Diablo® III

Barbarian game balancing

Posts: 143
The Barbarian as a class is in need of some modification with the hammer of the ancients build.
Right now a barbarian with proper gear for the build no longer auto attacks while having 100% crit chance on a 406% weapon damage attack with the attack actually generating fury vs costing fury to cast.

The reasoning for the need of a change to this skill is because the design is not in line with dps compared to any other class regardless of build except for maybe infinite zombie dogs or also know as 0 dogs. The barbarian class with the right amount of gear required for this build breaks the game in the since of game balance. all other classes even with items such as SoJ and Mara's have their largest attack ability sitting either on a cool down or have a fairly expensive cost equaling to 50% of their resource bar. Even with out the additional items to remove/reduce the cost from hammer of the ancients it only costs 1/5 of the fury bar.
None of these part of hammer of the ancients are to powerful alone, but when the attack becomes a fury generator even against destructible items while having a 100% critical hit chance as a 406% weapon damage attack with no cool down it becomes a problem of game balance.
Then make it aoe.......

To bring the ability in line with the rest of the game I propose these changes to the skill.
Increase fury cost by 10
reduce base damage to 206%
reduce smash to make 306% in total

What these three changes will do with out destroying the build in the least is this. The attack would now only generate fury on 2 or more mobs so they may no longer be able to recast a 406% weapon damage attack as a fury generator on a single target while still viable for multiple targets.
The weapon damage MUST be brought down, no one has an attack they can cast over and over with 100% resource gain and no loss and 100% critical hit chance while cost only equaling 1/5th of the maximum resource bar.

I am sure I will have player response of how expensive it is to accomplish this build. Price is not what I am trying to address but actual game balance.

Wyatt Cheng said in an interview how he likes the concept of a player feeling they have broken the game by taking an ability to the extreme(ex:cm wiz, 0 dog, HoA) and I agree such things are very fun, but he also touched on how they also do not intend to allow players to create such type of infinite spells or combos to be left in en-defiantly. Does the blizzard staff intend to go in the same direction of game balance as they intended when asked in previous interviews or has there been a change in the census?
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you do know that crits are not guranteed to return fury right? anyway lame post =P
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Posts: 143
you do know that crits are not guaranteed to return fury right? anyway lame post =P


yes a lame post requesting a reevaluation of a class that spams a 406% weapon damage attack with a 100% crit chance.....
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Posts: 143
This is not even about what I may or may not play, Im not sure what it has to do with my post, but i guess i understand how you got there. Player A makes a post about addressing a class design issue. Player B reads said post and feels threatened about possible change, player B then assume player A feels weak or under powered in comparison.
But here is why your statement is not sound in reasoning:
Loaded for bear can not be used to auto attack to generate hatred, cant make it have a 1 resource cost, cant make it 100% critical hit chance.

An educated response giving an alternate line of reasoning is more then welcome or a blue post would be awesome. But I just have trolls so far....

I'm more then happy to poke holes in your ideas though if you just reply with half baked responses that don't attempt to apply reasoning.
Edited by Kiro#1970 on 3/1/2013 12:33 PM PST
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This is not even about what I may or may not play, Im not sure what it has to do with my post, but i guess i understand how you got there. Player A makes a post about addressing a class design issue. Player B reads said post and feels threatened about possible change, player B then assume player A feels weak or under powered in comparison.
But here is why your statement is not sound in reasoning:
Loaded for bear can not be used to auto attack to generate hatred, cant make it have a 1 resource cost, cant make it 100% critical hit chance.

An educated response giving an alternate line of reasoning is more then welcome or a blue post would be awesome. But I just have trolls so far....

I'm more then happy to poke holes in your ideas though if you just reply with half baked responses that don't attempt to apply reasoning.


Quick question, how does this Nerf benefit you if you're not playing with a barb?

How does it benefit me when I'm playing with mine?

How does it benefit us if we're in multiplayer and we're supposed to take down the hardest mob before we get 1 shoted?

How does this benefit anyone who enjoys playing that class without you?

Please answer honestly.
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I completely disagree. Despite what a strong skill HotA is, the vast majority of barbs don't use it and just use pure sprint/ww. It's not easy to make HotA spammable even with (very pricey) HotA reduction gear. Additionally, it is not a pure fury generator even with copious amounts of reduction, because the fury is returned only after you cast. Even if you reduce its fury cost by 15 through gear, your fury will degenerate overall.

Increasing the fury cost would be bad enough, but decreasing the damage by as much as what you proposed is simply absurd. It'd make bash:punish a stronger skill despite being a pure fury generator...

Edit, though you're hiding your profile, you didn't dispute that you don't even play a barb. No wonder you have such a weak understanding of the skill and its mechanics.
Edited by silverfire#1855 on 3/1/2013 12:43 PM PST
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90 Troll Druid
0
Posts: 2,421
Why don't you ask for other classes to be buffed instead of trying to get someone else's class nerfed?

What do you gain exactly for getting barb nerfed? The satisfaction?(sp?) you just annoyed everyone's who is enjoying barb? As far as i know barbarian are not stealing your raid spot
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[quote="79790322380"]The Barbarian as a class is in need of some modification with the hammer of the ancients build.

Yo dude,
I don't even use HOA, but in case I ever decide to, back off brah.
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Posts: 143
I completely disagree. Despite what a strong skill HotA is, the vast majority of barbs don't use it and just use pure sprint/ww. It's not easy to make HotA spammable even with (very pricey) HotA reduction gear.

Increasing the fury cost would be bad enough, but decreasing the damage by as much as what you proposed is simply absurd. It'd make bash:punish a stronger skill despite being a pure fury generator...


gear price is not the issue though, its bringing the build/play style in line with the rest of the game.
You say it not easy to obtain but it can be obtained. What I proposed may not be the right idea of how to rework the skill but at the same time having a build that most certainly can achieve 100% crit chance on a 406% damage attack is no where near what one would call "balanced"

Why don't you ask for other classes to be buffed instead of trying to get someone else's class nerfed?

What do you gain exactly for getting barb nerfed? The satisfaction?(sp?) you just annoyed everyone's who is enjoying barb? As far as i know barbarian are not stealing your raid spot


This is also another option that can be explored. how ever more often then not when one class has a excessively power build or design it general means that it must be tuned down, but if they decide not to then yes tuning every thing else up is also one way to fix it.
Edited by Kiro#1970 on 3/1/2013 12:47 PM PST
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LOL. So Barb will be "balanced" when every Barb is using a sprint/WW build? Because that's what will happen if your suggestions were implemented.
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I completely disagree. Despite what a strong skill HotA is, the vast majority of barbs don't use it and just use pure sprint/ww. It's not easy to make HotA spammable even with (very pricey) HotA reduction gear.

Increasing the fury cost would be bad enough, but decreasing the damage by as much as what you proposed is simply absurd. It'd make bash:punish a stronger skill despite being a pure fury generator...


gear price is not the issue though, its bringing the build/play style in line with the rest of the game.
You say it not easy to obtain but it can be obtained. What I proposed may not be the right idea of how to rework the skill but at the same time having a build that most certainly can achieve 100% crit chance on a 406% damage attack is no where near what one would call "balanced"

Why don't you ask for other classes to be buffed instead of trying to get someone else's class nerfed?

What do you gain exactly for getting barb nerfed? The satisfaction?(sp?) you just annoyed everyone's who is enjoying barb? As far as i know barbarian are not stealing your raid spot


This is also another option that can be explored. how ever more often then not when one class has a excessively power build or design it general means that it must be tuned down, but if they decide not to then yes tuning every thing else up is also one way to fix it.


Would be nice if you could answer the most basics of questions I asked. How does this benefit you, me, them,us?

How does it benefit your WD?

How does it benefit my barb?

How does it benefit your solo play and mine?

How does it benefit our public game?
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90 Troll Druid
0
Posts: 2,421
This is also another option that can be explored. how ever more often then not when one class has a excessively power build or design it general means that it must be tuned down, but if they decide not to then yes tuning every thing else up is also one way to fix it.


Except what's fun in Arpg is cutting through horde of enemies while feeling powerful and collecting loots, not being a wimp.

Some might say "Well if you're doing too much damage, the game is too easy" Well no, spamming left click + 1-2-3 on a monster/boss for 30 second instead of 10 doesn't make it any "easier/harder" it just make it more boring and annoying. Challenge in Arpg come from avoiding 1-2 shot mechanic and knowing how to react to certain elite afix.
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I find this thread comical.

How can you propose changes when all your basing your expertise on is reading the tooltips and some threads made by other barbs?

Do yourself a favor OP and delete your thread, its embarrassing to even read.

I think someones still mad over the trail of cinders nerf?
Edited by RagingKoala#1984 on 3/1/2013 1:06 PM PST
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