*12* Reasons To Double Monster Legendary Droprates P2

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Also to add, Legendaries should have 7 affixes, not 6. It is quite silly to call them legendary and to make them on par with rares. Yes I know there are perfect rares from D2, you can still get perfect rares in D3, having perfect legendaries would be even more rare, since instead of getting a perfect 6 you now need a perfect 7 AND it would make people farm even more for that 1 in 1000000 chance of getting it. Just a thought.
On my mobile.

04/09/2014 08:22 AMPosted by Caderyn
Additionally, you can't put the same value on this chest as say a Thunderfury.

Cindercoat!

04/09/2014 09:02 AMPosted by Dis
Also to add, Legendaries should have 7 affixes, not 6. It is quite silly to call them legendary and to make them on par with rares. Yes I know there are perfect rares from D2, you can still get perfect rares in D3, having perfect legendaries would be even more rare, since instead of getting a perfect 6 you now need a perfect 7 AND it would make people farm even more for that 1 in 1000000 chance of getting it. Just a thought.


Would be far too powerful in my opinion. The current limit of 6 properties forces you to make gearing decisions about how much damage and how much toughness you want. 7 properties would let you choose both.

04/09/2014 08:59 AMPosted by Allarius
Well very clearly our definition of legendary is different. I do not agree that inserting generic CC on a legendary makes it worthwhile. I'm all for fun builds, but there doesn't need to be a distinction between rares and legendaries when it's just a "fun" bonus.


On the contrary, I believe it is only the effects that make them fun. Even if you didn't believe that though, legendary items all can roll higher stats than rares and that makes them legendary on its own. The effects are just a neat bonus.
04/09/2014 08:59 AMPosted by Allarius
I was just pointing out that increasing the drop rate wouldn't solve anything when its the items themselves that are lackluster. What does perspective have to do with anything? Whatever my perspective is doesn't change how the itemization is.


I think you fail to understand how Blizzard categorizes itemization and item quality. As is with WoW, Diablo has a number of tiers for item quality. Legendary is simply the word that Blizzard decided to go with as opposed to "Unique" from D2. Here is a simple (but not complete) chart of the progression:

Common (White)- Basic item, 1 stat such as Damage or Block % increase.
Magic (Blue)- Several affixes (Strength, Vitality, etc...), increased damage/armor
Rare (Yellow)- Potential for more affixes, larger maximum stat potential, increased damage/armor from Magic items
Legendary (Orange)- Variable affixes (though primarily 6, depending on static affixes and effects), largest stat potential, largest increase in damage/armor

As you can see, they may not be, by definition, "Legendary," they still provide a significant advantage over the other qualities. While they may be "glorified Rares" by only having 6 affixes with not every item having a static affix/effect, they still have a much larger potential. All in all, if you played D2, you wold understand that the word "Legendary" was just a word choice made by Blizzard. I believe that they chose this over the D2 "Unique" is because they intended on having a large amount of variation between occurrences of the same item, which there is, thus not making them Unique by having static affixes/effects as was in D2.


[...]

Common (White)- Basic item, 1 stat such as Damage or Block % increase.
Magic (Blue)- Several affixes (Strength, Vitality, etc...), increased damage/armor
Rare (Yellow)- Potential for more affixes, larger maximum stat potential, increased damage/armor from Magic items
Legendary (Orange)- Variable affixes (though primarily 6, depending on static affixes and effects), largest stat potential, largest increase in damage/armor. [...]

[/quote]

Forgot to mention that Sets [Natalya's, Immortal King's, Tal Rasha's] are the last item tier as they essentially add up to 5 more mods onto your gear with set bonuses.

So asking for a buff to legendary drop rate isn't even game breaking as that isn't the end game.
Actually, let me rephrase. Legendaries that have unique affixes, should roll 7. Take Wizardspike for instance, rolls an AR slot that CANNOT be changed. The proc on that is absolutely wonderful, but is gimped because to roll a coket, you have to give up a primary or AS. Which actually maybe a larger problem of having slots in general on weapons, since any weapon with a green gem socketed in your weapon is pretty much worthless or turned into mats. But that is another discussion.

You can keep most trash legendaries or another version of a rare/rare with 6 affixes but things that have the unique modifier should roll another 6 affixes along with the unique affix. So you basically have two standards of legendaries, the more common 6 affix "nothing special" legendary, and the other, lets call them "super" legendaries that have a lower drop rate.

So basically what you have done is created another tier of drops, where the junk legs, or legs that are the starter kit for fresh 70's drop more often, which is great because mats become more readily available for enchanting, and you have the rarer tier of leg drops of the 7 affix legs. Anyways, just an idea.
You can have high variance, or you can have low drop rate, but you can't have both. As long as crap like Nutcracker and Zweihander and Blackthorne's set are cluttering the loot tables, and as long as legendaries have a low probability of rolling good stats, a drop rate this low is unacceptable.

When 90% of legendary drops are trash, I'm not getting a legendary every 1-2 hours, I'm getting one every 10-20. The rest of the time I'm getting a Forgotten soul.

Before playing Reaper of Souls, I worried that I'd never have Forgotten Souls because I'd never want to salvage any legendaries. I was very disappointed to discover how wrong I was.
04/09/2014 10:06 AMPosted by mTWO
Forgot to mention that Sets [Natalya's, Immortal King's, Tal Rasha's] are the last item tier as they essentially add up to 5 more mods onto your gear with set bonuses.

So asking for a buff to legendary drop rate isn't even game breaking as that isn't the end game


Yes, there is a potential bonus, but the stat range is on par with the Legendary quality. Do you see Alkaizer using the Immortal King 2H weapon? No. He is using Legendary weapons Thunderfury and Shard of Hate last time I checked. So I would definitely say asking for a buff to the legendary drop rate is very significant. I wouldn't call it game breaking, I would call it game making because this game is extremely demoralizing as it is for players who can't put in the time to play 30 hours a week, which, by the way, the casual player is the majority of Blizzard's consumer base.
Bump this!!!! Another 7 runs with nothing to show for it!!! Seriously Blizzard these drop rates are complete trash!!!! U say u bumped them 25% well bump them another 2500% becuase i sure the hell don't see any difference at alll
When 90% of legendary drops are trash, I'm not getting a legendary every 1-2 hours, I'm getting one every 10-20. The rest of the time I'm getting a Forgotten soul. The rest of the time I'm getting a Forgotten soul.

Before playing Reaper of Souls, I worried that I'd never have Forgotten Souls because I'd never want to salvage any legendaries. I was very disappointed to discover how wrong I was.


Increasing the drop rate won't change your ratio of trash vs. "real legendary". You'll still find 90% trash.

Even if the rates were improved, yes, you would initially find more upgrades but you would be back to waiting 10-20 hours for an upgrade before long. The only thing you would be accomplishing here is essentially inflating the stats for everyone. Now, MAYBE that is a good thing. Everyone could find the legendary items that complement their build and be significantly stronger as a baseline -- perhaps that's the real vision that players have for Diablo 3 and there's nothing wrong with that. From what I've heard of Diablo 2 so far, that's the style of gameplay that players have come to know and love.

All of that said, that's not exactly what my vision is for Diablo 3. I really enjoy having legendaries be rare enough that when something drops I get excited. Sure, sometimes the stats are a disappointment (maybe even most of the time for you guys) and yeah, sometimes it takes awhile for them to drop. When you up the rates though, I feel like it won't be as exciting to see a legendary drop -- particularly when you find new legendaries. The other day a clan mate looted a sword I had never seen, and even though the stats were terrible we both had a lot of fun trying it out.

Furthermore, it's neat to have an item finally drop for you and know that it's fairly rare. I recently finished my Marauder 4p, and I like being able to show off my pets because I know it's really rare. If the rates are increased, suddenly having all those companions out isn't a big deal because every demon hunter under the sun has them. Maybe it's a bit selfish, but I think the majority of players in Diablo 3 are capable of finding items that 90% of the others don't currently have. Perhaps one Demon Hunter has a Cloak of Garwulf allowing him three wolves (I know when I first looted that item I was ecstatic despite the stats being mediocre at best!). Another might have a crossbow that applies Marked for Death to enemies. Even though said crossbow is often considered one of the best hand crossbows, I'm not upset that I haven't ever seen it drop yet (My clan mate even has one and I enjoy playing with him and seeing it). Having these items be somewhat rare makes them special and fun to use, and I thoroughly enjoy grouping with people and seeing all the neat toys they find.

But I also recognize how frustrating that can be if you're looking for a specific legendary out of the massive pool. I also acknowledge that terrible stats often renders neat legendaries useless. Both are definitely valid reasons of complaint, but I'm not convinced they warrant an increase to drop rates. I am confident there are definitely alternative measures to address those problems. I know I read one suggestion the other day that offered giving certain types of legendaries a higher relative drop ratio in specific areas compared to other types -- allowing people to try to focus on finding what they are looking for. Perhaps that's an idea that deserves exploration.
04/07/2014 10:04 AMPosted by Jentso
04/07/2014 10:00 AMPosted by PiousHeretic
...

That's right, and last week the argument was "we're one week into the game". Will we kick the can down the road again in another two weeks?

...

Why? I would agree that I don't need to be geared with the best of the best at this very moment on even one character, but I'm curious to know how you've arrived at this conclusion?


LOL. Another two weeks would still be too early to complain about drops.

When I mean "be rewarded", I mean by getting a legendary upgrade every time you play, and that seems to be what everyone thinks this game should be. It isn't. And it's not a grind, either.
how about 30 drops? Is that good enough, at 2 hrs a drop 30x2 60 hours that is 1 upgrade in a 60 hour period, that feels extremely excessive to me.
04/09/2014 11:21 AMPosted by Deathshiver
When 90% of legendary drops are trash, I'm not getting a legendary every 1-2 hours, I'm getting one every 10-20. The rest of the time I'm getting a Forgotten soul. The rest of the time I'm getting a Forgotten soul.

Before playing Reaper of Souls, I worried that I'd never have Forgotten Souls because I'd never want to salvage any legendaries. I was very disappointed to discover how wrong I was.


Increasing the drop rate won't change your ratio of trash vs. "real legendary". You'll still find 90% trash.

Even if the rates were improved, yes, you would initially find more upgrades but you would be back to waiting 10-20 hours for an upgrade before long. The only thing you would be accomplishing here is essentially inflating the stats for everyone. Now, MAYBE that is a good thing. Everyone could find the legendary items that complement their build and be significantly stronger as a baseline -- perhaps that's the real vision that players have for Diablo 3 and there's nothing wrong with that. From what I've heard of Diablo 2 so far, that's the style of gameplay that players have come to know and love.

All of that said, that's not exactly what my vision is for Diablo 3. I really enjoy having legendaries be rare enough that when something drops I get excited. Sure, sometimes the stats are a disappointment (maybe even most of the time for you guys) and yeah, sometimes it takes awhile for them to drop. When you up the rates though, I feel like it won't be as exciting to see a legendary drop -- particularly when you find new legendaries. The other day a clan mate looted a sword I had never seen, and even though the stats were terrible we both had a lot of fun trying it out.

Furthermore, it's neat to have an item finally drop for you and know that it's fairly rare. I recently finished my Marauder 4p, and I like being able to show off my pets because I know it's really rare. If the rates are increased, suddenly having all those companions out isn't a big deal because every demon hunter under the sun has them. Maybe it's a bit selfish, but I think the majority of players in Diablo 3 are capable of finding items that 90% of the others don't currently have. Perhaps one Demon Hunter has a Cloak of Garwulf allowing him three wolves (I know when I first looted that item I was ecstatic despite the stats being mediocre at best!). Another might have a crossbow that applies Marked for Death to enemies. Even though said crossbow is often considered one of the best hand crossbows, I'm not upset that I haven't ever seen it drop yet (My clan mate even has one and I enjoy playing with him and seeing it). Having these items be somewhat rare makes them special and fun to use, and I thoroughly enjoy grouping with people and seeing all the neat toys they find.

But I also recognize how frustrating that can be if you're looking for a specific legendary out of the massive pool. I also acknowledge that terrible stats often renders neat legendaries useless. Both are definitely valid reasons of complaint, but I'm not convinced they warrant an increase to drop rates. I am confident there are definitely alternative measures to address those problems. I know I read one suggestion the other day that offered giving certain types of legendaries a higher relative drop ratio in specific areas compared to other types -- allowing people to try to focus on finding what they are looking for. Perhaps that's an idea that deserves exploration.


If I had a dry spell to finding a upgrade, I would try a new character, as of right now either option leaves me bone dry.
04/09/2014 11:34 AMPosted by Barbalot
If I had a dry spell to finding a upgrade, I would try a new character, as of right now either option leaves me bone dry.


A valid point, however I would contend that there is currently what I would call a "gearing expectation" that remains from Diablo 2. I'm not here to suggest that everyone should be running around in mostly rares and one or two good legendary items. I just want to point out that, given different expectations, that may be a scenario that is slightly more acceptable. I'm not sure I would personally call that "bone dry" in the case of alternative characters -- but to each his own. If that's a standard you would like to see changed, I can respect that.
04/09/2014 11:49 AMPosted by Deathshiver
04/09/2014 11:34 AMPosted by Barbalot
If I had a dry spell to finding a upgrade, I would try a new character, as of right now either option leaves me bone dry.


A valid point, however I would contend that there is currently what I would call a "gearing expectation" that remains from Diablo 2. I'm not here to suggest that everyone should be running around in mostly rares and one or two good legendary items. I just want to point out that, given different expectations, that may be a scenario that is slightly more acceptable. I'm not sure I would personally call that "bone dry" in the case of alternative characters -- but to each his own. If that's a standard you would like to see changed, I can respect that.

I am content with getting drops every hour just to melt them, as long as they drop. I think the biggest offender right now RNG. I am interested to know whether or not previous drops to other individuals such as tals set reduce the chances of them dropping for those less unfortunate ones. As of right now the only set I have ever seen is blackthorns pants. I see people with full sets already and that might be some of the frustration between both groups (the fortunate and less fortunate). I don't want to look at someones 5 piece set when i can even get 2 pieces of a different more common set, especially when everything is BOA and my items in no way effect theirs.
Wouldn't it be cool if while you were logged out your stash filled with the perfectly rolled set pieces. This is what I want. Who actually wants to play a grinding for loot game and grind anyway?
It must be considered that this is not a game that is consistently providing new content and has no purchase function within the game (with the removal of the AH). I would personally consider this a basic RPG that can be compared to Darksiders or Fallout where you kill things and loot them to build a better character. While both of the comparisons had DLC's the extend the game, they only had 1 character or "class", Diablo currently has 6. Those games also took MUCH longer to complete as opposed to Diablo where you can get to 70 in a matter of hours. Now the range at which people played the above games varies from person to person from 50 to 500 hours of play time, but they also seemingly had more purpose with different endings and factions. Would it not be right to assume you should be able to progress at a steady level similar to other games? I have come up with 1 potential progression structure based on the difficulty increments:

Each class has 13 item slots. I am not going to bother with Normal-Expert since they are pretty easy even for a newly rolled character. These numbers are based on a newly rolled character.
Master- Should easily be able to get to Master within 10 hours playtime
Torment I- 1 hour per upgrade- 13 hours
Torment II- 1.5 hours per upgrade- 19.5 hours
Torment III- 2 hours per upgrade- 26 hours
Torment IV- 2.5 hours per upgrade- 32.5 hours
Torment V- 3 hours per upgrade- 39 hours
Torment VI- 3.5 hours per upgrade- 45.5 hours
Total hours- 185.5 hours per class
6 classes = 1,113 hours

Of course this is only a rough example that is impacted by RNG, but also is only on the basis for what is required to run the top survivable difficulty NOT on farming status (dying a few times here and there, 1-2 minutes to kill an elite pack). This still leaves a MASSIVE amount of time to work towards farming items with max stats, or vanity legends, or for other builds. It also takes into account that once you hit a certain point, diminishing returns makes an "upgrade" less effective and that gear from a prior difficulty is still viable in higher difficulties. Taking all of this into consideration easily brings the time played over 2,000 hours. If additional expansions are released, that essentially drops your viable Torment level to where you start again.
04/09/2014 10:16 AMPosted by Deus
When 90% of legendary drops are trash, I'm not getting a legendary every 1-2 hours, I'm getting one every 10-20. The rest of the time I'm getting a Forgotten soul.

Before playing Reaper of Souls, I worried that I'd never have Forgotten Souls because I'd never want to salvage any legendaries. I was very disappointed to discover how wrong I was.


Well put.
legs drop are fine... 0 upgrades the 10th houres played with my wizz
never found a complete set in 800 hrs in d3V or even a good trifecta....
maybe i got this TF in 10000hrs of playtime....

nothing else to say

http://eu.battle.net/d3/fr/profile/hellbannana-2157/hero/35553174
04/09/2014 02:02 PMPosted by hellbannana
legs drop are fine... 0 upgrades the 10th houres played with my wizz
never found a complete set in 800 hrs in d3V or even a good trifecta....
maybe i got this TF in 10000hrs of playtime....

nothing else to say

http://eu.battle.net/d3/fr/profile/hellbannana-2157/hero/35553174


800 hours and no complete set...I think that in itself means that the drops are NOT fine...You also do not have 10,000 hours of playtime. If T6 is not on farm after 800 hours played...I will personally create and release my own damn game...

Damn French being stupid...
04/09/2014 11:21 AMPosted by Deathshiver
Increasing the drop rate won't change your ratio of trash vs. "real legendary". You'll still find 90% trash.
Yes, and? I have uses for Forgotten Souls.

Even if the rates were improved, yes, you would initially find more upgrades
I didn't say "upgrades", I said "legendaries". The point was that the majority of "legendaries" are so terrible they don't even deserve to be called that. Yes, I understand how gearing curves work. That's not what I'm complaining about. What I'm complaining about is that I just got another no-unique-affix 2H with a low damage roll and no socket, and that's all I'm going to see for the next 2 hours.

Not that I failed to get a piece of gear that's an immediate upgrade to my current build, but that I consistently get gear that is markedly worse than mediocre rares. And not in the "it'd be better for a specific build" sense; I got a Frostburn that'd be worse for a cold build than my level 61 rare gloves that don't even have IAS. You cannot have that much variance on gear and make drop rates that low.

And we all know that there is no hope of Blizzard fixing variance in a timely manner. I'm not willing to wait a year for Blizzard to make legendaries not-terrible. So the only option is to amp the drop rate so that we can push past the endless deluge of garbage so that I can maybe get some interesting legendaries that are good enough to wear before I die of old age.
04/09/2014 02:27 PMPosted by Caderyn
800 hours and no complete set...I think that in itself means that the drops are NOT fine...You also do not have 10,000 hours of playtime. If T6 is not on farm after 800 hours played...I will personally create and release my own damn game...

Damn French being stupid...


wtf do you saying:

-i have not 10000 hrs of playtime ho really!
i said if i play this game 10000hr perhaps a good TF can loot

and i talk about 800hrs in diablo 3 VANILLA so why talk about T6??

this game is just luck and if rng hate you ur f**k

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