Recent changes. Wait, what?

General Discussion
I'm literally baffled by the changes that have recently gone through. The level at which Blizzard seems to be out of touch with it's community is borderline scary.

03/21/2014 12:56 PMPosted by Nevalistis
Some of you may have noticed I recently updated the [url="http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/12032813274"]Patch 2.0.3 Hotfixes[/url] to include a couple new upcoming changes. These hotfixes should be live later this afternoon, and we wanted to offer some clarification regarding these changes in advance (as well as to keep the Hotfix list clean of lengthy explanations).

  • All class set items will now only drop in Torment I or above.


  • We've been listening to player feedback on difficulty rewards, and one of the most frequent comments we receive is that Torment difficulty isn't rewarding enough. As a result, we've reached the decision to make class-specific sets, specifically Natalya’s, Immortal Kings, Tal Rasha's, Inna's, and Zunimassa's, drop only in Torment I or above from this point forward.


    If you want to keep this, it's fine. Getting into torment isn't exactly difficult. What I think Blizzard fails to understand here is that they didn't improve the reward from torment at all. All they did was make the other stages of the game less rewarding. That's it.

    So many changes between friends & family beta and now have been negative and I simply can't understand why. It's like Blizzard manufactured a really great car with all these great features. It was a thing of beauty! Everyone is excited, they can't wait to drive this car. Then right before it's distributed someone at Blizzard goes "hang on a sec..." and beats the hell out of it with a baseball bat. "There, now it's ready."

    Why would any company do that? o.O

    The one other thing that is even more mind boggling than this, is that there are people out there looking at the bashed car going "No no, it looks fine. It just needs a little paint."

    Wait, what?

    TLDR; Now that I have your attention, if you think this post is about crying about not getting loot on master or below, you need to actually *read* the post before posting yourself. Thank you. :)
    Don't worry, Blizzard knows what's fun for you.
    03/23/2014 01:35 PMPosted by Jinxis
    If you want to keep this, it's fine. Getting into torment isn't exactly difficult. What I think Blizzard fails to understand here is that they didn't improve the reward from torment at all. All they did was make the other stages of the game less rewarding. That's it.
    What you fail to understand is that this change was going to be implemented in RoS.
    And it releases in 3 days. So uhh... you're crying over nothing. Literally, nothing.

    And to anyone else - if you DIDN'T already know, there will be Torment-only exclusive legendaries and set items in RoS at 70. This was announced AGES ago, so where's your outrage when it was announced then?
    03/23/2014 01:43 PMPosted by CyberGoat
    03/23/2014 01:35 PMPosted by Jinxis
    If you want to keep this, it's fine. Getting into torment isn't exactly difficult. What I think Blizzard fails to understand here is that they didn't improve the reward from torment at all. All they did was make the other stages of the game less rewarding. That's it.
    What you fail to understand is that this change was going to be implemented in RoS.
    And it releases in 3 days. So uhh... you're crying over nothing. Literally, nothing.

    And to anyone else - if you DIDN'T already know, there will be Torment-only exclusive legendaries and set items in RoS at 70. This was announced AGES ago, so where's your outrage when it was announced then?


    I think you missed the point. Everyone knew there was going to be torment only legendaries. That's not a surprise. The point is that people were saying torment wasn't rewarding enough. In response to this, blizzard made more legendaries torment exclusive.

    This change didn't change torment at all. It's exactly the same before the patch as it was after the patch. How does that improve the experience of people currently playing torment? Unless you're one of these guys that is now rocking back and forth in your chair with your pinky finger to your mouth going "At last! Those pitiful fools that can't do torment will no longer have access to sets! muhaha.....Muhahaha....MUHAHAHAH!!! MUHAHAHAHA!!!"

    Do you understand now? :P
    What does it matter if they moved the set items to Torment 1-6? You have a complaint but don't really explain why it matters. Your justification, from what I can tell, is merely taken from an if it isn't broke don't fix it stance. "All it does is make other parts of the game less rewarding". ...So what you're saying is the developers wanted to give more incentive for players to play in Torment instead of speed running through everything they can 1 shot in Normal through Master?
    03/23/2014 01:53 PMPosted by Dajinn
    What does it matter if they moved the set items to Torment 1-6? You have a complaint but don't really explain why it matters. Your justification, from what I can tell, is merely taken from an if it isn't broke don't fix it stance. "All it does is make other parts of the game less rewarding". ...So what you're saying is the developers wanted to give more incentive for players to play in Torment instead of speed running through everything they can 1 shot in Normal through Master?


    Again, this did not make torment more rewarding. Blizzard specifically stated that this change was in response to players saying that torment didn't feel rewarding enough. Yet torment has not changed. At all. It's exactly the same as it was before. It's not more rewarding in the least.

    The car is not fine. They bashed it with a baseball bat for peat's sake. :P
    03/23/2014 01:53 PMPosted by Dajinn
    What does it matter if they moved the set items to Torment 1-6? You have a complaint but don't really explain why it matters. Your justification, from what I can tell, is merely taken from an if it isn't broke don't fix it stance. "All it does is make other parts of the game less rewarding". ...So what you're saying is the developers wanted to give more incentive for players to play in Torment instead of speed running through everything they can 1 shot in Normal through Master?


    What I think their trying to say is, why didn't the ADD something to T1 and above instead of taking away something from Master and below and then say, "Hey, look. We improved it!". Get it?
    03/23/2014 01:35 PMPosted by Jinxis
    I'm literally baffled by the changes that have recently gone through. The level at which Blizzard seems to be out of touch with it's community is borderline scary.

    03/21/2014 12:56 PMPosted by Nevalistis
    Some of you may have noticed I recently updated the [url="http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/12032813274"]Patch 2.0.3 Hotfixes[/url] to include a couple new upcoming changes. These hotfixes should be live later this afternoon, and we wanted to offer some clarification regarding these changes in advance (as well as to keep the Hotfix list clean of lengthy explanations).

    ...

    We've been listening to player feedback on difficulty rewards, and one of the most frequent comments we receive is that Torment difficulty isn't rewarding enough. As a result, we've reached the decision to make class-specific sets, specifically Natalya’s, Immortal Kings, Tal Rasha's, Inna's, and Zunimassa's, drop only in Torment I or above from this point forward.


    If you want to keep this, it's fine. Getting into torment isn't exactly difficult. What I think Blizzard fails to understand here is that they didn't improve the reward from torment at all. All they did was make the other stages of the game less rewarding. That's it.

    So many changes between friends & family beta and now have been negative and I simply can't understand why. It's like Blizzard manufactured a really great car with all these great features. It was a thing of beauty! Everyone is excited, they can't wait to drive this car. Then right before it's distributed someone at Blizzard goes "hang on a sec..." and beats the hell out of it with a baseball bat. "There, now it's ready."

    Why would any company do that? o.O

    The one other thing that is even more mind boggling than this, is that there are people out there looking at the bashed car going "No no, it looks fine. It just needs a little paint."

    Wait, what?


    Well said. My thoughts exactly.

    03/23/2014 01:40 PMPosted by KhaoS
    Don't worry, Blizzard knows what's fun for you.


    LOL
    06/20/2012 05:33 PMPosted by Bashiok
    aren't you thankful!?
    What i read out of this

    People wanna take the baby way out and farm master to get the set items..wahh wahh cry more
    Had Blizzard made ZERO changes via a hotfix, this would have occurred anyways at RoS.
    The only thing threads like this ballyhoo are 3 days' time. That's it.

    Enjoy RoS. Or don't... whatever. But stop the feigned outrage.
    OP has a point even though I think he is overreacting as most do.

    If people feel torment isn't rewarding enough (the increased legendary drop chance is not noticeable), taking away from lower difficulties while not changing anything about torment does not make torment better.

    It's like working hard and being given an inadequate reward. You are unhappy with the specific reward you received because you don't feel it is sufficient for your hard work. Instead of improving the reward, the person handing rewards out takes away the rewards from people who did less work and expects you to be happy. People who did less work are stuck without a reward and you are still stuck with the same crappy reward that you didn't like in the first place.
    03/23/2014 02:04 PMPosted by DETERM
    What i read out of this

    People wanna take the baby way out and farm master to get the set items..wahh wahh cry more


    The car...is not...fine. Paint...will not....fix it.

    Seriously though, if that's what you took from this you need to read it again.

    Edit: Poster above me understands my point exactly. Read that for more clarification.
    I guess people will complain about anything these days.

    Just a little tidbit, they inadvertanly upped your chances of getting a specific legendary on normal-master by removing set items.

    So if we are not talking about semantics here, if you want legs play normal-master and if you want sets play T1-6.

    Have fun grinding either way.
    03/23/2014 01:35 PMPosted by Jinxis
    It's like Blizzard manufactured a really great car with all these great features. It was a thing of beauty! Everyone is excited, they can't wait to drive this car. Then right before it's distributed someone at Blizzard goes "hang on a sec..." and beats the hell out of it with a baseball bat. "There, now it's ready."


    I remember when the original D3 came out, I was so excited, 5 stash tabs, could vendor and break down items on the fly, had the mystic, and then BAM, it was stripped down to the bare minimum and released as a pile of crap that I was bored of 4 days later when I could kill inferno butcher in 20 seconds but got 2 hit by a bee in act 2.
    This particular change isnt for the people who thought torment isnt reqarding enough, but for he people who every day asked if normal was the best difficulty to farm gear.
    Blizzard doesn't always make great decisions, but I think what most people are missing is that they have the drop rates where they want them. If they make adjustments they are going to do it so that drop rates don't change.

    They found a solution that makes torment slightly better than normal since the most powerful gear in the game now cannot drop on the easiest setting of the game without changing drops per hour.
    I don't remember people saying that Torment wasn't rewarding enough in isolation. What they were saying is that there was no reason to farm Torment when Normal was just as rewarding.

    All areas of the game became massively more rewarding than before 2.0, but the distinction, the reward gradient, was reduced so that all levels were equally "way more rewarding".

    I think the rewards are in a pretty good spot, but the rewards in face-roll Normal are just a little too good - it's rewards for essentially nothing.

    In short I think these changes are a reasonable reaction to there being no incentive to play Torment *IN COMPARISON TO LOWER LEVELS*. Fixing that problem doesn't require them to buff Torment, it only requires them to create some sort of noticeable gradient. In my mind, they didn't go far enough. I'd take Legendaries out of Normal entirely - you can easily gear up to Hard/Expert/etc. levels, even enough to face-roll those levels using just rares. When I start an HC toon I start it out at level 1 in Expert mode just so I have the smallest chance to maybe possibly die - and even that doesn't become a real threat until L50 or so.

    I think Torment are already in the ballpark of where they should be and the lower levels were way too easy and rewarding, so I fully agree that the rewards on the lower levels need to be nerfed....

    If you want to keep this, it's fine. Getting into torment isn't exactly difficult. What I think Blizzard fails to understand here is that they didn't improve the reward from torment at all. All they did was make the other stages of the game less rewarding. That's it.
    )


    Actually HC is a whole different situation but it gets ignored b/c the player base there is small in comparison with SC. I have not heard one good post on how this impacts HC from a person of authority (CM, Dev, anyone on the D3 or blizzard team)
    03/23/2014 02:02 PMPosted by Arilith
    06/20/2012 05:33 PMPosted by Bashiok
    aren't you thankful!?

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