Petition for Woh

Wizard
OP,

Since you were blunt, I'll be blunt. I find your post completely ludicrous, and I mean "ludicrous" in any way, shape, form, or other connotation that you can possibly infer. Ludicrous.

06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
Something to note : Since the Kadala change making her hand out " more class specifiics " I can honestly say I have noticed no change.
Ok, so first of all, the changes to Kadala have NOTHING to do with legendaries. Nadda. Zilch. Zip. You simply no longer gamble rare weapons that your class can't utilize. I'll find the blue post if you need it. So right off the back, this part of your discussion is invalid.

06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
Some people in my position have had gripes with that edge that is given to them, but I don't.


Can you show me a post where people have complained about the pity timer? I've never seen one in the Wizard Forum, and contrary to what many think, I do read outside of this forum. So...where were the Elitist Jerks complaining about the Filthy Casuals in regards to the Pity Timer?

06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
For those of you out there, flame me if you must, I am honestly not going to read or care about such posts. I am only interested in hearing similar stories if there are any and hopefully get an answer from a blue.


This was probably the most irritating thing you wrote, in my opinion. You are pretty much saying, "I'll talk to you if you agree with me." Cool.

06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
I'm starting to wonder if it could be that my account is glitched in some way ?


If you are seriously considering this Cloak and Dagger, Conspiracy Theory kind of thing, it's ridiculous. Jaetch has never found a Tal Rasha's Allegiance and he has more hours logged than blah blah blah. I don't think he's put on the Tin Foil Suit yet either...

06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
Easily ~90%-95% percent of the wizards I have seen in public games with the item were significantly lower level than myself and had a massively lower number of rifts completed ( there is also no telling here of how many they have actually fully cleared VS purchased via RiF)

Please tell me you have a pen and paper next to your computer where you have two columns:

A)Those with Woh's above my level
B)Those with Woh's before my level

I somehow find it hard to believe that your "percentages" are anything more than part of a rant to solidify your point :) Come clean.

I'm not flaming you. You may read it as such - and yes, I find your post highly aggravating, but honestly, what I take issue with is why you feel that you, or I, or any player, has the right to acquire this weapon. Why? You're entitled to play the game, and have random, sometimes good, oftentimes bad, gear drop for you. That's it. That's all. You're not entitled to this weapon...no matter how many hours you have logged. No Blue is likely to come in here, nor do I feel that they should.

06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
So once again, I ask you, what the f ?


My thoughts exactly.

_____
-Melk
At the end of the day, it's all A Love Story
~OG Wizard from an OG Forum~
~iRap, You probz don't~
https://www.youtube.com/user/MikeyMayez
06/07/2014 08:03 AMPosted by Melkor
Can you show me a post where people have complained about the pity timer? I've never seen one in the Wizard Forum, and contrary to what many think, I do read outside of this forum. So...where were the Elitist Jerks complaining about the Filthy Casuals in regards to the Pity Timer?


It's mostly been a lot of stuff I have read from players over the weeks from in game. Be it from people in the clan I was in or various people in public game / RiF games. I recall seeing some threads on here about the matter a while ago, might have been in the GD section, but I couldn't point them out at this time.

06/07/2014 08:03 AMPosted by Melkor
This was probably the most irritating thing you wrote, in my opinion. You are pretty much saying, "I'll talk to you if you agree with me." Cool.


The point of this wasn't to come out as condescending, but rather to just state out upfront that I wouldn't get into flame wars with posts that are outright unconstructive. You guys are allowed / welcome to disagree all you want and I'll gladly discuss the matter, as long as you're making an intelligent post -- this post I am making right now is a testimony of that.

06/07/2014 08:03 AMPosted by Melkor
If you are seriously considering this Cloak and Dagger, Conspiracy Theory kind of thing, it's ridiculous. Jaetch has never found a Tal Rasha's Allegiance and he has more hours logged than blah blah blah. I don't think he's put on the Tin Foil Suit yet either...


I never stated that this wasn't a stretch, because it is. But, I vaguely remember seeing reports of items not dropping for some periods of time, etc. There's also always a bunch of glitches from within the game that Blizzard are working at fixing. Yeah it's a bit ridiculous to think that. I never said I was convinced either, but this is a video game after all, stuff can and will break at times.

06/07/2014 08:03 AMPosted by Melkor
Please tell me you have a pen and paper next to your computer where you have two columns:

A)Those with Woh's above my level
B)Those with Woh's before my level

I somehow find it hard to believe that your "percentages" are anything more than part of a rant to solidify your point :) Come clean


No I don't have a pen. But I can tell you with complete honesty and certainty that from the 1000s of RiF games I've been a runner for, I can count the higher Plvl / more rifts completed with Woh on one hand. No joke here. Might be a fluke odd-wise, I wouldn't put it past that. But still in comparison to the ton of lower ones I've seen ( which I couldn't even keep track of -- there were so many ) I find it rather astounding.

06/07/2014 08:03 AMPosted by Melkor
My thoughts exactly.


Glad we can at least agree on that. XD

On a side note though -- larger scale type thing. From the replies so far I think people misunderstood my post a little.

This post is first of all, about a legit petition I want to start for an item rename that I feel would be somewhat appropriate whilst tongue-in-cheek, if anything.

Some view it as a QQ thread. I can't deny that the search for this item has been more than aggravating by now, but the post is about more than that. The last part of my OP is a very important point I tried to bring up and it feels like most people have glanced right over it.

The whole mid-part of my OP with the stats and explanation of how I have farmed for so long are there to illustrate a point. If you are looking solely for 1 rare item, whether it be Woh or anything really hard to find, the current methods at finding them is maddening / ludicrous. This is in the sense that items are all general drops now for the most part and there is no single effective way at target farming anything. I believe this to be a significant issue with the current state of the game.

That being said however, I still think taking out the AH / trading was a good move. I just believe , as stated in OP, that maybe a way to reward players that work very hard at bettering their gear would be good to have. As suggested earlier, I think being able to buy a randomly rolled *specific* legendary from Kadala at an outrageous price ( be it shards / gold / crafting mats / death's breaths / even adv. journals ) would be a good thing to implement. It would also let the more dedicated players have a use for those items they are stockpiling at the moment and serve no purpose. (edit) It would also make gambling feel like an actual gamble if you had to choose whether to chance shards / mats , instead of saving them up to a massive amount for 1 guaranteed item. (edit)

I was merely attempting to bluntly point out what I feel is a flaw at the moment. With my current Woh search as an example with actual numbers. For you who thought I felt "entitled to woh", no I don't. I get that RNG is RNG and if I want it bad enough I'll keep farming, Im not asking for a drop rate raise, or for the devs to just hand me one out. If I decide to stop caring and farming, then that's that.

The point still stands though, and I will say again, please sign here if you would like this item to be renamed.

Best of luck.
-Will
06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
Dear wiz community & blues.

The wand needs renamed to Wand of Woe.

No kidding, the drop rate on this item is absolute misery. Here are some stats for you to glance at:

- P. Level 448
-1685 Rifts completed ** Read below
-100k blood shards
- # of wands found thus far : 111
-Between 400-500 hours played since RoS launch.

And yet, no wand of woh has dropped.

As far as the rifts themselves are concerned, The number shown above is only for my own character's personal sheet. I have mobilized a lot of help (wife / friends) who tried to help me find the damn thing.

In actuality, the accurate number of rifts done would be the following:

-1685 on my character ( all done on wizard )
- 682 on my wife's account ( she has only rifted with me on her wizard so far to help me out)
- At least ~250 rifts from multiple friends put together ( note that the actual number is probably nearly twice as much, I'm being conservative here for accuracy's sake)

So all in all, add the numbers together and you get a whopping 2617 rifts completed.


Bear in mind that the aforementionned rifts have all been ran fully & not bought through RiF as an opener, with the exception of maybe about 40-50 ~ of them.

As far as the blood shards are concerned, only 10k out of the 100k were spent at the start of RoS to kickstart my character gear wise. The remaining entirety of the 90k were all spent on 1 handers.

Something to note : Since the Kadala change making her hand out " more class specifiics " I can honestly say I have noticed no change. It seemed to work for the first 2-3 days where she gave me a few more wands than usual, but since then. I can guarantee you it has at least reverted back to it's previous state ( it even feels to me like she drops even less nowadays). I haven't gotten a single wand off of her in about 6-7 days as of when I write this post. Wands themselves also seemed to drop a lot less in rifts for the past few days. We have been averaging a considerably smaller amount than prior on a daily basis.

____

Now I know most of you might be inclined to flame and bring up something along the lines of "it's just RNG dude , get your head out of your...... " But let's talk about the rates for a bit.

111 wands so far.

According to the droprates on diabloinc (which potentially aren't accurate / might've been altered) we are talking about a 1.52% chance of a dropped wand to roll into a Woh. After some simple math you come up to 168.72%. I am full aware that the first wand has the same odds as the 1 billionth one you find to be a woh. Still the laws of statistics and average should come to factor in given a large enough sample pool.

In comparison I can safely say that I have found just about every other item out there at least once / in multiple copies. Including some excessively rare items -- WH , Ice climbers, 4x Xephirian amulets, about 10 Countess Cameos, More soj / Maras than i can count , all the wizard set pieces in tons of copies and finally even the extremely elusive Star of Azkaranth.

This begs the question: What the F,,,? After running with 2+ wizards relentlessly and bringing a ton of people in across games, still nothing. I have had 2 clanmates who have found Woh on their wizard alts, even though they have played maybe a total of 10 hours on them.

So once again, I ask you, what the f ?

I'm starting to wonder if it could be that my account is glitched in some way ? Or maybe the pre-set loot tables theory (although I don't honestly believe in those)?

Before we go any farther, I would like to state that I am sorry if I come off as angry. It isn't the intent of this post, but I am feeling deeply aggravated. I know RNG is RNG, but something feels off here. Easily ~90%-95% percent of the wizards I have seen in public games with the item were significantly lower level than myself and had a massively lower number of rifts completed ( there is also no telling here of how many they have actually fully cleared VS purchased via RiF)

I have lost pretty much all motivation to farm at this point and I am in sincere honesty (without anger) debating if I should just un-install the game. Pressing on seems rather pointless and hopeless at this juncture.

One last point to arise and maybe food for thought. We all know about the "pity timer" that caters to helping out more casual / occasional players by handing them a bunch of candy upon returning after a lot of inactivity. I am not a casual, this doesn't benefit me in any form. Some people in my position have had gripes with that edge that is given to them, but I don't.

One could ponder though: If they do indeed get handouts for not having as much time to play as others, wouldn't it be fair to have a system to reward players that have played for an obscene amount of hours just to unsuccessfully get that one item? What about those ~25,000 Death's Breaths in my stash? Couldn't we just hand out an insane amount of those to buy a randomly rolled *specific* legendary off Kadala? Or how about letting us gamble for in-game gold too, since dedicated players are mostly in the same boat as myself, sitting on a literal crap ton of it.

As a last word I would like to apologize again, for coming off as blunt. I do still feel like my post raises good points / concerns about the new system where you can't trade items, etc. It would be very very very much appreciated if a blue took the time to answer and acknowledge this post. Fellow players are also welcome to add their own similar stories and sign this petition for what I think would be an ironically awesome rename.

For those of you out there, flame me if you must, I am honestly not going to read or care about such posts. I am only interested in hearing similar stories if there are any and hopefully get an answer from a blue.

Thanks if you read all this and best of luck to you guys out there.
- Will


WoW was the first leg wand that ever dropped for me on my wiz. :\ Soz mate.
Hmmm, I think the problem: WoW is a must-have item if you want EB build. Smk, calamity, krindershot... does not make a specific build, they're just support items.
With all EB threads (and video) posted in this forum I believe every WZ want to try EB build, but very few can.
=> Dev team may need to update game's loot pool, items which are essential to a build should have a better droprate so people can enjoy the build.

Same problem will happen to WD if Smk is needed for Fetish pet build, fortunately there is a passive to reduce cooldown, so why don't add a passive + 2 EB for WZ ^____^
dont look for the item and it will show up, I found mine like with in a week of ros release. at that time I wasn't even looking for woh, and after 2 months playing with it. I can also tell u this wand isn't as op most ppl think it is, I test both dps version which sacking cooldown to 50 for more damage out put and mass cooldown version which aim for 60+. both dont contribute much in a t6 group, its very overated.
06/07/2014 12:46 AMPosted by Lance
06/06/2014 04:29 PMPosted by Starless
111 wands so far.

According to the droprates on diabloinc (which potentially aren't accurate / might've been altered) we are talking about a 1.52% chance of a dropped wand to roll into a Woh. After some simple math you come up to 168.72%. I am full aware that the first wand has the same odds as the 1 billionth one you find to be a woh. Still the laws of statistics and average should come to factor in given a large enough sample pool.


Uh... what is this math? Did you really just multiply the 1.52% chance to drop times 111? That is one of the dumbest thing I have ever seen. That's not how probability works.

Let's dissect your current situation. There are two values here that are of interest.

1) You have found 111 wands with none of them being Wand of Wohs.
2) The (supposed) chance for a wand to be a Wand of Woh is 1.52%.

So, the chance for a wand to NOT be a Wand of Woh is 98.48%. Mathematical and engineering notation for this is 98.48/100 or 0.9848.

Now assuming you have not found a Wand of Woh in 111 wand drops, we can calculate the exact chance for this scenario to occur. This can be done by simply multiplying the chance of each consecutive instance to not be a Wand of Woh. So this is done by simply multiplying out 0.9848 exactly 111 times.

0.9848^111 = 0.1827
0.1827 = 18.27/100 = 18.27%


Your particular scenario in which you did not find a Wand of Woh in 111 wand drops has an 18.27% chance of happening.

I'm sorry but I had to point out that your math makes no sense.

Also, some advice:

http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/13087128673?page=1#0


What are you talking about, 1.52% chances over 111 drops means statistically he should have got 1.68 Wand of Woh. But realistically he got 0, which is very close to his odds.
In my opinion, Wand of Woh should be rare and not obtainable either:

- easily (less than 1 year played)
- at all (if less than 0,5 year played)

BUT, this should be the case for all the best-best items across the classes.

_______________________
Wizard Guides and Community
http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/topic/9476737586
Wand of Woh is over hyped boring play style wand. You're not missing much. I got several drops all almost max damaged roll WoW's and I used them for like 3 hours and got bored. To be fair I never wanted one to begin with but you're not missing much. And being forced to play melee is not fun. At least with CM build you pretty much had no cool down teleport and frost nova so it was sort of fun but this melee build is NOT fun. It's just strong on higher torment that's it.
06/07/2014 01:59 PMPosted by ChimpMagnet
What are you talking about, 1.52% chances over 111 drops means statistically he should have got 1.68 Wand of Woh. But realistically he got 0, which is very close to his odds.


That would be correct, I don't think they understood what my math was supposed to represent. The math they did was essentially the backwards way to look at it, where you question what my odds are at "being this unlucky". The math that was done for that purpose was accurate though, from my knowledge.

Also, quick update, up to 115 wands now, still no dice.
06/07/2014 01:59 PMPosted by ChimpMagnet
What are you talking about, 1.52% chances over 111 drops means statistically he should have got 1.68 Wand of Woh. But realistically he got 0, which is very close to his odds.


You misunderstood what I posted.

I was simply pointing out that his math that his chance of getting a Wand of Woh is 168.72% is incorrect. His particular situation in which he did not get a Wand of Woh out of 111 wands has an 18.27% chance of happening.

This means that his chance of getting that Wand of Woh in 111 wands was actually an 81.73% chance.

So yes, he was a little unlucky but not ridiculously unlucky.
honestly I think current drop rate on woh is fine, n this thread is bit stupid cos many other items have similar drop rate but I don't see anyone complaining bout em..
i.e. witching hour, lacuni prowlers, spectrum, the star of azkaranth, etc etc
06/07/2014 05:31 PMPosted by aw3s0m0
honestly I think current drop rate on woh is fine, n this thread is bit stupid cos many other items have similar drop rate but I don't see anyone complaining bout em..
i.e. witching hour, lacuni prowlers, spectrum, the star of azkaranth, etc etc


Yeah the drop rate is definitely fine. The drop rates of these rarest class weapons for DH, WD and Wiz (around 1.5%) makes it so that whilst it is indeed difficult to find them, the majority of dedicated players who stick to the class over a period of 6 months would have looted one or more. If the drop rate was increased such that every player would have the item after a certain period of time (whether by increasing the drop rate or making it "purchasable"), then the item itself would lose its prestige and in fact finally finding it would not be as satisfying. Looting an item such as WoW is supposed to be "THE OMFG" moment for the player which brings sheer excitement...rather than "ok got a new WoW, damn it only rolled slightly above average in comparison to the 5 others WoWs i found/gambled/bought, still trying to get that quadfecta max roll, gotta farm/gamble/buy another few over the next week or so..."
I don't get this kind of posts. I mean you are playing Diablo right? In this kind of game your patience will be tested. You will be punished and you will be demotivated. You should know that if you have played previous Diablo games. Heck I got 2 Wohs dropped for me and I am still not satisfied. I want a higher roll. I know my odds of that would almost be zero. But yeah I still keep on farming. It does not matter how many hours you spent or whatever sample you have there. Take the punishment, have some patience. It will drop.
100k bloodshard. Good one, I would like a screen shot of that 100k bloodshard on your character history.
06/07/2014 08:44 PMPosted by Spacter
100k bloodshard. Good one, I would like a screen shot of that 100k bloodshard on your character history.


Lol, I don't see how that's so special, but okay.

http://imgur.com/uCkGjUV
id rather use magic missile conflag than punishing my fingers spamming EB all day. And yes i have a WOW, believe me id rather use serpent sparker over it XD
06/07/2014 09:08 PMPosted by yems
id rather use magic missile conflag than punishing my fingers spamming EB all day. And yes i have a WOW, believe me id rather use serpent sparker over it XD


Or you can macro it using your mouse software.
06/07/2014 09:12 PMPosted by Jormugrand
Or you can macro it using your mouse software.


well isn't that considered cheating? hehehe
wahhhhh

but really,

06/07/2014 11:54 AMPosted by qdt
Hmmm, I think the problem: WoW is a must-have item if you want EB build. Smk, calamity, krindershot... does not make a specific build, they're just support items.
With all EB threads (and video) posted in this forum I believe every WZ want to try EB build, but very few can.
=> Dev team may need to update game's loot pool, items which are essential to a build should have a better droprate so people can enjoy the build.

Same problem will happen to WD if Smk is needed for Fetish pet build, fortunately there is a passive to reduce cooldown, so why don't add a passive + 2 EB for WZ ^____^


says it all

and honestly... a jeram pet doc can compete on even footing with a wow wiz... sooooo whatever
It's not really that powerful.

So yes, they should have made it more common.

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