0 Dog a Dying Breed in RoS

Witch Doctor
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12/09/2013 06:49 PMPosted by baggins
that rynn guy is trying to say build will work with a 1sec cooldown guy has no clue


GunnersDream did some tests with -1 sec cool down and if u run an attack speed of 2.0 it will work *BUT* once you get buffs like bbv, frenzy shrine, and transgression all that goes out the window and the build will not work. So Yes we do need a full 0 sec cool down for the build to work properly.

Unfortunately there are a lot of Trolls on that thread and none of them have the slightest clue how the 0 Dog build works. I'm baffled at the fact that they think the build is OP especially when we are using an i57 Mojo, lol.
yea i knew of the 1sec 2.0 thing he seems to think of it as a nuke type skill and not a spamable one

anyway all of these arguments are coming from people that never played the build not even once it seems

hope blizzards doesnt read too much into what they are saying
12/09/2013 07:02 PMPosted by heyguyslol
Unfortunately there are a lot of Trolls on that thread and none of them have the slightest clue how the 0 Dog build works. I'm baffled at the fact that they think the build is OP especially when we are using an i57 Mojo, lol.


Ya the thing is, blizzard repeatedly states that one of their biggest goals is build diversity.

0Dog gives you that in 3 areas that no other WD build gives you:
Diversity in skills - Zombie Handler and Tribal Rites passives are not used in virtually any other builds

Diversity in items - Attack speed is no longer the enemy for a Witch Doctor - with a 0Dog you want to stack it as much as possible. You also make great use out of Health Globe bonus which almost no other class and/or build really takes advantage of. In addition, 0Dog uses the Visage of Giuya which very few witch doctors use, the homunculus (which no other builds use) and sometimes a skull grasp (very rarely used in other builds) So if you want a Witch Doctor builds that use different items, this is a build that does it in spades.

Diversity in roles - This build allows you to be the healer in a party with the globes you summon. It also allows you to play a support role in that you can buff other Witch Doctor's damage and resources, and buff Demon Hunters and Wizards resources. A true support build that the Witch Doctor has no other build that comes close to.

Hmm...I think I'll post this in that other thread.
sounds op man might not wanna post it there :)
@heyguyslol - even if the build becomes unusable, tyvm for all the work you've done to share it and to help new players. For the brief time I've used it, it's been a blast.
joined the petition :P

nice work Shawn. <3
omg that thread gets worse by the minute
With the drop in life steal the 0 dog could be a popular class to play depending on runs. I want it to stay around. I don't think it's impossible for the devs to rebalance it so that it does comparable damage and not too OP on heal but enough to help a team playing. They want players to play together and this build is a good synergy with others.

I run mine currently with provoke the pack which is not as tanky as running for the master getting life per sacrifice vs. damage buff and managing globes. They want to make the build more challenging then drop life gain from for the master and make viable to play with globes bonus.

I think I was most excited to play this build over all others when I found my homunculus. It really brought the fun back in the game trying to get my survival / damage balance working right. When you play from finds and not flipping or buying gear from the GAH it's a challenging gear setup to build on currently. It could be the same level of fun to me to build and tweak it in RoS.
12/10/2013 02:38 PMPosted by baggins
omg that thread gets worse by the minute


B...its all good brother, I don't mind debates and arguments at all.

For those that have posted are passionate about what they believe, right or wrong.

If we keep voicing our logic, just maybe the moss will roll off the rock, and peel back something we can be proud that we fought for, whether we win or lose, we at least tried instead of staying silent.

I won't be silent until the final bell rings.
12/10/2013 04:31 PMPosted by REAPER666
I won't be silent until the final bell rings.


That's awesome D :). I doubt certain WD players, players like me that's been playing 0Dog since it started surfacing back more than a year ago will stay silent even after the bell rings.

I am somewhat worried though that thread might end up doing more harm than good just because of all the irrelevant comments of inexperienced 0Dog players chiming in. I hope that's not the case since we really don't have any other means to reach out and be heard. With as many players that got hipstered when the 0Dog build went mainstream, not many actually learned the mechanics of the build. With that said, there's very few experienced players voicing their concerns and even fewer people outside of that circle that can relate and understand said concerns about the build.
That thread was hijacked by Crit mass wizards pretty fast.
should we raise our voice in here...
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/10859405973#1
12/10/2013 05:58 PMPosted by Luffy
should we raise our voice in here...
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/10859405973#1


Well done Luff, I really couldn't have worded Shawn's post any better, I hope he doesn't mind but I copied and pasted it there :P
12/10/2013 05:58 PMPosted by Luffy
should we raise our voice in here...
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/10859405973#1


Thanks for the link good sir. Going to the thread now.
I doubt we will see 0 dog in ros. the healing rate doesnt fit with the new model for less spiky damage.

what kept 0 dog ballanced in d3 vanila was the gimped humuculus and that op life steal allowed for a equally high heal rate
12/10/2013 08:36 PMPosted by ChuckNorris
I doubt we will see 0 dog in ros. the healing rate doesnt fit with the new model for less spiky damage.

what kept 0 dog ballanced in d3 vanila was the gimped humuculus and that op life steal allowed for a equally high heal rate


I was definitely wondering these same things. With a larger emphasis on health globes in RoS what was blizzard going to think of a build that could spam so much? I thought perhaps Final Gift might get nerfed, but I really hate that approach. Some folks might actually use dogs in a normal way and like a globe when the dogs die, so punishing them because you can use it in 0Dog didn't really seem right. Maybe some sort of "this effect can not occur more than..." could do it.

The other point about the homunculus is definitely valid as well. Right now both CoB and 0Dog are very competitive damage wise and that's with 0Dog losing a good 80k sheet dps from the offhand. If the offhand were made on par, then 0Dog would certainly do more dps than CoB. Again nerfing sacrifice's damage would even it out, but doing it just for 0Dog would again be a poor approach.
I feel your pain guys but bear in mind that it's not just 0 dogs that are a "dying breed". Almost every remotely commonly used build in the game for every class is either being removed or reworked dramatically.

Try not to cling so tightly to your current playstyle, that goes for everyone. Where would the fun be in playing the same build for the next decade? Change doesn't always have to be a bad thing.
12/11/2013 10:20 AMPosted by silverfire
Try not to cling so tightly to your current playstyle, that goes for everyone.


Oh I'm very excited to try out new builds. Of the 4 characters I've played I think I've covered pretty much all of them (never played an Acid Cloud proc build though, just don't have the gear.)

My opinion is simply this - heyguyslol basically posted a petition asking that the build remain in the game for new players. Sounds good to me, so I gave it a thumb up.

I keep getting in that post to correct all the misconceptions being posted there. If not for all that, I would have just been "yup very cool build, all players should be able to try it" and moved on.

As to all the side talk in there about barbs and wizards - I think they should just go in their own threads and not muddy the discussion.
I usually don't venture outside of the class forums because generally the experts are here and the clueless are there. Consequently I didn't really look at that thread, but its unsurprising to me that it'd get uneducated feedback.

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