I'm falling sleep while doing rifts

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04/21/2014 04:06 PMPosted by Grimiku
I have some questions about this if you guys want to talk about it a little more. I've seen some feedback in other threads about Nephalem Rifts making players “sleepy” (or not exciting enough), but I'd like to focus on that topic a bit more with you. Before I do, though, I'd like to point out that there is some feedback about monster density in Rifts that we're definitely aware of. So, density aside, what are some things that would make Rifts more exciting to you?

Please feel free to free-form your answer. If you’re not sure where to begin, though, I’ve provided some questions below.

  • Does the atmosphere in a Rift influence how exciting or not exciting it feels? If yes, what Rift environments feel exciting to you? And which ones don’t?
  • Do certain monster groups feel more or less engaging?
  • Are there any mechanics from other parts of the game that you feel would make Rifts feel more exciting? If yes, what are those mechanics?
  • What's the most noticeable difference between a “boring” Rift and an “exciting” Rift for you?


I want to point out that because they are fully randomized there will be some Rifts that are more exciting than others, but we definitely want them to feel engaging and rewarding. We'd love to hear what you think would improve them in that way.


The Environment doesnt really play a huge part for me. The only thing I hate is running for a couple of seconds without any elites or enemies.

I freaking hate the Barbed Lurker.

Exciting Rift - Killing 2 or 3 Elites together at the same time.
Boring Rift - Running 10 - 15 seconds only to have white mobs welcome you.

Rift Mechanics - I would really like to have white to have a chance to drop legendary.
Rift Mechanics - Purple monsters that drop crafting agents pop in the rift in place of some of the elites. Also Rift Guardian can also be bosses that drop crafting agents. So that doing rift is double purpose. you have a chance to get crafting agents but its also randomized so you don't know what crafting agents you gonna get. Or crafting agents can be included in the loot table of Rift Guardians but its totally random. This Rift Guardian has a chance to drop 1 of 5 different crafting materials. That Rift Guardian another 5 and so on and so forth

Rift Mechanics - Rift Guardian - Killed this guy 5 times in T2 Only got 1 forgotten Soul 0 Leg. It frustrating doing all that to get to the Guardian and he won't even drop a forgotten soul for you. At the very least increase the drop rate of forgotten souls for the Rift Guardians and the Elites inside the rift have a chance to drop Forgotten Soul.

Rift Mechanics - LVL 70 Sage Set - Re work the every time a deaths breath drop a second one will also drop into - Whenever a Deaths Breath drop a small chance of forgotten soul to drop (1%) whenever inside a rift.
Rifts are not interactive at all, that's the problem. I was really enjoying RoS when I was just doing bounties because they were dynamic and I had lots of mini-events to do along the way. Rifts are just bland.

Ignoring the fact that many rifts have bad density or bad elite density, you just don't DO anything other than channel on the obelisk and kill monsters. At the very least put like, hard mode cursed chests in there, players can choose to open the chests or not (they probably will!!), but it goes beyond that.

I think if you could put 5 key frags in the obelisk with a gem to modify the rift it would give them a lot more flavor. For instance assign a list of modifiers to each gem type, and when you put in say a topaz gem monsters gain buffs OR you gain topaz based buffs OR the map itself is modified.

See: http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/10702890242 for more details, I wrote up a big thing.
I find the rifts to be similiar to D2 Boss Runs, Meph, D, Baal. We go in have to find our way to the end, and bam we fight the boss.

Now that I think of it, I would be set and content continuing running the rifts with just a guaranteed soul at the end.

Perhaps toss in some of the Unique mobs that drop the leg mats for some of the items too. :)

And the big open rifts are my favorite.
suggestions are great and all, but whens the last time Blizzard actually listened to its community?
The very first rift I entered in RoS, started in briarthorn cemetary and it was packed right at the entrance, every pull was 1-2 elite groups, and it was rapid-pace until the rift boss. 2-3 legendaries dropped and I didn't have time to stop and identify because the map was so packed. Also, it was only 1 map, not 4-6 levels to dig through. At the time, this seemed like a real game changer to me... thinking Blizzard really fixed this game finally!

Fast forward to now, rifts are very very boring. Many of them feel very empty, more empty than perhaps the mob density on normal difficulty at lvl10. I get so frustrated coming across power/conduit pylons and having NOTHING to kill by the time the buff expires. Rift bosses are anti-climactic(?)... I consider it a lucky day when they drop a forgotten soul.

I would do rifts non-stop if they were 1-2 maps, packed mob density, and rift bosses were even a tiny bit more rewarding. Maybe even introduce a timer component so that Orek gives a cache on top of the gold/xp reward if you finish the rift in X minutes (torment difficulties only?)... just a thought.
Things like:
Goblin packs make rifts exciting.
Elites and Champions make rifts exciting.
Bosses make rifts exciting.
Huge Mob Density makes rifts exciting.
Legendary drops make rifts exciting.
Chests make rifts exciting.
Imperial Gems make rifts exciting.
Blood Shards make rifts exciting.

Things like:
Low density make rifts boring.
Having to watch stragglers to see if global legendary drops on another map makes rifts REALLY boring.
Having to full clear (with no incentive) makes rifts boring.
Having nothing drop in a rift makes rifts boring.
Getting too little shards for completing higher torment makes rifts boring.
Feeling compelled to play on T1 and T2 for loot makes rifts boring.

I conclude, there needs to be more special rifts. Why not a treasure rift? A rift with plentiful chests, goblins, resplendent chests and a "Goblin King" that can only be found via a breakable chest (i.e. he pops out of it) and has a 60%-100% chance of dropping a random legendary item. That would wake anyone up, and would give incentive for people to do full runs through rifts as well.
There should be some random themed rift treasure troves guarded by a pack of champions(no minions - like 4 champions) that can be on any map - no predictable trove per map. These should have a chance for some nice drops and fountains/piles of gold.
04/21/2014 04:06 PMPosted by Grimiku
  • Does the atmosphere in a Rift influence how exciting or not exciting it feels? If yes, what Rift environments feel exciting to you? And which ones don’t?
  • Do certain monster groups feel more or less engaging?
  • Are there any mechanics from other parts of the game that you feel would make Rifts feel more exciting? If yes, what are those mechanics?
  • What's the most noticeable difference between a “boring” Rift and an “exciting” Rift for you?


No, except for graveyard and superjail floor because they are known to have high elite density

Multi packs of elites are more engaging than white mobs

Removing BOA would make the entire game more exciting

Elite density
It would be nice to have rifts that allow players to branch off to different areas, like zones in act 5 that have multiple smaller areas (like enter-able house) and for those areas to have mini bosses or unique quests with rewards (like more blood shards, or greatly increased leg find for the rest of the rift).

It would also be nice to encounter more area bosses in rifts, for example having wild Magdhas appear, or the occasional Malthael that that can drop the unique items for crafting so those don't have to be such of a grind
Please do not add side-quests or timers to the rifts, they just annoy people... They're the worst kinds of side-quests to receive when play any kind of sandbox game as it veers you off track from the main simple focus instead.

Simple facts, my friends and I get hyped when (in OR outside of a rift):

- there is a humongous mob of monsters (maybe 20-30 or so) and often
- there is an elite (or two, or three..)
- there is a gold goblin (or mob of goblins, hereby dubbed moblins)
- when something (useful or green) drops

It's really not that complicated and doesn't need to be, either, but if the rifts can just answer these simple +hype factors, that'd be great...

[edit] Just thought I'd mention... the blood shard drop nerf from 50-70 to 40-60 was not hype... and having not mentioned this in any patch note was not cool. [end edit]
the pandemonium rift really blows, its not fun, it slows you down, at least turn off the frozen gate.

adding more mobs, i know you already know this, but this is really really important for the fun, more mobs and at least a minimum of 4 elites on a floor no matter what

throw some of those purple mobs in the mix that drop the crafting mats, that would be a sweet bonus

add a special event to kill a certain amount of monsters in a time limit like the curse chest that gives a soul. that would be dope.it might also add incentive to clear all floors with players farming souls wanting to clear all floors for a chance of finding a curse soul chest

why end it with one rift boss? if we get the first spawn, add another bar, now when that fills F it you proc two bosses...then another BAR for a total of 3 rift bosses!!!!!! that epic fun. think outside the box guys you can do it.
04/22/2014 12:09 PMPosted by Latree

why end it with one rift boss? if we get the first spawn, add another bar, now when that fills F it you proc two bosses...then another BAR for a total of 3 rift bosses!!!!!! that epic fun. think outside the box guys you can do it.


This is something I wish I would have added!!!!
I find that rifts are more about moving fast and killing mobs on the way instead of finishing off whats in the room....

would be fun to see a more enclosed situation like cursed chest scenarios inside the rift for extra bonus, such as the exits of a room locked until 100 mobs are killed?

This would also stop that one monk/barb who always speeds miles ahead leaving others to "mop up"
HeavyDuty, you are absolutely correct. Players should not have any voice in what makes the game fun and the things they would like to see implemented. Why would you ask the people who play the game what they would like to see happen to make the game more enjoyable? Senseless and stupid, giant waste of time and manpower.
04/21/2014 04:06 PMPosted by Grimiku
I have some questions about this if you guys want to talk about it a little more. I've seen some feedback in other threads about Nephalem Rifts making players “sleepy” (or not exciting enough), but I'd like to focus on that topic a bit more with you. Before I do, though, I'd like to point out that there is some feedback about monster density in Rifts that we're definitely aware of. So, density aside, what are some things that would make Rifts more exciting to you?

Please feel free to free-form your answer. If you’re not sure where to begin, though, I’ve provided some questions below.

  • Does the atmosphere in a Rift influence how exciting or not exciting it feels? If yes, what Rift environments feel exciting to you? And which ones don’t?
  • Do certain monster groups feel more or less engaging?
  • Are there any mechanics from other parts of the game that you feel would make Rifts feel more exciting? If yes, what are those mechanics?
  • What's the most noticeable difference between a “boring” Rift and an “exciting” Rift for you?


I want to point out that because they are fully randomized there will be some Rifts that are more exciting than others, but we definitely want them to feel engaging and rewarding. We'd love to hear what you think would improve them in that way.


Thanks for asking the question and looking for ways to improve the game. My time in D1 & D2 are some of my most fond memories of gaming and it is the reason I bought D3 and hope to see this game some day hold it's predecessors same esteem in the hearts and minds of all Diablo fans.

Rifts could be GODLY interesting, you've already crafted the formula and the concept but perhaps you were too close to realize it. When you enter the rift the dialogue tells you how rifts were opened to allow the Nephalem to challenge themselves by re-enacting the great battles of the past. Problem is, we're re-enacting the too recent past. We just left Pandemonium Fortress, thanks, no need to redo what I did an hour ago. The rifts are the perfect place to give us what we've been asking you for going on ten years now....Diablo 1 & 2 playable in HD glory!

Let us replay the greatest maps, dungeons, scenarios and bosses that we knew and loved so well in the first two games. You've already set the stage to go back in time, heck half your tiles sets could easily be translated into the D1 & D2 environs and story lines. You want Rifts to be Epic and fun, then use them as the means to go back in time and play the best of the best from the first 2 games. People who played and remember fighting Baal and Mephisto will relish reliving with the new engine and loot...people who never played the first two will finally get a taste of what we've been raving about for the last decade. Truly have them feel like time traveling by zoning into a Rift and standing there Deckard Cain and you have to help him escape and basically replay act 1 from D2. (But Rift style, a map not an act but with some rares and events that give the flavor of Act 1.)

It would be truly epic to feel like you are really going back in time to the characters and settings from D1 & D2 and experience that game in modern graphics glory. Even one map, one rift at a time added to the random mix would be a super cool addition. Have those maps drop legendaries that are modern interpretations of Legs from those games. EPIC! That's right, legs that only come from specific rifts which are randomly generated. Makes opening up that portal a lot more exciting.

Since they are just rifts, you can piecemeal patch out diff maps and tiles sets as updates every few months and the fans will go nuts. How about a true COW LEVEL RIFT??? Come on, we've been begging for this stuff. Heck there are plenty of threads just asking you to patch the graphics of D1&2 so we can play that at high res.

You want to know what will fix the boredom and make D3 fun....well that's it, use your tools, tech, and awesome foundation from D3 to allow us to go back in time and replay all our best moments and favorite battles of D1 & D2. You'd have years of patches and content to deliver if you did JUST THAT while working on the next xpac where we all look forward to killing diablo...yet again! :-)

Beyond that, many of the changes that came with RoS, including Rifts, were a giant step in the right direction, we are not 'there' yet in terms of where I think the game needs to be in order to have the same epic replay-ability that it's predecessors did and the Rift issue is one small part of that.

The biggest issue is that the risk/reward time invested-rewards gained scale is still not correctly balanced. Many have pointed out how mob health/damage scales totally out of whack with leg drops and that's still gotta be fixed. If old D2 boss runs were the model, then you're still missing the mark because a boss run was a guaranteed leg and I've gone 2-3 T2-3 rifts without so much as a soul dropping and that's demotivating.

A rift should be a guaranteed soul at the minimum. Since legs roll RNG, you end up using many, many souls just trying to get a set item you can work with at the enchanter to FIX into something that's an upgrade. And the enchanter eats souls like they are a bucket of wings from KFC. It feels like Blizzard is afraid of us getting too many legendaries and you guys really need to get over that. What would help with that would be more, better, and interesting legendaries and YES, do have some that are exclusive to each Torment level so that the god awful spike in mob health has a reward.

Remove the low level set items from the high T1+ loot tables. Blackthornes should not drop in Torment, the class sets should, way more often. Cause...RNG gives bad rolls a plenty.

Why is there zero difference in Leg drop rate in the first four tiers of difficulty? Norm-Hard-Expert-Master.....every step up should increase chances and contain stuff only found there. If Blackthornes is the starter set, keep it in norm and normal alone. Take it out of the higher tiers. More legs, more diversity. Make more and spread them out rather than having them drop less or worrying that we get too many.

That's my two cents anyway. Biggest thing I cannot emphasize enough though is the opportunity to make Rifts great is as simple as looking to the best of D1 & D2 and finally letting us 'go back in time' and relive those epic battles. Bring back those maps & bosses as rifts.
events, mini bosses in front of exits, levels only filled with elites


Rift Mechanics - I would really like to have white to have a chance to drop legendary.
Rift Mechanics - Purple monsters that drop crafting agents pop in the rift in place of some of the elites. Also Rift Guardian can also be bosses that drop crafting agents. So that doing rift is double purpose. you have a chance to get crafting agents but its also randomized so you don't know what crafting agents you gonna get. Or crafting agents can be included in the loot table of Rift Guardians but its totally random. This Rift Guardian has a chance to drop 1 of 5 different crafting materials. That Rift Guardian another 5 and so on and so forth



...Good idea...

To add to this, crafting agents don't drop often however I have a ton of materials to create a bunch of things but I don't get recipe drops...wth?

So if we found crafting agents while doing bounties and had a higher chance of finding the actual recipes in rifts, I think this will balance things out because I'm running out of stash space keeping all the ingredients in the hopes of fining plans ONE DAY.

And for crying out loud, lower the drop-rate of Adventurers Journals to like 0.0%.
I have like 20 of these and I haven't EVER used one...really!!
I still think the loot is the issue. I will grind for hours if I'm getting some hint of increase in loot; likewise, I'm less likely to play when it seems like I'm grinding for drops that are only worse than my mediocre gear (my gear is up to mediocre, right?)

So, how about:
    Give us guaranteed 6 levels for rifts.

    Each level has an objective. Like someone else suggested, make the objectives designed to be failed 30% of the time by an appropriately geared team. Things like protect the totem, kill the demon hoard, move the totems by interacting with map elements that trigger elite packs, etc

    Each objective can be solved two or more ways to give different buffs; for example, a team might select survivability because they're gear is not adequate or they might pick legendaries or even set drop buffs.

    Have people pick items from the levels to trigger the loot table...i mean boss...they're most interested in seeing. Randomize the triggers every week so that you don't make it too easy.
    When all else fails, give us a new Care Bear achievement for caring enough to Rift again and again.
04/22/2014 12:09 PMPosted by Latree
why end it with one rift boss? if we get the first spawn, add another bar, now when that fills F it you proc two bosses...then another BAR for a total of 3 rift bosses!!!!!! that epic fun. think outside the box guys you can do it.


Along this idea, a progressive rift, where you fill a bar spawn a boss, he dies and you get a new bar but everything goes up a tier in difficulty and it keeps resetting so long as the boss dies and you don't. So you could start at Normal and work your way up to T6 if you wanted to. Sort of an endless rift providing you don't die. Loot, Gold, Xp, Drops also scale up with each bar, mobs & boss you successfully kill. Mini-hardcore taste for those who don't actually want to risk character loss so instead all you're risking is the 5 shards to open the rift and you might die and not get to a boss.

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