Diablo® III

Emotions, outrage! You're embarrassing yourselves.

I always love it when a disagreement boils down to "Stop liking things I don't like! If you like those things I don't like, you're dumb!"
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People questioned whether the PC and console versions were developed in tandem, thus impacting the overall game design. A CM responded saying that this, in fact, was not the case. People then proceeded to tell the CM to stuff it and that they were rejecting reality and substituting their own. Well played!



The CM only denied that Diablo 3 was developed with console in mind from the beginning. The possibility still remains that somewhere in the middle of development, they decided to include consoles and changed their development because of it. There is no rejection of reality going on, just different interpretations of the CM's carefully worded response.

The topic of dumbing down can't really be argued, as what is considered "dumbed down" is highly subjective and we could sit here going back and forth listing off examples that one person may say is a "dumbed down" game and another may say isn't. There is no argument to be had there, but that doesn't mean you are necessarily correct in believing they don't cause a "dumbing down" of PC games.

Finally, you complain about emotions and outrage of people, yet your post seems highly emotional and makes it seem like you are filled with outrage. In addition, you claim people should stop looking down on others for their preferences, yet your entire post comes off as extremely condescending purely because you believe things that are contrary to what others believe.


"yet your entire post comes off as extremely"

Isn't it your opinion that his post is filled with emotion and outrage? Nevermind I'll stop...
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People questioned whether the PC and console versions were developed in tandem, thus impacting the overall game design. A CM responded saying that this, in fact, was not the case. People then proceeded to tell the CM to stuff it and that they were rejecting reality and substituting their own. Well played!



The CM only denied that Diablo 3 was developed with console in mind from the beginning. The possibility still remains that somewhere in the middle of development, they decided to include consoles and changed their development because of it. There is no rejection of reality going on, just different interpretations of the CM's carefully worded response.

The topic of dumbing down can't really be argued, as what is considered "dumbed down" is highly subjective and we could sit here going back and forth listing off examples that one person may say is a "dumbed down" game and another may say isn't. There is no argument to be had there, but that doesn't mean you are necessarily correct in believing they don't cause a "dumbing down" of PC games.

Finally, you complain about emotions and outrage of people, yet your post seems highly emotional and makes it seem like you are filled with outrage. In addition, you claim people should stop looking down on others for their preferences, yet your entire post comes off as extremely condescending purely because you believe things that are contrary to what others believe.


We'll have to agree to disagree on the CM post.

You're right that, because of the subjectivity involved in the PC vs Console war, it's really not a productive conversation to have.

I cannot deny that I'm rather fed up with a lot of the trash I see on these forums. I'm sorry if you feel like I'm being condescending, but I said some things I thought needed to be said. I don't think people realize what they're doing when they post their gut reactions on this forum.

I claim that people should stop looking down on each other for their preferences - yes. I reserve the right to look down on those who make a fool out of themselves in a public forum as I outlined in my initial post.
Edited by Deaded#1753 on 2/26/2013 12:09 PM PST
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02/26/2013 10:51 AMPosted by Deaded
you all are embarrassing yourselves.


Your anonymous, im anonymous.

This is the internet are you new?
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02/26/2013 12:14 PMPosted by captured
you all are embarrassing yourselves.


Your anonymous, im anonymous.

This is the internet are you new?


*You're

... and what's your point?
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... and what's your point?


Just to venture a guess- I think he doubts the validity of your assertion that anyone in an anonymous setting is being embarrassed by their posts.
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02/26/2013 12:40 PMPosted by Vyleblud
... and what's your point?


Just to venture a guess- I think he doubts the validity of your assertion that anyone in an anonymous setting is being embarrassed by their posts.


Le sigh.

You're probably right.
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OP is either a troll, an ignorance, or just a person who simply can't read/follow what others state in their sneaky writings.
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02/26/2013 12:53 PMPosted by MisterAjikko
OP is either a troll, an ignorance, or just a person who simply can't read/follow what others state in their sneaky writings.


Haha... What?!

This is awesome! What's an "ignorance"?
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You just ignored those posts in the other two threads that are worth to read while picking up those that don't sound right to you and start talking sht about them.
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02/26/2013 01:02 PMPosted by MisterAjikko
You just ignored those posts in the other two threads that are worth to read while picking up those that don't sound right to you and start talking sht about them.


There might have been a decent post or two buried in the 20-something pages of verbal diarrhea, but I didn't find them.
Edited by Deaded#1753 on 2/26/2013 1:12 PM PST
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Firstly, I would just like to say I absolutely agree with the parts about appropriate arguments (and structure) AND your pro-tip.

However, I do disagree with your assertion that there aren't appropriate reasons for console games being dumbed down. I think you may be slightly biased in favor of consoles, because there are a few practical/technical reasons that should instantly spring to mind when considering this.

There are indications of this already in the port process with the required GUI, hud and menu simplifications. This has to do with the control scheme differences between consoles and PC, because a PC interface can have 50 different buttons on-screen and with the mouse you can select your choice fast and easy regardless.

On a console, this process becomes tedious and has to be changed, because designers don't want their users scrolling 50 times to the left and then 30 to the right.

The amount of hotkeys present. One of the biggest differences between games made for PC and one ported onto PC is the clunkiness of motion, and very often the latter games will include systems such as "RUN+BACK to do a QUICKTURN" with some wonky animation to make up for the inconvenience of turning around, or performing other maneuvers that would be doable with a mouse, but otherwise difficult on a pad.

For instance, if you play a shooter with weapons from number 1-9, you will never be able to go to #7 from #1 as fast, in the heat of battle, on a console as on PC. And, designers will generally not make you scroll through a large list before getting to your weapon, so other ways of economizing buttons is invented. Nowadays it's common with the 'press V to do a knife slash' instead of actually selecting the knife and doing it manually, which is an example of economizing certain aspects (at the cost of personal control.)

These are just a few technical/practical reasons I can think of as I'm writing (I have thought about it before, yes!) that has an affect on the differences.

The stereotype that console gamers are stupid/bad comes from a combination of smaller variables than a single, large culprit, I reckon. Such as the above elements. Consoles also haven't been around for as long as PCs, they are far more user-friendly and easy to get the hang of, and so the generations that have grown up with consoles in households have been increasing for the past ~15 years or so. That's besides the point, but logically speaking this dictates that the percentage of youths growing up with a console in their household increases as time passes. They were far scarcer 15 years back when I was younger, and so, the point is that it has a bigger distribution of younger people.

Being young isn't a bad thing in itself, but most kids are, well, kids. I'm not gonna force my opinions on anyone so I think I'll leave this at that.

But the claim games aren't dumbed down is a bit ridiculous. I think the Halo franchise is a perfect example, as it was the flagship game for xbox way back. And that's a very generic FPS stripped of interesting components from either other contemporary tactical or arena-based shooters. No advanced movements, because the physics behind strafejumps, walljumps and the like came from the flicking motion of your mouse, which can't be replicated on a console. Therefore, the significant skill ceiling that was present in a lot of these games simply evaporated.

Console games also have to follow a different visual scheme because unlike PC games, they're not designed for you to sit right up close. Larger, more radiant visual indicators is a common trend. Personally, I'm all for simplicity. I think the most elegant solutions are the ones that solve your problems in the simplest ways possible. However, the simplicity present in consoles comes with the price of limitation.

But yes, these are just a few reasons I can think of that indicates why this stereotype exists.

Ton conclude with my biased, subjective and entirely personal note: this is from my experience growing up with a large amount of console experience and PCs. I heavily favor PC, but my brother, 8 years younger, is a console gamer, along with his friends. They sit on their couch, one leg over the chair, and play their whatever. And that's my view of a console gamer. I see console gamers as couch gamers.
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02/26/2013 01:11 PMPosted by Deaded
There might have been a decent post or two buried in the 20-something pages of verbal diarrhea, but I didn't find them.


You're embarrassing yourselves.
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Posts: 688
Le sigh.

You're probably right.
The absence of accountability makes the internet a great place, doesn't it?

In response to your OP. Many of the arguments are baseless, yes. However, the claim that D3 is simpler than D2 is substantiated by a side by side comparison. Whether or not that is good or bad is subjective, and most certainly opinion.
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i have to admit, i do enjoy watching idiots and little kids argue. when it's based on ill or uninformed opinions, it's even better.
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02/26/2013 01:46 PMPosted by Crazyrage
Since 2010 all they've done is cut things out of the game "claiming they couldn't get it to work."


What about that is a lie? Would you be more upset if the game had features that the present game lacked, yet they were broken, OP, or lame? OPINION TIME: I would.
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90 Orc Death Knight
16645
Posts: 2,851
It's a public forum. Get over it.
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