Season-exclusive loot is GREAT!

General Discussion
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06/21/2014 03:22 PMPosted by Crushade
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You chose to ignore my question.
Two BRAND SPANKING NEW players both start playing when 2.1 hits.

One plays season mode, one plays non-season mode.

Both are doing the EXACT SAME THINGS. One gets access to newer loots why?

And btw, the bounties question was already answered.
At least everyone has access to it without having to restart everything and forsaking their current heroes.


Not forsaking their current heroes. They get all progress at end of season. Are you a brand new player come 2.1? If so then I would play season. Since all progress (except lvl 1-70) rolls over to non season characters. The season character gets access to more loot cause' he is playing in a different game mode.

If I choose not to do bounties then it is not available to me. It is the same as you choosing not to do seasons. Except, it will eventually be available. Further, if I do not like bounties I cannot do rifts or gamble blood shards either. Boy I feel for the person that doesnt enjoy doing bounties.
06/21/2014 03:54 PMPosted by Xynic
06/21/2014 03:51 PMPosted by Crushade
Xynic, read my posts again. It might be on the page prior. I did answer it. Several times over.


Actually, you only said something to the effect of "herp derp of course I'll just play ladder, herp derp"
Instead of answering WHY the ladder player who is doing the EXACT same thing as the other non ladder player gets more rewards.


Well, now that I know you are having an issue with reading comprehension, above I have quoted the entire conversation to ensure the integrity of the context remain intact.

You have stated, in fact, that seasons will not be the same as non seasons gameplay and that you have no interest in it. Seasons is a competitive environment, separate to your current gold, paragon, and hand me down gear, that is going to allow people to compete against each other for glory, achievements and to view how you stack up on a leader board. It is entirely different from non-season.

I have now iterated the answer several different ways in hopes that you can understand it.
06/21/2014 04:06 PMPosted by Orrion
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So, again, this question you KEPT dodging.

If two people both bought ros post 2.1, and one plays ladder but the other doesn't, why should the ladder player get rewarded more?

They're doing the exact.same.things.


My first thought to that question is "who cares?" Are you one of those people? No. That a brand spanking new player can get a small advantage initially is irrelevant -

- Especially since many people on your side apparently won't ever play non-Seasons again. That means after the first Season these hypothetical players joined in ends, any advantage that Seasonal player had is nullified by the reset.

We could also look 5 years down the line and ask the same question, but at that point there will be so many items already added to both (assuming each new Season has new items) that the additions in the 10th Season specifically are pretty negligible to the whole.


There's not gonna be a "5 years down the road" if blizzard keeps alienating parts of its player base.
06/21/2014 04:45 PMPosted by DexterousGek
You say that, but Blizz and the majority of the community like the idea of exclusive insentives. Sorry. Blizz trumps whiny !@#$%.


can you post a survey that proves that a majority of the community supports season only items. also not company can be in business for very long if they are a$$s to their customers. o and thank you for calling me a Whiny !@#S%. what ever that means.
if 2 players joined the same day seasons were implemented, and neither person had a single friend already playing, then I would think they should BOTH start with a ladder character. I mean, why wouldn't they?
06/21/2014 05:03 PMPosted by Mike276
06/21/2014 04:45 PMPosted by DexterousGek
You say that, but Blizz and the majority of the community like the idea of exclusive insentives. Sorry. Blizz trumps whiny !@#$%.


can you post a survey that proves that a majority of the community supports season only items. also not company can be in business for very long if they are a$$s to their customers. o and thank you for calling me a Whiny !@#S%. what ever that means.


Ah, so you believe that blizz is making this change despite the majority of the community being against it?
06/21/2014 05:12 PMPosted by DexterousGek
Ah, so you believe that blizz is making this change despite the majority of the community being against it?


never claimed my side was the majority. were is PvP i heard they were a majority to.
Interesting topic and both sides have valid arguments.

While, I will play ladders, I do feel for others that don't.

I play HC exclusively but don't get rewarded, so with ladders

it seems that the play style isn't incentive enough.

I believe many will only play ladders for items, and don't give a crap

about the competition.


Blizzard seems to be very adept at making bad,(wrong) decisions,

and this may be another.

This game was mostly a single player game, which they forced a

online only muti-player version on us.

They gutted many skills, trading and seem to have a knack at removing

things, instead of fixing them.

This move will alienate more players, as these modes split the player base.


Wish i could add something...... But yep like udnerlined
People will never be fully happy with this game..why? Becuase this game is never the same game you played 6 months ago, the same 6 months that is now become a waste of your time.
06/21/2014 04:48 PMPosted by Xynic
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My first thought to that question is "who cares?" Are you one of those people? No. That a brand spanking new player can get a small advantage initially is irrelevant -

- Especially since many people on your side apparently won't ever play non-Seasons again. That means after the first Season these hypothetical players joined in ends, any advantage that Seasonal player had is nullified by the reset.

We could also look 5 years down the line and ask the same question, but at that point there will be so many items already added to both (assuming each new Season has new items) that the additions in the 10th Season specifically are pretty negligible to the whole.


There's not gonna be a "5 years down the road" if blizzard keeps alienating parts of its player base.


So quit.
06/21/2014 05:38 PMPosted by Orrion
So quit.


we do not want to quit. we want to tell blizzard that we are unhappy, why we are unhappy and what they can do to fix what we think the problem is. which is season only items. this is not the first time blizzard alienated its player base.

nerfing content
not adding PvP
having a action house
removing the action house
added BoA

not all of these are negatives for me, but these are problems for other players.
06/21/2014 02:02 PMPosted by Tarnen
Since when did some one else's loot affect your ability to play and enjoy the game? Never.

And yet, here we are, with pro-exclusive players fighting tooth and nail to ensure that a segment of the player base does not have access to the same loot that they do. Which, by your very words, doesn't affect you at all.

Scenario 1: new loot is ladder only
Ladder players get to play ladder and find new legendaries.

Scenario 2: new loot drops in all modes
Ladder players get to play ladder and find new legendaries.

See how much it affects you?
06/21/2014 02:16 PMPosted by Orrion
And, seriously, come on. Leveling a new character is basically all you need to do if you want to have a shot at those new items before they fold over, and leveling isn't exactly difficult.

So if "leveling isn't exactly difficult", how does it merit exclusive new loot? Answer: it doesn't.
06/21/2014 02:17 PMPosted by Kelthar
And no, Seasons exclusive loot does not force you to play seasons any more than regular loot forces you to buy the game if you don't like it.

Of course it does. Regular loot is an intrinsic reward of the game, in that only people actually interested in playing Diablo care about it. Season-exclusive loot is an extrinsic reward, in that people who don't play seasons care about it too.
06/21/2014 05:53 PMPosted by Dogf
06/21/2014 02:02 PMPosted by Tarnen
Since when did some one else's loot affect your ability to play and enjoy the game? Never.

And yet, here we are, with pro-exclusive players fighting tooth and nail to ensure that a segment of the player base does not have access to the same loot that they do. Which, by your very words, doesn't affect you at all.

Scenario 1: new loot is ladder only
Ladder players get to play ladder and find new legendaries.

Scenario 2: new loot drops in all modes
Ladder players get to play ladder and find new legendaries.

See how much it affects you?


I believe Tarnen is responding to the notion that those who do not wish to play in ladder are "forced" to do so anyway. That, somehow, they are 2nd class if they don't.

Ladder exclusives promote ladder play and replay. I submit that gearing is pretty easy, and if Blizzard included these exclusive items to the general loot table, people would get them very quickly and easily. Even with them being exclusive, I imagine many power-gamer types will get some of the most coveted items within the first day.

For those of us who will not, these exclusive items provide a brand new item hunt, in a different context (starting over with nothing). I, for one, am willing to try it.
Dogf, it is a new mode with new incentive for it. Just as bounties and rifts have their exclusive rewards. The difference is now, with seasons, it's only timed exclusivity. This is a nice change in my opinion as bounty bag and torment have items that you can ONLY get there.

Feel free to read a couple pages back on what was already posted about it. There is no reason to get up in arms cause you don't want to play a certain game mode that doesn't interest you. Simply don't play it, then enjoy the new items when everybody gets them. It's not as if the season players get to use them on non season characters before you do.
06/21/2014 05:08 PMPosted by Caballero
if 2 players joined the same day seasons were implemented, and neither person had a single friend already playing, then I would think they should BOTH start with a ladder character. I mean, why wouldn't they?

Exactly, why wouldn't they? While a season is running, non-season becomes an inferior and pointless mode. That's what those of us who don't want to play seasons are complaining about.
I just don't understand what is so horrible about seasons that people definitely do not ever want to even look at it. There are a few things you can make point of in Seasons.

1. Seasons can basically be a Beta Test for the new Legs, seeing if they're good or not or riddled with unintentional bugs.

2. In all of a 6 month period you couldn't have seriously stuck to one single character in one single grind for perfect gear, that would get so boring!

3. The reason I will play seasons is simply because I want to see the new Legs and I create new characters often anyway, so I might as well go into Seasons. From what I know, seasons are basically a chance for players to suss out the new Legendary Items on a new skin, rather than looking at them from the same perspective as your main on the basis of "Will it get me into T6 or not?" - which really kills the good feeling of getting new loot.

So, is Season only loot really that horrible of an idea? Is absolutely refusing to play seasons not sounding extremely childish?
06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
I just don't understand what is so horrible about seasons that people definitely do not ever want to even look at it.

Blizzard set out from day 1 of designing D3 to make the skill and progression systems such that rerolling a character was redundant and tedious. You can respec your existing characters to whatever you want, and the levelling process never varies with regards to what you unlock when.

This is antithetical to the concept of "seasons", which thrive in an environment where rerolling a new character provides a different and interesting experience.

06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
1. Seasons can basically be a Beta Test for the new Legs, seeing if they're good or not or riddled with unintentional bugs.

We have PTRs for that.

06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
3. The reason I will play seasons is simply because I want to see the new Legs

What if you could see them without having to play seasons?

06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
So, is Season only loot really that horrible of an idea?

Yes.
06/21/2014 06:37 PMPosted by Dogf
06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
I just don't understand what is so horrible about seasons that people definitely do not ever want to even look at it.

Blizzard set out from day 1 of designing D3 to make the skill and progression systems such that rerolling a character was redundant and tedious. You can respec your existing characters to whatever you want, and the levelling process never varies with regards to what you unlock when.

This is antithetical to the concept of "seasons", which thrive in an environment where rerolling a new character provides a different and interesting experience.

06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
1. Seasons can basically be a Beta Test for the new Legs, seeing if they're good or not or riddled with unintentional bugs.

We have PTRs for that.

06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
3. The reason I will play seasons is simply because I want to see the new Legs

What if you could see them without having to play seasons?

06/21/2014 06:30 PMPosted by Oriviath
So, is Season only loot really that horrible of an idea?

Yes.


The basis of your argument lies in the fact that you want your loot how and when you want it. As dictated by you. A new game mode is being introduced with new incentives to play it. Timed season exclusive gear is a part of that incentive, like it or not. Blood shards are incentive for rifts, cache exclusive items for doing bounties and torment sets for doing torment. You might like the exclusive rewards for torment, rifts and bounties and others may not but there has to be incentive for everything. Carrot on the stick.

You don't want to play seasons, you don't have to. You will get access to the loot eventually anyway. That is not the case with bounties, torment or rifts. Don't like the game mode, nobody is forcing you to play it.
06/21/2014 05:55 PMPosted by Dogf
06/21/2014 02:16 PMPosted by Orrion
And, seriously, come on. Leveling a new character is basically all you need to do if you want to have a shot at those new items before they fold over, and leveling isn't exactly difficult.

So if "leveling isn't exactly difficult", how does it merit exclusive new loot? Answer: it doesn't.


The merits don't matter. Bottom line is that Blizzard wants people to play Seasons.

06/21/2014 06:25 PMPosted by Dogf
06/21/2014 05:08 PMPosted by Caballero
if 2 players joined the same day seasons were implemented, and neither person had a single friend already playing, then I would think they should BOTH start with a ladder character. I mean, why wouldn't they?

Exactly, why wouldn't they? While a season is running, non-season becomes an inferior and pointless mode. That's what those of us who don't want to play seasons are complaining about.


That scenario only works for the season they join in, and is pretty darned irrelevant. Are you one of those players? No. Do you care about those players? No.

It's like power leveling. 2 players play the game. One has a friend, one doesn't. The one with a friend reaches 70 more quickly and easily. Does that matter? No. Or forget power leveling. I start a character tomorrow, and someone else buys the game and starts a character tomorrow. I'll reach 70 more quickly. Does that matter? No.

So why the heck would you think this suddenly matters?

06/21/2014 05:57 PMPosted by Dogf
06/21/2014 02:17 PMPosted by Kelthar
And no, Seasons exclusive loot does not force you to play seasons any more than regular loot forces you to buy the game if you don't like it.

Of course it does. Regular loot is an intrinsic reward of the game, in that only people actually interested in playing Diablo care about it. Season-exclusive loot is an extrinsic reward, in that people who don't play seasons care about it too.


That's the whole point the Seasonal loot exists - to entice people who are either on the fence or who otherwise wouldn't play Seasons to participate in Seasons.

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