Loot Tables Confirmed - Live on Theorycraft Stream

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Feel free to read into this any way you like:

On stream, Nevalistis found an "Adventurer's Journal" which was supposed to be removed.
Also on stream, Travis Day then remarked "Hey, that's not supposed to be there anymore...I had to look through 38 tables before the patch."
You're Fired!
hahaha... I will watch that later
LOL!

I can see this blowing way out of control... or not.
Database tables, not the "loot tables" concept people have been talking about.

Yes, it'll probably blow up regardless.
A table that lists, enumerates even, the possible named items, is not the same as a loot table.

Obviously there's going to be a list, somewhere, that has all the different possible drops. It's probably even some type of array (which is a table in layman's terms).

It does not equate to a loot table, which is a pre-generated list of the possible items for that given instance.

Which of course, don't exist, and programatically is probably even more complex to do that to just reference an array (or 38 arrays, depending on the scenario, apparently).

So, no, not confirmed.
This has already been well known for a long time. Haven't you paid attention to the daily play threads that show proof of it?

Not sure why players seem so obsessed over this.
The entire 'loot table' thing has been hilariously uninformed from the start. Are there tables that the game code refers to when checking for loot? Yes, of course there are.

Are those tables limited in some way depending on when your game was created, character birth date or phase of the moon? No, they aren't.

X happens. A random roll is done to get a result. The result is checked against a table. That's pretty much how it works since the 1990's including paper and pencil RPG's.
Yes, weighted loot tables exist, which is what I'm saying. And it's because I'd those unlucky complainers that these wild theories are being thrown around... Loot based on character and game creation dates? Don't be rediculous. That's what I say to all those people.
06/12/2014 03:49 PMPosted by Raticus79
Database tables, not the "loot tables" concept people have been talking about.

Yes, it'll probably blow up regardless.


+100

It's database tables, little surprising that it's 38 of them, but I wouldn't expect a normalized database at all for a game. Performance concerns you know.

But please, continue to don your tinfoil caps and cry about it till you get a CM to clarify what was said. That will be fun to hear.
06/12/2014 05:14 PMPosted by Shmuck

Are you a special child? Just because you don't know how to code it doesn't mean it's complex. I myself know how to code this and in my current degree I haven't even started programming yet. Not for me to brag, just my point is that it's not hard at all. So yes, yes confirmed. And maybe if you count one extra variable to reference more complex than yeh, it's more complex.


I have a degree in programming, thank you. I understand how to code it.

You'd also need to have more than just one extra parameter. The least DB-intensive way to do what you're suggest is to fill an array with random numbers that correspond to a key field in a DB-table, so no DB query is actually performed unless an item is determined to drop. Then you'd randomly select one of the 20 (or whatever you kids are saying) numbers from the array and use that to query the DB for the item's specs (if that's how their stored).

So, you have to perform a random selection, store it, then select from it at random, then query the database with that result, all after having already determined whether or not a legendary is going to drop (and what table it needs to query).

OR

After determining legendary drop and the proper table, query the table randomly and get your result.

One of those things, when reproduced thousands and thousands of times over and over again per day, takes up a lot more system resources than the other.

That's just one of many ways it could be coded. I'd just like to see a good example of a way a loot table in any way makes logical programming sense, gameplay sense, or economical sense. So far, no one has been able to do that.
06/12/2014 03:31 PMPosted by Anomalous
Also on stream, Travis Day then remarked "Hey, that's not supposed to be there anymore...I had to look through 38 tables before the patch."


This was taken extremely out of context.

The Legendary crafting materials functioned differently than other items, because they were from specific creatures. Those specific creatures had allocations (or loot tables) for those items, and that's what was needed to be investigated to remove them.

In this case "loot tables" refer to the difference between the items a Treasure Goblin has a tendency to drop versus a common enemy versus an Elite or Rare mob. That's what Travis was referring to - not to the popular (and incorrect) theory that items are seeded by things like player name or shoe size or game creation at midnight versus 10 AM. Those things have no bearing on the items you are able to find.

None of this is new information. Grimiku referenced a similar situation in regards to Crafting recipes less than a month ago.
06/12/2014 03:31 PMPosted by Anomalous
Also on stream, Travis Day then remarked "Hey, that's not supposed to be there anymore...I had to look through 38 tables before the patch."

This was taken extremely out of context.

The Legendary crafting materials functioned differently than other items, because they were from specific creatures. Those specific creatures had allocations (or loot tables) for those items, and that's what was needed to be investigated to remove them.

In this case "loot tables" refer to the difference between the items a Treasure Goblin has a tendency to drop versus a common enemy versus an Elite or Rare mob. That's what Travis was referring to - not to the popular (and incorrect) theory that items are seeded by things like player name or shoe size or game creation at midnight versus 10 AM. Those things have no bearing on the items you are able to find.

None of this is new information. Grimiku referenced a similar situation in regards to Crafting recipes less than a month ago.


Conspiracy theories aside, sometimes its so hard to shake off the feeling of the existence of a "loot table" when the exact same item (of course with different stats) drop for 3 of the party members from a single rift.
Those tinfoil hats are mighty trendy these days...
06/12/2014 06:09 PMPosted by Nevalistis

In this case "loot tables" refer to the difference between the items a Treasure Goblin has a tendency to drop versus a common enemy versus an Elite or Rare mob. That's what Travis was referring to - not to the popular (and incorrect) theory that items are seeded by things like player name or shoe size or game creation at midnight versus 10 AM. Those things have no bearing on the items you are able to find.

Good thing I wear my size 12 shoe at midnight on my left foot only and my size 13 shoe on my right foot at 10AM. It's raining magefists and Woh's!
06/12/2014 06:19 PMPosted by Dathremar
Conspiracy theories aside, sometimes its so hard to shake off the feeling of the existence of a "loot table" when the exact same item (of course with different stats) drop for 3 of the party members from a single rift.

Isn't it easier to think there's a bug somewhere in the random number generation algorithms than to believe in complicated conspiracy theories? It's not as if we haven't seen plenty of bugs in the game so far and random number generation bugs would be difficult-to-impossible to reproduce.
I find 2 thing really funny here. First, OP is clearly trolling or real dumb. And he apparently deserved a blue response.

Second, Nevalistis didn't deny exactly the theory I believe in, of loot tables dependant on simply game session.

Or else, RNG in this game is simply broken. How com I get 2 of the same leg bracer out of a singl cache? on torment, where the loot table is vastly bigger.
Posted by Dathremar
Conspiracy theories aside, sometimes its so hard to shake off the feeling of the existence of a "loot table" when the exact same item (of course with different stats) drop for 3 of the party members from a single rift.

Isn't it easier to think there's a bug somewhere in the random number generation algorithms than to believe in complicated conspiracy theories? It's not as if we haven't seen plenty of bugs in the game so far and random number generation bugs would be difficult-to-impossible to reproduce.


Sure we could see it like that as well. When Grandfathers and Faithful Memories start dropping for for everyone in the party, I always take it as a sign to either remake a new game (just to be on the safe side) or go out for some fresh air.

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