02/11/2013 03:35 PM
Posted by Druin
I just don't see how any of those are viable given the small benefit they provide and the enormous cost to use them.
That is the point that every dev ever has been trying to make when talking about this.
I think you get it!
Now just sit back and relax while they (hopefully) GREATLY reduce the required 1b pricetag on dropping OWE and you can make a choice that makes sense instead of one that is made for you!
Unless they change how the game works - not just change how OwE works or how single resists work - nothing is going to reduce that pricetag. All Resist gear is ridiculously expensive because it's basically necessary for almost everyone. I cannot conceive what they would change that would reduce the amount of resist required.
Point is, making blanket statements like gearing out of OWE is a billion gold investment, well thats just not true. It depends where you are in gearing. The earlier you make the transition and rip the OWE band-aid off, the better you'll be in the long run. Especially if they ever do change or make additions to our passives.
Well of course the price depends on what your current level of gear was. That's why I used myself as an example, because I've looked through the AH and planned how much I would need. 1 billion wasn't a made up number, it was a (admittedly quickly) researched number.
I'm not sure that I agree with your statement about being better in the long run by dumping OwE. I will only be better off in the long run if they change some of the other passives.
gotaplanstan, I the problem with OWE isn't that you can't gear out of it. It's that at almost every budget, you can make a more effective Monk if you take the passive than without it.
Completely agree with this.
Its fine if you want to save money by using it, I'm not arguing that point. But that literally IS the only point FOR taking OWE. The reason I say that, is because of the dps opportunity cost in wasting a 2nd affix for double stacking.
People keep saying this, but it is simply NOT TRUE.
Or, I guess, in most
cases, it's not true. If you geared oddly, then it might be true.
Let's start off looking at my gear, as an example. Where have I double stacked resists? On my shoulders, boots, and bracers. So if I dropped the stacked resists there, what other DPS rolls could I pick up? Well, on bracers, probably not anything else; maybe I could find a pair with a higher vit roll, but given that my bracers have a non-ideal Str roll already, I could have higher vit with my current ones (just couldn't afford them). Looking in the AH right now, there are only 2 pages (second is not full) of bracers with 150+ dex, 70+ vit, 5.5+ cc, and 50+ AR. The cheapest is 50 million. The cheapest with a noticeably higher vit roll is 150 million, though, amusingly enough, it also has a double stacked resist!
Ok so shoulders - obviously I would want a higher dex/vit roll and/or Life%. Boots the answer is clear - higher dex roll and vit.
So if I drop OwE, I can gain dex and vit on those spots ... but what's stopping me from doing that RIGHT now? Nothing. Absolutely nothing. If I lost the 150 resist from those three spots, I'd be at 500, which is around what most people have said is the min amount you need sans OwE.
So if I could stand to do that right now, while I still have OwE ... what am I actually gaining from dropping it? Nothing.
Let's look at someone else's profile - Demi's.
Demi has double stacked resist on his shoulders, bracers, boots, and belt.
We've covered bracers above in my example. A second resist there isn't stopping you from getting high dex and high vit rolls.
What about his belt? He's got str and int rolls on his belt, so it's not really the Poison roll that's holding the dex/vit back. This is similar to the bracers, except you don't even need CC here so plenty of affixes to spare.
His boots are basically the same situation as mine.
His shoulders actually already have a high dex roll, but he has no vit on them. He could gain it there. Then again, they also have a non-ideal str roll on them.
His gear is in a similar spot as mine - he's not really going to gain that
much extra damage by dropping OwE.
Using Piffle's profile as my case study (I hope you don't mind, Piffle)... considering that the max roll of elemental resists is 60, and often times, you are finding stuff at 40-45. Maybe 50 depending on where. Now also consider that the max roll on AR is 80, so you are aiming to get something >70. Instead of 4 pieces with elemental resist, you can get 3 pieces with AR to keep the same mitigation instead try to get something that will get you either MORE DPS or more EHP.
Of course not!
Realize, of course, that I have three
"wasted" affix slots taken up by a second affix. Three. That's it.
So we're talking about three extra rolls of dex, vit, or life% for the cost of swapping away from OwE.
One thing to remember though, is that while it is true that AR rolls up to 80 ... it's not like it's easy to find pieces like that. For example, there are just 7 witching hours in the AH right now with dex, vit, and 70+ AR. There are just 11 Nat's Reflections in the AH right now with vit and 70+ AR and none of them have a second damage affix (well, one has +34 dmg but that's pretty meh). If you drop the vit roll, and add 35+ dmg, there are just 5 with xx-xx damage, and 2 of those have a wasted roll with a secondary resist and one has gold find! So for an extra 14-24 resist, I would lose 39 vit. Looking at amulets with 70+ ar, dex, 35+ avg dmg, cc, and cd, there are just 4 options available. Except only one of them has over 8% crit chance and it doesn't have vitality, and it's 700 million gold. Trading 102 vit for 31 resist? Meh. Ok so removing the min value for AR and avg dmg, added 9+ CC, and added vitality back in for my amulet ... and there are now 3 options. Only 1 has xx-xx dmg and it has just 51 AR and 63 vit ... and is 700 million.
It's hard enough to regear from OwE simply because of cost. But then when you add in the fact that the pieces you need are exceptionally hard to find ... ugh.
Looking at my gear and knowing that I have no control over how hellfire rings roll, I have 10 slots that I can plan to have AR on. So if I am for 650 resist, my current level, I need to average 65 a slot. Except that it's far better to have Vit on your Inna's pants than AR, so now I only have 9 slots and I now need to average 72 AR. And that's only if I also get a new chest piece too.
And all of that ... to get three more rolls of dex/vit?