizzard has provided a safe and secure means of attaining that awesome gear that you would otherwise never have in this game.

Some of you argue that you shouldn't have to buy your way to a great geared hero. And for the average player that just enjoys questing and farming you don't have to. However, if you are a serious dueler then you know that having the best gear makes all the difference. With the loot system the way it is and has always been (even in D2) either saving up gold or using real money would be the primary means of getting the gear you need.
Edited by Legend#1155 on 1/19/2013 5:38 AM PST
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I agree with you mate, having the RMAH/ GAH there, Just gives players options, as they develop more things to do in the game, and make those finer touches to the classes, this game will become one of the best games ever.
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90 Pandaren Monk
10355
Posts: 12,241
Think about back in D2. How did you go about getting the best gear then?

I farmed my gear. And I felt rewarded for doing so in a relatively short amount of time compared to D3.

01/19/2013 05:35 AMPosted by aaronius
You either went to sites like D2JSP.org or any other numerous retail sites where your paid REAL MONEY for the items you wanted.

Nope! And neither did many others. Yes, there were a lot that did. But there was just as many, if not more, that did not.

01/19/2013 05:35 AMPosted by aaronius
With the loot system the way it is and has always been (even in D2)

You clearly didn't play D2...
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I didnt know anyone who used those website.. they were far to sketchy.. so many people just got their gear from grinding. Blizzard only tells you many people did this as an excuse to implement theirs
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"here take 5$"

Blizzard.
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The AH/RMAH is a great idea. I just wish they would raise the caps so less items are traded outside of them.
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JSP was pretty much the GAH in D2. Retail 3rd party sites like D2Legit were the RMAH. Casual players could do just fine trading in game.
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AH sucks because it is mandatory. You cannot just opt-out of it because otherwise you won't progress through Inferno.

Devs' original intention was that Inferno difficulty level is meant to be beaten after MONTHS of farming, AH changed that... for a price. Literally :D

It is like in classic pay-to-progress games - very popular on smartphones - where at first it seems easy to progress, but in the end the player is forced to buy upgrades. It is the same in D3, except you can save $$$ by playing AH flipping and such.
Edited by Scharnvirk#2371 on 1/19/2013 6:51 AM PST
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96 Human Paladin
9510
Posts: 643
No pay to win is dumb. Are some people always going to find a way to do it? Sure but for Blizzard to enable it, endorse it and make it as casual as the rmah is that is a massive fail in every way.

Most people never did it with D2 just min maxers and even then it was mostly only done with extremely good gear. In D3 even mediocre gear ends up in the rmah for like $2. It was a short sited cash grab that alongside the terrible itemization has ruined the loot hunt.
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Speak for yourself.
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Eh... pay to win is dumb?... if u dont know how use ur character... anyway u gonna lose...

Some people work and cant farm so hard... so they people must not play with good items?...

I like Ah and RMAH... we can get easy nice items...

The problem here is the diference between PVM and PVP players... the pvp players wont farm 190238901238 hours to get a normal weapon... because they want PVP... however... the pvm player want farm 1 million hours because they like kill creeps...

As said aaroins, the AH/RMAH is a good option for peoples that havnt time to lose farming... if u havnt items farm or pvp is boring... (hav low dmg, low rest.. etc is annoying).
If they have money, because the work..., why they cant hav a good gear..
Edited by Nyuu#1788 on 1/19/2013 7:18 AM PST
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01/19/2013 05:35 AMPosted by aaronius
So many people bash the RMAH and Gold AH. Personally, I think its one of the best ideas blizzard had for D3.


I agree, looking at the original release of diablo 3, I'd say that the RMAH is one of the best ideas blizzard had.

I mean, lets look at the other ideas that blizzard had that the RMAH beats out on.

Releasing the game without testing inferno, after doubling it.
Itemization
Monster affixes, invulnerable mobs
Ilevel drops in relation to the difficulty ~ To those who weren't around from the start A1 inferno drops were useless, A2 drops were a bit better but the mobs were very hard to kill, *lol invisible snakes that one shot you. A3 drops were basically what you needed to beat A3, I hope the problem is obvious here and so on.
The restrictions on what Ilevel 61/62 could roll, which made every single ilevel 61/62 weapons instantenously useless.

So yes, out of the mass of bad ideas blizzard had, I think one could arguably claim that the RMAH is one of the best ideas they've had. However, that isn't saying much.

Also, if you had to buy items in d2, it's no wonder why you would think the RMAH is a good idea. However, you did not have to buy items in d2. The drop rate in that game, along with the difficulty of, was friendly enough that if you were willing to spend a fraction of the time that has to be spent in d3, you'd get all your gear.
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it not good that u needed it. b4 game got ez 1.0.3 on and low MP system on. no one could even come close to beating game w/o AH. It's doubtful even back in 1.0.3 1.0.4 you could with found gear cos it sucked so bad and was inapplicable to your toon. naw we need to ah to get top 1% gear that was found. prolly higher actually maybe top .001% based on thousands of things i've found only very few are useful to someone.

itemization was made to suck cos AH. game difficulty and nerfs is tweaked around AH and poor itemization.

Now game is far too ez that i have used AH.
Edited by Aimless#1700 on 1/19/2013 8:28 AM PST
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01/19/2013 05:35 AMPosted by aaronius
With the loot system the way it is and has always been (even in D2) either saving up gold or using real money would be the primary means of getting the gear you need.


rofl... D2 loot was not even close as how bad D3 loot is

yea i agree AH has some positive parts

but the most negative side is that it affects the loot quality
so that why we have legendaries with random properties that only 0.001% of them are BIS

and is easy why that happen:

In D2 trading was done by advertising what u want to sell in game title and trade chat which lead to: a item was available to everyone as long as the owner is online and willing to spend time trading it
This allowed for less RNG depended legendaries (uniques) no random properties only random stats whitin a given range

In D3 trading is done via AH which allow player to sell 10 items at once and trading contiune even if player log off
This mean if the D2 item system (droprates and quality) were kept the economy would crash in 1 month or less due to supra-saturation

To compensate for that the item system needed change by either reducing droprates or by reducing quality rates
they chosed to increase droprates compared to D2 and again in 1.04 but further reduce the quality rates

i think they went to far on reducing quality rates - don't believe me? Then answer this: How many perfectly rolled legendaries with the right properties exist? and no i'm not talking about BIS items i'm talking about perfectly rolled BIS items
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Posts: 333
I definitely do not agree, I think the gold auction house is deeply flawed system... let me take a moment to explain why I think that, and what might be done to fix it and ultimately make the game much more fun to play.

If you use it, the mere presence of the gold auction house completely breaks the gaming experience of playing from level 1-60. If I didn't know any better, I would think its use was an exploit. Just saying that a player could ignore it is simply not an answer, because most gamers of Diablo-style games strive to figure out how to be the best they can while playing... that's part of what gearing up in games like Diablo have always been about, and that's where a lot of the joy was derived. In the case of Diablo 3, unfortunately, the player who knew the auction house was there also knew that it was just a click away to get something better. The joy of finding something neat is not just reduced, but completely eliminated for most of the game. When a level 20 character can spend a fraction of the gold they have to get something that blows everything they'll find in the entire next two acts out of the water, something is fundamentally wrong.

Now how do we fix that? On paper, the gold auction house in particular may have been seen as a decent idea. It uses the in-game currency as an in-between in order to artificially make it more valuable (and not practically worthless like gold was in D2). It makes 'trades' easier by letting people bid on the items without worrying about the specifics of what is being offered. However, taking that approach to fix a relatively minor problem just basically broke the game, as described above. Traditional trading with a player allows for an item's relative value to be compared, and you get many more interesting trading scenarios as a result. This also means that it's more difficult for a player at level 20 to get top-notch level 20 gear. Paradoxically, this makes it more fun, but that's basic game design. I am aware it's still possible to get the 'best' if you have a higher-level alt or friend, or just some benevolent passerby - but all of those scenarios are also much more satisfying and fulfilling than using the auction house.

This may mean that the game needs an essentially worthless in-game currency like there was in D2, at least with respect to how its value is determined between players (or it should not be what is exchanged in trade). Its utility should be limited to in-game shops and services... this is the only way that a calculated balance between what is gained in the game and what is spent can be maintained. This sounds limiting, but it's part of basic game design and it's part of what makes it more fun to play. Only people who like to min/max auction house trades could really enjoy running around with 10 billion gold... and that's certainly not what the game should be designed to cater to, but you have to take a step back and realize that is exactly what is going on today, that's essentially what the end-game goal in Diablo 3 today is.

Fixing this involves eliminating the gold-based auction system. You may possibly replace it with a market section accessible in-game in each town to see online players who are trading (anyone who is playing, you can check what they have tagged for trade anywhere) and search what they're offering without all the spam. With some thought this system could be vastly superior to, and more enjoyable than, the auction house... plus, it doesn't break the game.

I do personally think there are other design problems with the game, but I won't enumerate them all here. One step at a time... and this is a pretty huge step (and, I believe, a necessary one... because fixing this is a prerequisite to fixing some of the other problems like replayability and character specializations/diversity).
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